Where Is Thatcher & Reagan When You Need Them?

[Disgruntled70sHab]

machabby said:

disgruntled70shab said:

The common "Muhammad-Q-citizen" only knows what their clerics tell them, or what they're taught in religious classes.


As far as suicide bombers go, you're bang on. However, those who flew the planes for 9/11 were highly educated Islamic idealists. They weren't stupid; far from it. But rather, brainwashed.

I don't agree with saying that they're brainwashed just because they have a different opinion than you, or because they are willing to die for it. I think it's important to recognize that there is, in fact, a difference of opinion, and not to dismiss people as "crazy" or "brainwashed." While there may be truth in it, it could be just as true of Americans serving in Iraq. To some extent we're all brainwashed in that we're constantly subjected to organized propaganda, but in the end, we all believe whatever we believe and we can only achieve peace by understanding each other.

I understand that, MacHabby. However, brainwashing isn't as simple as just having a different opinion than yours. It occurs on both sides, not just in Islam.

I believe in God, but I don't necessarily believe in Catholicism. Everyone has the right to practice their faith in what way they feel best for them. That's the way I see it.

However, trying to understand each other is easier said than done. IMHO, the world is not ready for the "I'd like to buy the world a coke" concept. To do that we have to drop the barriers, mostly fear and hatred, to the process.

The Buddhists and Amish seem to have it right. Unfortunately, there are too many fanatics on both sides to allow that to happen everywhere else.

Cheers.

[MC Habber]

disgruntled70shab said:

machabby said:

I don't agree with saying that they're brainwashed just because they have a different opinion than you, or because they are willing to die for it. I think it's important to recognize that there is, in fact, a difference of opinion, and not to dismiss people as "crazy" or "brainwashed." While there may be truth in it, it could be just as true of Americans serving in Iraq. To some extent we're all brainwashed in that we're constantly subjected to organized propaganda, but in the end, we all believe whatever we believe and we can only achieve peace by understanding each other.

I understand that, MacHabby. However, brainwashing isn't as simple as just having a different opinion than yours. It occurs on both sides, not just in Islam.

I believe in God, but I don't necessarily believe in Catholicism. Everyone has the right to practice their faith in what way they feel best for them. That's the way I see it.

However, trying to understand each other is easier said than done. IMHO, the world is not ready for the "I'd like to buy the world a coke" concept. To do that we have to drop the barriers, mostly fear and hatred, to the process.

The Buddhists and Amish seem to have it right. Unfortunately, there are too many fanatics on both sides to allow that to happen everywhere else.

Cheers.

I guess it's cyclical. Fear and hatred come from lack of understanding, and it's reinforced by a culture which paints all people of a certain group as fanatics, or evil, or what have you, and the culture is to some extent controlled by a small segment of society known as the media (at least in the Western world).

[MC Habber]

habsaddict said:

Robert Gates.

So, Gates has extended army tours in Iraq to 15 months - 3 months longer than the maximum length that is considered "safe" by the US military. "One of the best geo-tactician on the planet?" I guess we'll see.

[CentreHice]

machabby said:

and the culture is to some extent controlled by a small segment of society known as the media (at least in the Western world).

\

And who ultimately controls the media? A small segment with a lot of power and money....the corporate elite. And mainstream journalism has been reduced to boosterism and cheerleading.....propaganda machines.

Sure we're getting the truth about the Virginia Tech shootings.....but the Western news isn't even close on Iraq. We hear what those in power would like us to hear.