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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jan 6, 2016 19:03:34 GMT -5
Was listening to TSN690 on the way home and they suggested not moving the coach out until the GM gives him a decent roster to coach with ... I'm glad I heard that ... gave me another perspective ... Cheers. Dis, that is a fair counter perspective to the easy "fire the coach" philosophy that always emerges in cases like this. I think there is another scenario that has been chatted about here quite frequently and needs to be thrown into the mix too...how about proper use of the personnel given to a coach. Eliminate continually trying to fit square pegs (offensive, smaller, skilled guys) into a round hole (grinder, chip off the boards game). If you have a stud potential number one centre, use him in that position, let him make mistakes, but keep giving the ice time and support him to grow into that position. When applying merit to ice time, apply it consistently (don't continue to dish out head scratching anomalies creating the perception - or reality - of playing favourites). Allow rookies to make mistakes and not get benched, be healthy scratches or be demoted to the AHL. Develop young players not named Gallagher, and honestly his work ethic has been the biggest contributor to his development to date. Don't throw free agents under the bus and expect offensive players (even of the extremely faded variety) to suddenly be effective with four line ice time and grinding/energy roles. That last one is a shared GM-coach thing as the GM has to pick the right guys, but again my theme is about optimizing what you have before you scream for more. Despite the winning record since the Berg and MT have taken over, I still think this team and its personnel have not been used to its full potential. I would be at the front of the line asking for another top line winger/scorer (we don't need another "filler" on those top two lines). But I would like to see up optimizing the lineup we have now first. As much as I hear Berg always saying that he and his coach are on the same page, I keep seeing examples that appear to this distant outsider that fly in the face of that claim. The main ways to optimize existing lineups are through personnel usage and style of play/systems (once you have line juggled to death and auditioned callups galore). This is a team built for the open ice not for the boards. This is a team built for having possession of the puck more, not always chasing it or giving it away too easily. It is extremely difficult to maintain a long season of constantly being in pursuit of the puck when you are typically facing bigger lineups. I think we saw the effect of all of this in December and last night. As much as I think get a new coach thing is an "easy" solution, so is just ask for better players. What team does not try to do that and look how many real impactful deals are really made in the NHL these days. Milbury and Gainey are gone and even Garth Snow has wizened up. I am sure that last night's flight home was no fun for either Therrien or Bergevin. And I guarantee that Geoff Molson is taking this all in. I can appreciate all of that, buds, but I'm trying to consider all of the opinions I've either heard or read ... right now their biggest problem (IMO) is the lack of compete level ... I thought Pacioretty looked disinterested, but he's actually got 2G and 3A over the last four games ... according to Melnick, Subban may only have the one goal on the season, but he's been very solid in the back end ... he went onto say, imagine where this club would be right now if he were out of the lineup too ... Melnick's show actually gave me a few more things to consider ... Cheers.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jan 6, 2016 19:05:58 GMT -5
What did Red Fischer always say ....show me the players ....coaching aside we need more. I do remember this, yes ... he could be the Habs' toughest critic ... Cheers.
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Post by blny on Jan 6, 2016 19:10:41 GMT -5
It's hard to score when you don't shoot. I'm not saying that as a slight to PK. I don't see him shooting as much, and especially on the PP. He's still lugging the puck, and creating chances for his forwards.
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jan 6, 2016 19:12:30 GMT -5
Dis, not sure what is holding back the compete level of too many of the "stars". As outsiders we can only speculate on players, coaches, some combo or something else entirely. I would love to see this lineup maximize its full potential before just throwing new guys and not fix what is holding the team back. I only hope that Berg is close enough to know what needs fixing and how to do it. And I really hope the next move is solving the real problem, not just throwing a coach and/or players under the bus to provide a short term temporary fix. I want my real team back again...and not just for an outdoor spectacle.
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Post by seventeen on Jan 6, 2016 19:15:15 GMT -5
What did Red Fischer always say ....show me the players ....coaching aside we need more. HFTO If you want to win the Cup, yes, you need the player talent. But you can also have the talent and have it wasted by poor coaching. We've seen some line-ups through the years that in hindsight would make one quiver at the thought of having to coach those guys to a playoff spot. Is this team in that category? I'd say not. There is a all world goalie, a Norris winner and a number of decent players and some good players. I'd put them somewhere between our dynasty teams and the ones that Vigneault had to coach in the early 2000's after Corey had run us into the ground. So definitely at team with more talent than one having to fight for a playoff spot. In fact, if Carey was healthy, we really should be fighting for a top 5 finish in the East.
