|
|
Post by franko on Apr 27, 2010 20:09:57 GMT -5
OK . . . it's been a couple of years, technology has changed, prices have come down, and I have less than 24 hours to research and buy.
Looking at 40-42 inch set.
Could care less [or not ;D] about Blu-ray.
Want to enjoy a hockey game [winning would make the enjoyment soooo much better.
So: 780p Plasma or 1080p LCD?
|
|
|
|
Post by cigarviper on Apr 27, 2010 20:40:35 GMT -5
1080P LCD.
|
|
|
|
Post by Skilly on Apr 27, 2010 21:46:14 GMT -5
I'm currently shopping for a new TV too franko ... just remodelled our family room, and we are going to put a TV in there now. We resisted it for awhile because the kids would be glued to it, instead of making crafts, colouring, going outside, etc. The rec room has a Sony Vega Trinitron, but the girls dont like going downstairs alone .
I've been told, and I have no idea if it is true, that the type of TV depends on the room. The sales people tell me if the room is downstairs/darker you should go with plasma, if the room is upstairs where it is presumably a little brighter, LCD is the way to go.
I've made up mind that I am going with LCD, even though the cost of the plasmas is very enticing. Seen a 46 inch Plasma for $599 the other day (I could have sworn that was the price, but didnt really look, since I am going with LCD). My question now, is what brand names are good? And does it really matter? I'm thinking Samsung or Sharp. (The Sony's are still pretty hefty in price relative to them)
|
|
|
|
Post by franko on Apr 27, 2010 22:03:51 GMT -5
First, I guess its 720 not 780.
I too have been told that the room [brightness] makes a big difference.
Plasma has a "stronger" screen [glass] that won't "poke"; LCDs have pixels that can go bad, plasma has a "bar" that can go bad.
Price point on the plasma/LCD is about the same for what I'm looking at. Saw the two side-by-each and the Plasma had a [what I thought anyway] a much crisper picture with deeper colours.
Funny, I'm looking Samsung or Sharp too -- can't help you out [Panasionic is in the plasma mix].
one thing: refresh rate -- high is good. the refresh rate on the LCD I am looking at is 60 and the sales people said "not enough" . . . plasma is 600 [back and forth, back and forth]
CV: why do you say LCD?
|
|
|
|
Post by blny on Apr 27, 2010 22:25:03 GMT -5
There are some really good sites out there. CNET.com is one. Lots of info. There are other sites out there. I thought I had them bookmarked, but I don't. A google search will reveal many of the sites out there.
Plasma is still the best picture when you get a good one. It's brighter - even when compared to LEDs. It produces better colour in brighter rooms. The big draw back is two fold. One is power consumption. They use A LOT more electricity than a comparable LCD. Two, no one is really developing the product extensively.
Your budget will dictate how much you can get.
When buying LCD, refresh rate is important. You won't find a name brand in the 40 inch size that doesn't at least refresh at 60Hz. The faster the refresh the better it handles fast motion. If you watch a lot of sports, like hockey, you'll want to get a high refresh rate. 120Hz is out there as is 240Hz. LCDs with 120Hz, like Samsung's 600 series are getting hard to find. They're continuing to produce LCDs with 60Hz (500 series) and they're LED line, but that's about it.
When it comes to brands, there's a lot to choose from. It's not safe to compare model to model within a brand. Sony does have some good sets, but they're not what they used to be. Samsung and LG are at or near the top in most categories. Samsung is actually considering buying Sony.
If you decide to consider a plasma, most of Panasonic's Viera line is excellent. Stay away from the U series. They were a poor batch. LG plasmas are terrible and LG is not helping customers with tv's that die (this from a very knowledgeable source at Futureshop).
Vizio is quickly becoming a quality brand. They offer good picture and a lot of features for the money.
Something to keep in mind is whether or not you're getting HD channels. If you're not, you need to know that HD tvs don't handle analog signal very well. Some are better than others. It will be grainy. If you choose to 'screen fit' the picture it will be stretched.
720p tvs are going to be cheaper. In many cases customers getting them now will be happy enough with them. Most HDTV content is still at 720. You'll notice the difference when you throw in an HD movie. The 1080 tv will be much sharper.
Worth noting is that if you ever get a tv 32 inches or smaller, don't concern yourself with anything over 720p. The tvs aren't big enough to render 1080 resolution, so getting a 32 inch 1080 tv is a waste of money.
After a lot of research, I had my father buy a Samsung 40 inch LCD. It's a 610 series. Fantastic tv. Really bright picture. Black levels are good, and doesn't require any amount of picture tweaking right out of the box. Their quality, reliability, and reputation are well earned. When they had problems in the past they stood by their product and customers and replaced a defective line of sets. At this point I have no reason to leave them ( I also have a 32 LCD of my own that I hope to upgrade in a year).
|
|
|
|
Post by CentreHice on Apr 27, 2010 22:47:52 GMT -5
Have a friend who's had nothing but trouble with his Vizio.
Had it just over a year. Picture turned green. Had it fixed. Happening again.
