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Post by The New Guy on Dec 11, 2002 12:27:31 GMT -5
Agreed - 5% is a very modest estimate of the interest GG would aquire investing in anything. I simply used it because it's a nice number and easy to work with. But that's besides the point...
By all reports, it's to pay off some of his other debts that he incurred buying the team. Not a high risk buyout (also note: has anyone noticed if any of GG'd investments are 'high risk'. Ski resorts in are not a usual investment, but general I think you could regard them as safe. Meat packing is... well meat packing. We're not talking about buying some dotcom startup here). Which means it makes us money. In the end at least.
Has anyone ever told you you're a bit of an alarmist?
Look at it this way. No matter what GG does, provided it's not some poorly built house of cards that he's leaning on, it's going to increase the money availible to the team.
That's a good thing...
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Post by UberCranky on Dec 11, 2002 20:15:29 GMT -5
HA, I would love to hear how you came up with this, that GG is a high risk taker. Montreal: Ski resorts = High risk. Ski resorts are considered high risk investments due to weather variations and the high susceptibility to economic down turns. Ski resorts + Marginal financing = Gambling What happens if you have two years of warm weather? You have to go to the bank for more money to keep afloat. Meat Packing plants are safe investments. This is the type of business that is immune to economic downturns and inflationary pressure. Everybody has to eat. However, meat packing has a low return on investment and if they are supplying major customers (McCrappy) then their margins are razor thin. Further, one bacterial outbreak and the business is on the rocks. To complicate everything, the bank is involved and has a say in any major move that could affect and risk their loan. It gets a lot “hairier” then this if you start to consider the tax aspects of this. I will fall dead asleep on the keyboard way before I can explain all the variations and machinations. *nods off* Hey Montreal, don't they teach the "Get Rich NOW" schemes in University? What's a Financial Degree without the intricate “no money down” financing of today’s business world. Things must of changed since I learned the Three Card Monte Financing in University…..or did I learn that from Gino “the Lender” Lupe. TNG: I am very conservative in my business investments. Further, I distrust anything that I read in the papers. I always look for the "why?". When I read about the 70 million, my mind immediately attached GG with raising capital for outside investments. It was not a great leap see that he is using Hab’s future income to do “other” projects. Others look at percentages, I look at “why”. Shoot me.
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Post by montreal on Dec 11, 2002 20:25:05 GMT -5
HA, sorry but thats a bit of a strech IMO. First ski resorts can make their own snow, so warm weather isn't a major factor. Also with the meat packing plant, thats why you have insurance, no big deal at all, same with the ski resorts. Now about the naming rights, well that's his money not the Habs. He owns the Bell center 100%, so anything he does with that money is up to him. He got 100M for the deal, but that doesn't mean the money goes to better the Habs team. Not saying what GG has in mind, cause I don't know, but I don't see this as GG selling the Habs future for now. I myself am worried as to why he would do something like this, as he must have a important reason to do something like this, and whatever it is, I hope it works out for him. I don't know if this was posted yet, but here's a story on GG and the Habs finances. www.cyberpresse.ca/reseau/sports/0212/spo_102120166546.htmlHe says all is fine. I hope so.
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Post by UberCranky on Dec 11, 2002 20:30:59 GMT -5
You are right. I forgot that he owned 100% of the building. Still, there is the bank to deal with.
As for the ski resort investment and meat packing, I wrote it as I know it. Seventeen is a banker, maybe he can chime in as to the "risk" of his investments.
P.S. I tried to rob his bank once, but he said he only had Canadian Dollars so I just walked away.
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Post by seventeen on Dec 11, 2002 20:49:55 GMT -5
Ski resorts I know nothing about. I don't ski, I've never seen a financing package for one, though you could probably google a risk profile for them somewhere. That's my caveat emptor.....now for my 'opinion'. It's in a high risk area - tourism, leisure. And yes, you can indeed manufacture your own snow, but Mother Nature does it much more cheaply, so the bad weather risk becomes the margin risk.