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Post by drkcloud on Jan 6, 2016 20:27:01 GMT -5
I hated to see Gallant leave and he is certainly getting good results in Florida. No one else out there really interests me
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Post by Anardil1 on Jan 6, 2016 21:36:32 GMT -5
Any interim coach will do. Try an anglo as an interim and the media can't say much as it is desperate times and any port in the storm. If the interim does well then hire him/her permanently and the media can pound sand. But please get rid of MT. He is not only throwing away the season, he has and is damaging good young players, perhaps permanently. The media can't say much? Did you already forget the Cunneyworth fiasco? I, like most put a priority on winning, not language. However, the reality is that language is an important part of most equations in Habsland. Slim pickings indeed. So taking these factors into consideration, I believe that the best available Franco coach with NHL experience is Boucher.
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Post by habsorbed on Jan 6, 2016 23:40:52 GMT -5
Any interim coach will do. Try an anglo as an interim and the media can't say much as it is desperate times and any port in the storm. If the interim does well then hire him/her permanently and the media can pound sand. But please get rid of MT. He is not only throwing away the season, he has and is damaging good young players, perhaps permanently. The media can't say much? Did you already forget the Cunneyworth fiasco? I, like most put a priority on winning, not language. However, the reality is that language is an important part of most equations in Habsland. Slim pickings indeed. So taking these factors into consideration, I believe that the best available Franco coach with NHL experience is Boucher. And where did the Cunnyworth fiasco lead us? I want the best coach available. "Franco" should not be a consideration. Who's fooling who here? DD is our only franco player. If I'm a nationalist that would really irk me. Ironically, the Habs have more anglo Quebecois players than franco. But guess what? It's a new world. Habs should be hiring on merit and merit alone. Unless Molson and management went to the Donald Trump school of equal opportunity. Good news is our franco coach now has a .667 win percentage for 2016. Should sign him to an extension!
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Post by seventeen on Jan 7, 2016 0:54:49 GMT -5
I have hopes for Charles Hudon.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jan 7, 2016 7:52:16 GMT -5
Dis, not sure what is holding back the compete level of too many of the "stars". As outsiders we can only speculate on players, coaches, some combo or something else entirely. I would love to see this lineup maximize its full potential before just throwing new guys and not fix what is holding the team back. I only hope that Berg is close enough to know what needs fixing and how to do it. And I really hope the next move is solving the real problem, not just throwing a coach and/or players under the bus to provide a short term temporary fix. I want my real team back again...and not just for an outdoor spectacle. Well, I'm having a hard time figuring out what I heard on the radio this morning ... according to the TSN690 crew Michel Therrien said that Alexei Emelin has been playing the last few weeks on a broken foot ... why he'd keep him in the lineup with Greg Pateryn and Jared Tinordi waiting to go is beyond me ... Barberio looks good in the lineup, but I'm rather disappointed in the way Pateryn has been handled by the club ... he contributes more than Elemin despite that game-deciding gaff he made a few games back notwithstanding ... hate to see him leave only to excel elsewhere ... Cheers.
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Post by Tankdriver on Jan 7, 2016 10:00:04 GMT -5
I think it sucks what we are doing with our defencemen. No way should Pateryn and Tinordi be sitting this long. You got to play them sometime, or you got to trade them. They become diminishing assets.
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Post by UberCranky on Jan 7, 2016 11:04:20 GMT -5
So we play a guy with a broken foot but leave two aging prospects to rot.
Why would i not be suprised if they demand to be traded? Or is slavery back in fashion?
*sigh*
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Post by seventeen on Jan 7, 2016 11:47:05 GMT -5
Yes, that bit about Emelin has the usual puzzling Therrien stamp on it. Emelin has been pretty bad and only looked better in this past week since being paired with Barberio, so perhaps his foot is healed now. It is very odd that Therrien felt neither Pateryn or Tinordi would be better. I can sort of understand Tinordi, because he has not impressed when dressed, but Pateryn has looked very capable and would certainly have done better than Emelin did during that stretch. Once again, one wonders what the coach is possible thinking. He riaks one player's health and holds back the development of others. How would you react if you're a player on his team?
a) I'd go through a brick wall for you coach b) I'd go through a wiffle wall for you coach.
Therrien is giving himself self inflicted wounds. Unless Pateryn had an amputated leg and terminal acne, I don't get that decision.
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Post by blny on Jan 7, 2016 12:08:01 GMT -5
Emelin seems to play his best against Boston. Maybe they could hire a hypnotist and make him believe he's playing them every game.
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Post by seventeen on Jan 7, 2016 14:12:09 GMT -5
Paint some bruin sweaters on his eyes.
That might be a problem in practicee.
