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Post by 24andcounting on Jan 9, 2015 22:06:17 GMT -5
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Post by CentreHice on Jan 10, 2015 1:20:10 GMT -5
It's the same EVERY TIME!
The commentators and crowd are all excited when the fight starts...."Oh boy...here we go...."
Then after somebody like Tinordi gets knocked out and there's blood....it's, "Oh no....oh my....well, this is terrible. You don't like to see this...."
What do people expect to see when players deliberately punch each other in the head?
I understand if somebody's had enough of being whacked, hacked, etc. and he takes matters into his own hands. But if the IIHF can deal with fighting and control it...then so can the NHL and its feeder/minor leagues.
Tinordi needs dental work....either from a punch or when his face hit the ice. And who knows about a concussion that may affect him for the rest of his life. Needless...especially the staged fights, as this one was.
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Post by jkr on Jan 10, 2015 7:48:34 GMT -5
If he was knocked out then he's had a concussion. Who knows how long before he's back.
Could be a real setback. These staged fights are ridiculous. What do they prove? Tinordi is probably the number one prospect on the Bulldogs & he's now done indefinitely thanks to this circus.Some good comments under the story about staged fighting & also about how you manage prospects. I think this is a failing on Lefebvre's part. We all liked it a couple of weeks ago when Tinordi destroyed some guy in a fight. But this is the problem - when you continue to engage in this - your only one punch away from oblivion. Pedan is only 21 but has never played in the NHL & if you look at his stats it's clear he is on his team just to punch people. Wonder why he was in the starting lineup last night?
Wouldn't advance scouting warn the Dogs about this guy? Why wouldn't Lefebvre have Nevins or Crisp on the ice instead? Bergevin shoud be on the phone screaming at Lefebvre.
If they need a D man who do they call up now?
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Post by seventeen on Jan 10, 2015 10:51:52 GMT -5
I'm blaming management on this one, if it was a staged fight. The guy he fought is a nobody. Tinordi has proved he'll stand up for teammates. Ergo, what is the point of having him, or anyone on the team for that matter, take part in one of those stupid, cherry-esque fights? Why not tell Tinordi to continue to defend teammates, but not get involved in that crap? Stupid, stupid coaching. And he has a reputation for developing young players? That's the biggest scam of all.
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Post by Skilly on Jan 10, 2015 11:45:08 GMT -5
If he was knocked out then he's had a concussion. Who knows how long before he's back. Could be a real setback. These staged fights are ridiculous. What do they prove? Tinordi is probably the number one prospect on the Bulldogs & he's now done indefinitely thanks to this circus.Some good comments under the story about staged fighting & also about how you manage prospects. I think this is a failing on Lefebvre's part. We all liked it a couple of weeks ago when Tinordi destroyed some guy in a fight. But this is the problem - when you continue to engage in this - your only one punch away from oblivion. Pedan is only 21 but has never played in the NHL & if you look at his stats it's clear he is on his team just to punch people. Wonder why he was in the starting lineup last night? Wouldn't advance scouting warn the Dogs about this guy? Why wouldn't Lefebvre have Nevins or Crisp on the ice instead? Bergevin shoud be on the phone screaming at Lefebvre. If they need a D man who do they call up now? I'm blaming management on this too, but not because it's a staged fight. I'm blaming Bergevin, not Lefebvre, because Tinordi should not have been in the AHL in the first place. It's clear to me that Tinordi was sent down to work on the physical nature of his game. He has had 3 fights the last three weeks, which includes a holiday break. While Tinordi could be used as a deterrent at the NHL level, it's not really something he should be concentrating on. IMO, his game was just as good or better than half the defense on the roster. He could have easily learned when to pick his spots for bone crunching hits at the NHL level.
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Post by Disp on Jan 10, 2015 12:31:53 GMT -5
Ouch, he got popped hard.
I don't blame anybody. It's the culture of the game. It's too bad and I hope he's not out long.
Could have happened if he was up with the habs too.
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Post by CentreHice on Jan 10, 2015 12:34:49 GMT -5
Agree guys…. If I didn't have doubts about Lefebvre, I do now. Seeing as it was the 3rd fight in recent weeks, Bergevin should've been on the phone saying, "Tinner is our #1 prospect….so no staged fights, Sylvain! We don't want some career minor-league goon to ruin his future." Or maybe we just don't understand hockey, eh?
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Post by CentreHice on Jan 10, 2015 12:38:04 GMT -5
I don't blame anybody. It's the culture of the game. I can blame the NHL for allowing that culture. The IIHF doesn't allow it. Could have happened if he was up with the habs too. Yep…because the culture is there.
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Post by Disp on Jan 10, 2015 13:29:31 GMT -5
Yeah, and if he popped Lucy or Chara like that we'd all cheer.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jan 10, 2015 13:41:36 GMT -5
Will be interesting to see how he recovers from this ... his health is the no.1 priority ... I really hope it doesn't affect his career ... it's easy to say that he'd get right back into it, but it's not that easy ... best of luck to young Jared ... here's to a complete recovery both health and career wise ...