Why are we talking about this guys? HA and I think GG's a dice roller and fear hewill eventually be the wrack and ruin of the Habs, while most of the rest don't feel that way or could care less. So nothing is going to get resolved and we'll only question each other for enough pages to threaten the Chris Dyment record. So to avoid that....hey anyone watching the Rangers/Hawks game tonight will notice 2 things. Dvorak looks pretty good, fast, strong and creative. Blackburn looks tired and weak, two soft goals. Hmmmm.. the thot plickens.
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 11, 2002 20:53:58 GMT -5
17, do we share a brain ;D
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Post by habwest on Dec 11, 2002 21:32:22 GMT -5
Hmmm, "shoot me", enh HA. Well, OK HA, stand over by that wall. No not that one, the one over there with all the bullet holes in it. Our boys aren't very good shots so you still got a chance. Maybe they'll be distracted by another trade rumour, or get indigestion listening to all this financial stuff, bend over in cramps and shoot themselves in the foot. You wondering if anyone from the Habs coaching staff is on the firing squad? They are the firing squad! MT is the one on your right, with the two bandeleros and the 26.381 gallon sombrero. With little velvet fringe balls hanging from the edge, just like in '50s cars. He has a velvet picture of Elvis in his apartment too. And the bad expensive suit with the terrible tie. Green is the hulk on your left. He don't have a gun. His job is to go over and strangle what's left after the boys get done firing their 20 rounds apiece. Oh, didn't tell you about that. Well, we like to be thorough and, besides, we might even get a hit. Green just has a bad unexpensive suit, sometimes not even that, just his trusty ol' camel hair jacket; must be able to catch a whiff of the pits on that mother from 20 paces by now. Gotta be tough on the boys on the bench. (Play better damn it or I'll wear the camel hair!)You gotta be nice to Green though, else he might bungle the strangulation and prolong it into next week. And AS is the commander of the squad. Yup he says ready, aim, count to 10 and .... Oh, he can't count to 10?? Well 5 will have to do. Don't worry, he'll get to 10 some day when he finally cuts that $10M contract for another trusty vet. You could appeal to GG, but Georgie isn't available. He's out scoping some meat plant in Australia where they plan on packaging up kangaroo and dingoo meat for the Chinese market. Why China- aw, they just like things that keep 'em hopping over there. Besides, it'll help 'em "jump" start their new wave economy. Ahem..... Georgie's gonna use his "refrigeration expertise" to get it there without spoiling. Ooyh, this is getting bad. Anyway you probably needn't worry. The wall you are standing in front of is probably the safest place around. The "Gang That Couldn't Shoot Straight" isn't likely to hit anything that they're supposed to. Oohh, from bad to worse. Better quit now. Go lay down until it wears off. If it does. Don't wanna think about that.
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Post by seventeen on Dec 11, 2002 22:36:00 GMT -5
And I thought Viper was going off the deep end. You ok HW? May I recommend putting some distance between you and those guys in the chartreuse micro-bus.
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Post by UberCranky on Dec 11, 2002 23:11:30 GMT -5
Hmmm, "shoot me", enh HA. Well, OK HA, stand over by that wall. No not that one, the one over there with all the bullet holes in it. Our boys aren't very good shots so you still got a chance. Maybe they'll be distracted by another trade rumour, or get indigestion listening to all this financial stuff, bend over in cramps and shoot themselves in the foot. You wondering if anyone from the Habs coaching staff is on the firing squad? They are the firing squad! MT is the one on your right, with the two bandeleros and the 26.381 gallon sombrero. With little velvet fringe balls hanging from the edge, just like in '50s cars. He has a velvet picture of Elvis in his apartment too. And the bad expensive suit with the terrible tie. Green is the hulk on your left. He don't have a gun. His job is to go over and strangle what's left after the boys get done firing their 20 rounds apiece. Oh, didn't tell you about that. Well, we like to be thorough and, besides, we might even get a hit. Green just has a bad unexpensive suit, sometimes not even that, just his trusty ol' camel hair jacket; must be able to catch a whiff of the pits on that mother from 20 paces by now. Gotta be tough on the boys on the bench. (Play better damn it or I'll wear the camel hair!)You gotta be nice to Green though, else he might bungle the strangulation and prolong it into next week. And AS is the commander of the squad. Yup he says ready, aim, count to 10 and .... Oh, he can't count to 10?? Well 5 will have to do. Don't