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Post by The New Guy on Aug 10, 2009 14:43:07 GMT -5
I know TNG feels Magnolia is an innocent sports goods salesmen / city tour but in reality I believe you have to get guys like that away from your organization and players because the chances of having your image tarnished by a guilty by association situation is very real. As was the case here. Again, to me, it's a question of control and last year it was clearly lacking as some players did get overboard. I sad nothing of the sort. I believe Mr. Magnolia has been found guilty of at least some crimes, and will do time for them. But you know something? Criminals that go around saying "I'm selling crack, you want some?" don't continue to be criminals very long. Especially when they are associated with the mafia. I think Magnolia presented himself like a sporting goods salesman (after all, he was indeed a sporting goods salesman) and used his money and personality to get close to the Kostitsyn's. Whether this was out of an honest interest in hockey or for nefarious purposes I will leave to your imagination. The bottom line is you don't always know exactly what those around you do, and criminals don't often announce that they are criminals. I've met former members of the IRA and rum runners and they're just like you and me for the most part. You wouldn't know that they were involved in anything untoward if you passed them on the street or met them in a bar. Now, do you want to limit your players contact with that type of "fan"? Certainly. But short of locking them in their houses in between practice and games this is not reasonable. The best you can hope for is to teach them how to watch out for people actively trying to involve you in their crime (which by all accounts Maginola was not attempting) and check in every once in awhile. It's a rough world out there, but it raises an interesting question - how well do you know the people you are friends with Doc? |
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Post by Doc Holliday on Aug 10, 2009 15:00:44 GMT -5
I know TNG feels Magnolia is an innocent sports goods salesmen / city tour but in reality I believe you have to get guys like that away from your organization and players because the chances of having your image tarnished by a guilty by association situation is very real. As was the case here. Again, to me, it's a question of control and last year it was clearly lacking as some players did get overboard. I sad nothing of the sort. I believe Mr. Magnolia has been found guilty of at least some crimes, and will do time for them. But you know something? Criminals that go around saying "I'm selling crack, you want some?" don't continue to be criminals very long. Especially when they are associated with the mafia. I think Magnolia presented himself like a sporting goods salesman (after all, he was indeed a sporting goods salesman) and used his money and personality to get close to the Kostitsyn's. Whether this was out of an honest interest in hockey or for nefarious purposes I will leave to your imagination. The bottom line is you don't always know exactly what those around you do, and criminals don't often announce that they are criminals. I've met former members of the IRA and rum runners and they're just like you and me for the most part. You wouldn't know that they were involved in anything untoward if you passed them on the street or met them in a bar. Now, do you want to limit your players contact with that type of "fan"? Certainly. But short of locking them in their houses in between practice and games this is not reasonable. The best you can hope for is to teach them how to watch out for people actively trying to involve you in their crime (which by all accounts Maginola was not attempting) and check in every once in awhile. It's a rough world out there, but it raises an interesting question - how well do you know the people you are friends with Doc? Quite frankly I don't think the Kosts were completely ignorant of who Magnolia is. Dave Moriseette said he knew who the guy was, as did some players on the team. Hammer himself said he discontinued his relation with the guy pretty quickly. I don't think the Kosts are criminals, but I don't think they're innocent as new born lambs either. IMO the guy was great at taking them around Montreal's exciting night life. After all that's exactly what he was, a guy who knows places, knows people and easily get you anything you want. So here you have 2 single young guys with tons of money and a friend that knows where to spend it to party. |
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Post by Gogie on Aug 10, 2009 15:06:17 GMT -5
I keep checking the "updates" to this thread and much to my chagrin they never have anything to do with Frolov. Perhaps someone could start a new thread on Frolov if any new news develops and perhaps a mod could rename this one to better reflect the direction it has taken.
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Post by cigarviper on Aug 10, 2009 19:42:07 GMT -5
Just remember this, if it's discussed in the media it ain't happening. You'll know it when it becomes reality, not before. Gainey's MO.