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Post by PTH on Jan 10, 2016 12:21:07 GMT -5
Quenneville is impossible dream. Lefebvre is too scary to contemplate. I would be okay with Boucher if he would arrange smart, respected assistant like Robinson. BTW: Quenneville only has a French-sounding name and doesn't speak a word of French, so it's kind of pointless considering him as coach. It would be Boucher, Lefebvre or a guy currently working as an assistant or in the QMJHL. Jacques Martin ? Seems early to bring him back.
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Post by folatre on Jan 10, 2016 16:32:43 GMT -5
Yes, my error. I thought Quenneville was Franco-Ontarian acceptably bilingual.
Ethnicity and language are not always obvious. My grandfather is French, born in France, but I speak French poorly, as a third language.
I understand the issue as it pertains to the Montreal Canadiens. But it concerns me that other clubs gain competitive advantage.
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Post by seventeen on Jan 11, 2016 0:58:28 GMT -5
We are 2 points from being out of a playoff spot.
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Post by seventeen on Jan 11, 2016 1:01:38 GMT -5
Yes, my error. I thought Quenneville was Franco-Ontarian acceptably bilingual. Ethnicity and language are not always obvious. My grandfather is French, born in France, but I speak French poorly, as a third language. I understand the issue as it pertains to the Montreal Canadiens. But it concerns me that other clubs gain competitive advantage. There are good bilingual coaches. Vigneault, Julien and Hartley come to mind. Boucher may be and there are coaches in the Q with potential. The universe of applicants is smaller than for other teams, though.
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Post by Anardil1 on Jan 25, 2016 22:10:41 GMT -5
The media can't say much? Did you already forget the Cunneyworth fiasco? I, like most put a priority on winning, not language. However, the reality is that language is an important part of most equations in Habsland. Slim pickings indeed. So taking these factors into consideration, I believe that the best available Franco coach with NHL experience is Boucher. And where did the Cunnyworth fiasco lead us? I want the best coach available. "Franco" should not be a consideration. Who's fooling who here? DD is our only franco player. If I'm a nationalist that would really irk me. Ironically, the Habs have more anglo Quebecois players than franco. But guess what? It's a new world. Habs should be hiring on merit and merit alone. Unless Molson and management went to the Donald Trump school of equal opportunity. Good news is our franco coach now has a .667 win percentage for 2016. Should sign him to an extension! I also want the best available staff representing the most illustrious NHL franchise. If a Martian landed in front of the Bell Centre with a foolproof solution to getting the Habs back to where they are supposed to be, I want him to be the GM. If he chooses Mr. Wang from Hong Kong as coach, an he chooses Mrs. Smith as and assistant, and her cat Mr. Whiskers to run the power play...to hell with the media and 'fans' who cry about french representation. The bottom line used to be just about winning. When did it change?
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Post by Skilly on Jan 25, 2016 23:48:39 GMT -5
And where did the Cunnyworth fiasco lead us? I want the best coach available. "Franco" should not be a consideration. Who's fooling who here? DD is our only franco player. If I'm a nationalist that would really irk me. Ironically, the Habs have more anglo Quebecois players than franco. But guess what? It's a new world. Habs should be hiring on merit and merit alone. Unless Molson and management went to the Donald Trump school of equal opportunity. Good news is our franco coach now has a .667 win percentage for 2016. Should sign him to an extension! I also want the best available staff representing the most illustrious NHL franchise. If a Martian landed in front of the Bell Centre with a foolproof solution to getting the Habs back to where they are supposed to be, I want him to be the GM. If he chooses Mr. Wang from Hong Kong as coach, an he chooses Mrs. Smith as and assistant, and her cat Mr. Whiskers to run the power play...to hell with the media and 'fans' who cry about french representation. The bottom line used to be just about winning. When did it change? Fun fact: Desharnais was getting about 12-13 minutes ice-time when we went 9-0. Game 10 it goes up to over 17 minutes. Sometimes it isn't that we are winning .... As Lebron says
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Post by Tankdriver on Jan 26, 2016 9:31:56 GMT -5
I also want the best available staff representing the most illustrious NHL franchise. If a Martian landed in front of the Bell Centre with a foolproof solution to getting the Habs back to where they are supposed to be, I want him to be the GM. If he chooses Mr. Wang from Hong Kong as coach, an he chooses Mrs. Smith as and assistant, and her cat Mr. Whiskers to run the power play...to hell with the media and 'fans' who cry about french representation. The bottom line used to be just about winning. When did it change? Fun fact: Desharnais was getting about 12-13 minutes ice-time when we went 9-0. Game 10 it goes up to over 17 minutes. Sometimes it isn't that we are winning .... As Lebron says Nice research find. You should tweet that stat to Molson, Bergevin and anyone else on the Habs coaching staff.
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