Cheers.
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Post by jkr on Jan 10, 2015 16:05:50 GMT -5
Agree guys…. If I didn't have doubts about Lefebvre, I do now. Seeing as it was the 3rd fight in recent weeks, Bergevin should've been on the phone saying, "Tinner is our #1 prospect….so no staged fights, Sylvain! We don't want some career minor-league goon to ruin his future." Or maybe we just don't understand hockey, eh? IMO this was clearly a case of a goon taking out a starting D man. Should of been obvious when his name was in the starting lineup.
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Post by GNick99 on Jan 10, 2015 17:05:15 GMT -5
Hope it doesn't destroy his career like it did Komisarek's
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Post by CentreHice on Jan 11, 2015 4:04:36 GMT -5
Yeah, and if he popped Lucy or Chara like that we'd all cheer. Most likely. I'd add that if Lucy or Chara played for the Habs, we'd find a way to apologize/cheer for them, especially if they helped bring us a Cup. Players come and go....it's the success of the franchise/crest we cheer for.
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Post by BadCompany on Jan 12, 2015 9:40:05 GMT -5
I don't think you can pin this on Lefebvre. Unless he specifically told Tinordi to go out there and fight Pedan, which in the post-Bertuzzi/Moore era seems pretty unlikely. Instead, Lefebvre simply rolled out his regular line. I didn't see the game, but looking at the fight video I see Tinordi out there were Paetryn, which is probably the Dogs number one defensive unit, and with Hudon, Hensick and Dumont, which looks like their number one line. On the other side the Comets also had a regular line out there, which includes Pedan. Like I said I didn't see the game, and I certainly don't follow the Comets, but from a statistical perspective I don't think Pedan is merely a one-trick goon. Yes, he fights a lot, but he also takes a regular shift. He has seven points in 21 games, and 31 shots on net in those 21 games. In 25 games Tinordi has three points, and 27 shots on goal, so Pedan is actually better than him in both categories. I haven't done the research, but I don't think you average over a shot-per-game if your only job is go to out and fight for three minutes a game. On the radio they are making much out of the fact that Pedan spent some time in the ECHL, which is true, but by "time" we're talking six games, in which he still got three points (and yes, a lot of fights). Pedan is 21 years old, and a recent 3rd round pick (actually the 2nd pick in the third round - he was a borderline second rounder). He is not, as they said on the radio, some journey-man goon.
Clearly this was a staged fight, but I think it's all on Tinordi. I don't think Lefebvre looked on the ice, saw Pedan, and then thought to himself "oh it's fight time, I'd better send Tinordi out there". Pedan took his regular shift, Lefebvre put his regular guys out there, and for some reason Tinordi and Pedan decided to settle some score between themselves. Don't know why, but I think it's all on Tinordi.
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Post by seventeen on Jan 12, 2015 11:54:21 GMT -5
My only question would be, "was it a staged fight?" If so, why do you have a top prospect engaging themselves in that kind of crap. It's like they learned nothing from the Parros incident last year when he hit his head on the ice. Has Tinordi shown himself to be a shrinking violet? No. It seems he's been told he has to be tougher and more intimidating because he's certainly fought more and I've read a few articles that suggest that. It's stupid and may be the end of his career. Yes, I pin it on Lefebvre, because he's not shown anything to indicate he has enough grey cells to be a professional hockey coach and it's totally consistent with that approach. The game is going away from that stuff and we're still fighting the last war. I hate stupidity and this reeks of it.
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Post by CentreHice on Jan 12, 2015 12:09:35 GMT -5
Just got an update on my phone.
Tinordi diagnosed with concussion.
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Post by franko on Jan 12, 2015 12:33:54 GMT -5
Just got an update on my phone. Tinordi diagnosed with concussion. not a surprise.
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Post by Gogie on Jan 12, 2015 16:49:46 GMT -5
The question that has been bugging me about all of this is where were the linesman when Tinordi and Pedan were circling around before they engaged. In the NHL the linesmen are instructed to intervene before the fight even starts if they can do so safely. Seems to me when two idiots (yes, I consider Tinordi an idiot for partaking) are circling around it's an easy job for the linesmen to get in front of each player before anything develops.
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Post by Disp on Jan 12, 2015 19:08:49 GMT -5
The only time we want the linesmen jumping in is after the fact when someone gets hurt. It's a Monday morning quarterback thing. 90% of hockey fans like a good tilt. Woulda shoulda coulda. 2 big boys wanted to go, the fans like it, they went. Unfortunately someone got hurt. Until they ban fighting, it's going to happen.
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Post by stoat on Jan 12, 2015 20:56:43 GMT -5
The Habs and their fans shouldn't count on seeing Jarred Tinordi as a regular (or even as a reserve). I don't say that because of the concussion. I just don't think he's a very good hockey player and the Habs have other prospects. Beauiieu has separated himself from Tinordi by at least a mile.
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jan 16, 2015 17:16:44 GMT -5
Sounds like Tinner is back in the lineup tonight.
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