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Post by jkr on Aug 10, 2009 21:00:33 GMT -5
I keep checking the "updates" to this thread and much to my chagrin they never have anything to do with Frolov. Perhaps someone could start a new thread on Frolov if any new news develops and perhaps a mod could rename this one to better reflect the direction it has taken. Same here. I'm expecting news on Frolov & I get a resurrection of the La Presse debate.  |
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Post by CrocRob on Aug 10, 2009 22:38:45 GMT -5
I'm of two minds about this. First, conversations should be allowed to evolve, but I admit that the topic might be misleading when it comes to getting new information.
I dunno. What do people think? I kind of think that we should let it slide, and let conversations escape the narrow bounds a thread title permits. However others (and those in charge) might think differently.
(Sorry! No news on Frolov.)
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Post by seventeen on Aug 11, 2009 0:57:38 GMT -5
Yep, people are ALWAYS going to be judged by the company they keep..... .....it's why no-one ever comes to visit me.  You're forgetting Wanda. Oops, I mean Wanda Frolov. |
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Post by Doc Holliday on Aug 11, 2009 7:53:15 GMT -5
I keep checking the "updates" to this thread and much to my chagrin they never have anything to do with Frolov. Perhaps someone could start a new thread on Frolov if any new news develops and perhaps a mod could rename this one to better reflect the direction it has taken. Same here. I'm expecting news on Frolov & I get a resurrection of the La Presse debate. ...sometimes part of a post within a thread springs a different debate... I had the feeling this would end up like that when I first jumped in though... I must admit I'm one of the first that was getting frustrated when almost every posts were turning into a Ryder debate somehow, so I'll let go of this Kosts/LaPresse thing (for now  )... ...I think the driving force behind this rumor is obviously to reunite Cammy and Frolov as Frolov's best seasons were with him... Just like I'm hearing rumors of Elias right now to complete the Gomez/Gionta line... I still believe our weakness right now is at center and I'd much rather see us land a good 2nd line center than yet another winger... |
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Post by HFTO on Aug 11, 2009 8:23:10 GMT -5
No doubt centre is still the prime concern but, if the Frolov deal did come down the Habs do have the option of forgoing a big centre and slide Cams into his natural spot which is centre and live with size on our wings.
HFTO
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Post by Doc Holliday on Aug 11, 2009 8:42:27 GMT -5
No doubt centre is still the prime concern but, if the Frolov deal did come down the Habs do have the option of forgoing a big centre and slide Cams into his natural spot which is centre and live with size on our wings. HFTO I thought about that but I wonder how long it's been since Cammy actually did play center... If I'm not mistaken his first big season in LA actually happenned when he got put on the wing. |
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Post by The New Guy on Aug 11, 2009 9:31:32 GMT -5
Quite frankly I don't think the Kosts were completely ignorant of who Magnolia is. Dave Moriseette said he knew who the guy was, as did some players on the team. Hammer himself said he discontinued his relation with the guy pretty quickly. It's funny that Dave Moriseette knew who this guy was, and the Hammer knew who this guy was, but the RCMP had do a years long investigation to slap him with a handful of minor felony charges. Grabovsky, who has absolutely no reason to play nice (living in a city where the media is borderline sensible), said he had no idea Magnolia was a criminal. So maybe it's that Hamrlik just doesn't like to party with the same crowd as the Kostitsyn's (and Grabovsky) and Morisette is talking out of his ass. I don't think the Kosts are criminals, but I don't think they're innocent as new born lambs either. IMO the guy was great at taking them around Montreal's exciting night life. After all that's exactly what he was, a guy who knows places, knows people and easily get you anything you want. So here you have 2 single young guys with tons of money and a friend that knows where to spend it to party. And obviously you are free to believe this if you want. The problem is that you have absolutely no proof, and you continue to phrase stuff in such away as to convey an unspoken message (notice how you put italics around anything, to imply that anything probably includes illicit material). I can't call you for lying, because you're not lying - you're just expressing your belief (and frankly, you're not a journalist in so far as I know, so you have a lot more leeway in what you say and believe IMHO). However you have no facts to back up your opinion, only the innuendo of the Montreal sports media. AND NOW FOR SOMETHING COMPLETELY DIFFERENT: No doubt centre is still the prime concern but, if the Frolov deal did come down the Habs do have the option of forgoing a big centre and slide Cams into his natural spot which is centre and live with size on our wings. HFTO I don't think Cams has played centre in a long, long time and I don't think he was terribly good at it when he did play pivot. If we lost the Kostitsyn's in a trade though it would make it interesting. Frolov - Gomez - Gionta Latendresse - Cammi - Pacioretty Plekanec - Lapierre - Moen Stewart - Metropolit/Chipchura - Laraque |
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Post by HFTO on Aug 11, 2009 12:03:59 GMT -5
Ideally I like him on the wing as well we want him shooting but it is an option should Gainey fall on another plan B.