worry, he'll get to 10 some day when he finally cuts that $10M contract for another trusty vet. You could appeal to GG, but Georgie isn't available. He's out scoping some meat plant in Australia where they plan on packaging up kangaroo and dingoo meat for the Chinese market. Why China- aw, they just like things that keep 'em hopping over there. Besides, it'll help 'em "jump" start their new wave economy. Ahem..... Georgie's gonna use his "refrigeration expertise" to get it there without spoiling. Ooyh, this is getting bad. Anyway you probably needn't worry. The wall you are standing in front of is probably the safest place around. The "Gang That Couldn't Shoot Straight" isn't likely to hit anything that they're supposed to. Oohh, from bad to worse. Better quit now. Go lay down until it wears off. If it does. Don't wanna think about that. WTF................. Things you MUST know. 1. Stay away from the little red pills, they are NOT jelly beans. 2. The TV is not the Squawk Box and do not hit it with your slippers. Especially if you are standing in your kiddie pool. 3. Foghorn Legporn is NOT a real person and do not attempt to talk like him….or walk like him. That’s a Seventeen exclusive. 4. Rocky and Bullwinkle were NOT normal. They are the Ambiguous Dou of the 70’s. 4b. Do not fall in love with Nastasha. She is pregnant. 4c. Boris IS BadCompany, that's why he knows about all these conspiracies. And for God's sake's, HabWest, please, PLEASE wear your aluminum beanie. The Cosmic Rays are playing havoc with your mind. Regards, your friend. Addicted
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Post by PTH on Dec 12, 2002 0:04:43 GMT -5
Now about the naming rights, well that's his money not the Habs. Of course, he owns the Habs, so it's all his. I just see it as separate bank accounts, he shouldn't be taking something from the Habs account and putting it to other uses. That's what worries me. He's not the long-term owner type, he's the buy low sell-high kinda guy - ie, the money he takes from the Habs might not be re-invested properly since he won't be the owner in 10 years.
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Post by montreal on Dec 12, 2002 0:18:31 GMT -5
Of course, he owns the Habs, so it's all his. I just see it as separate bank accounts, he shouldn't be taking something from the Habs account and putting it to other uses. That's what worries me. He's not the long-term owner type, he's the buy low sell-high kinda guy - ie, the money he takes from the Habs might not be re-invested properly since he won't be the owner in 10 years. No thats not right. GG owns 80 % of the team, but he owns 100% of the Bell center. Big difference. He is the majority owner of the Habs, but does not own them in completely. The Molson's have a say, as they are still Share Owners, and have voting rights, I beleive. So he can't just do whatever he wants with the Habs, but he can do whatever he wants with the Bell center, including charging for its naming rights, and selling that asset to a 3rd party.
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Post by The New Guy on Dec 12, 2002 1:03:28 GMT -5
I'll take your word for it, though I will express my doubts about your statement that they're high risk. What happens if you have a year or two of warm weather could just as easily be rephrased for a different situation as "What happens if our plant burns down tomorrow". Yes - the weather is an unpredictable variable, but as with life, business is full of them.
Once again - one fire or some other relatively uncontrollable disaster away from business problems. I will however, stipulate Meat Packing to being a low-return investment. Low risk. Low return. Such is the way things work. Otherwise I'd keep all my money in a sock under my bed (lowest risk).
Debt. Say it. It's a fact of life. We all live with depth. By the end of this year I will owe the government $25,000. How many people out there have mortgages on their houses? How many people, when they go out and buy a new car, plunk down the cash (or cheque, or if they have a really high credit limit, credit card). How many of us have debt on our credit card? Just about everyone owes someone money. Why? Because having money now opens up a significant amount of investing opportunities. You need money to make money (or so the saying goes).
I agree - it's always good to look at the why's. But it's also important to remember Occam's Razor. Usually, the solution with the fewest introduced variables is the correct one. That means more than likely he withdrew the money to put it against other debts. A simple transaction if there ever was one. One which cuts off a source of funds availible to us in the future in exchange for drastically cutting our intrest payments against another loan.
I still say it's a smart (if gutsy) deal. Money now is always better than money ten years down the road. Always.
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