HFTO
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Aug 13, 2009 10:59:33 GMT -5
Ideally I like him on the wing as well we want him shooting but it is an option should Gainey fall on another plan B. HFTO We have been screaming for our wingers not named Higgins to shoot more for ages...in Cammy and Gionta we have guys who will shoot, and that's good. Hopefully AK can take lessons and unleash that wrister/snap shot more too now that he does not have L'Artiste to defer to all shift. I like Cammy on the wing too, especially with two talented playmakers like Gomez and Pleky. |
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Post by jkr on Aug 13, 2009 11:25:33 GMT -5
I'm of two minds about this. First, conversations should be allowed to evolve, but I admit that the topic might be misleading when it comes to getting new information. I dunno. What do people think? I kind of think that we should let it slide, and let conversations escape the narrow bounds a thread title permits. However others (and those in charge) might think differently. (Sorry! No news on Frolov.) Not a huge deal to me. I realize threads can be like conversations - they can lead to places quite different from the original thoughts. I'll consult Eklund for Frolov info.  |
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Post by Skilly on Aug 18, 2009 12:53:19 GMT -5
Just a clarification on SKosty's demotion to Hamilton last year. He was sent down before the "story" broke....not after. Wasn't this after the other deeply disturbing allegation involving the Kosty's (one that bugged me way more than the Mangiolo story) .... that someone (allegedly a Kosty) threatened Kovalev. |
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Post by HFTO on Aug 18, 2009 19:47:12 GMT -5
what was the story with the threat on Kovalev did he speak up about the Tit brothers company they were keeping?
HFTO
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Post by ValkyrieNS on Aug 18, 2009 20:32:44 GMT -5
what was the story with the threat on Kovalev did he speak up about the Tit brothers company they were keeping? HFTO IIRC, Kovi told the Kostys to stop hanging out with Mangiola/Magnolia/Manguy... or he would go to management and one of the K's told him to MYOB or [insert potential nasty threat to his family here]. If this is indeed what happened, I think Kovi did go to BG, who then gave him a couple of days off [to tend to family matters, IMHO] and that was about it. BUT, I could be remembering all this incorrectly, so take my take on it with a grain of salt... |
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Post by Cranky on Aug 18, 2009 22:30:00 GMT -5
I refuse to believe any rumours on Kovalev that I didn't start.
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Post by Skilly on Aug 19, 2009 21:46:03 GMT -5
what was the story with the threat on Kovalev did he speak up about the Tit brothers company they were keeping? HFTO IIRC, Kovi told the Kostys to stop hanging out with Mangiola/Magnolia/Manguy... or he would go to management and one of the K's told him to MYOB or [insert potential nasty threat to his family here]. If this is indeed what happened, I think Kovi did go to BG, who then gave him a couple of days off [to tend to family matters, IMHO] and that was about it. BUT, I could be remembering all this incorrectly, so take my take on it with a grain of salt... and S.Kosty was demoted ... indirectly because of the Mangiola foolishness |
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