He'll never buy another one. Could just be a lemon (or, since it's green...a lime).
=====================
Good thread, guys....I'm sure I'll be looking soon, too....as I still have my 2001 53" Toshiba rear-projection. One of the main modules went on it 2 years ago....cost about $400 to get it fixed. Next time something goes on it, the $ would be better spent on new technology for sure.
|
|
|
|
Post by blny on Apr 28, 2010 10:07:15 GMT -5
CH, that's the first I've heard about a bad/breaking Vizio.
It's so difficult to make a purchase you feel confident in. With my own 32 inch Samsung, I'd read stories about where different batches of the same model were made. Customers were told to avoid batches made here, but batches made there were good.
As I said, Panasonic, widely regarded as having some of the best plasmas available made an entire series that was bad - the U series. Really yellow picture. Whites were terrible.
WRT to burn outs and dead pixels, you have to run the tvs a LONG time before it should be an issue. We're talking YEARS - like ten when you work out the math on the average use.
When buying, look at extended warranties. They're usually a couple of hundred dollars or so, but well worth it in case something goes wrong. If it does, you bring it back to the store and they exchange it. Takes the manufacturer out of the picture altogether.
|
|
|
|
Post by franko on Apr 28, 2010 10:20:07 GMT -5
I really didn't want the outlay right now but really don't think I have much choice [well, I have choice but do I want to enjoy watching the thing or not . . . ]
My 27" is on its way out. No amount of tweaking will do anything to the colour. Night scenes are terrible -- just too dark.
But the kicker/final decider: my son came in the other night and asked [this after I spent 15 minutes trying to adjust things] "when did the Habs change their uniforms to orange?".
Looking Samsung. Skilly: I actually called the company after trying to decipher a their web site to figure out the different TVs on a comparison: "C" series is 2010, "B" series is 2009. No difference really between the two series other than that. With that info I'm going in to the shop with the "B" series, pointing it out, and asking for a lower price.
I've made up my mind! unless I change it and go for the Viera
|
|
|
|
Post by The New Guy on Apr 28, 2010 11:11:43 GMT -5
I might be a little late to the discussion, but fwiw focus on refresh rate, contrast ratio and, frankly, what you think looks better.
Refresh rate is very important for watching sports. A screen with a low rate will seem to either jump and stutter, or it will be blurry (which negates the entire point of having HD). A higher refresh rate will keep the image closer to true.
Contrast ratio will make things jump out at you more. Crisper lines means more visible detail, which is what you want if you're going high def. Again, on the low end things will seem to blend into one another more, and the screen will be darker.
Other than that, plasma tends to have richer colours while LCD tends to have brighter colours - means plasma is probably better for watching movies while LCD is better for watching sports (where players where brightly coloured jerseys and what not). I also find plasma screens kick out a ton of extra heat, which can cause problems in an enclosed space.
1080 vs 720 is really a non-starter - at standing viewing distance most viewers (read: the human eye) can't tell one from the other (so long as your signal is in the right standard - stepping up or down can cause unwanted distortion).
|
|
|
|
Post by blny on Apr 28, 2010 13:49:20 GMT -5
Franko, cabling is also a key issue we haven't discussed. The only cable media that transfers true 1080 is HDMI. Component does 720. RCA does 480 (standard TV def). Invest in good cables. If your tuner doesn't have HDMI it's something you're going to want to invest money in sooner rather than later, otherwise you're not getting the best from your tv. When my Father bought his tv he was originally going to get a blu-ray player to go with it. There was no point because his old tuner did nothing more than component and he wouldn't be getting the most from his tv or the player. So, he upgraded to a Denon tuner. This tuner is 5.1 and upconverts video to 1080. So, when you watch a standard DVD the video is converted to a level that's really quite good. You'll want a tuner that has at least 3 HDMI inputs. One for the tv, one for your HD box, and one for something down the road (BR, gaming, etc). Some of the newer tuners out there are now able to transmit HD audio through HDMI. This wasn't always the case. Early HDMI capable tuners would transmit HD video, but the audio was still just your standard Dolby x.1. Having the ability to transmit both video and audio in HD over one cable means far less clutter behind your components. The wife will like that  . TNG, that heat associated with plasmas is a direct result of the energy they consume. When you look at the usage for both it really is crazy how much more electricity a plasma uses. Also, I think your reasoning for what does what better may be backwards. At this point plasma sets are still thought to do a better job with fast motion stuff. As a result, they're considered the set to get by many techies if all you do is watch sports. That being said, plasma is relatively maxed out. No one is really putting any sort of development into the technology anymore. It's at it's peak. LCD, and the new LED, and the newer 3D tvs are where all the dev is. At some point we may see the LCD tv surpass a current plasma, but it hasn't happened yet. Still, with a 240hz LCD tv it takes a trained/experienced eye to see the differences. In fact, you'd likely have to run a similar diagnostic tool on both sets to be able to compare results. |
|
|
|
Post by franko on Apr 28, 2010 14:05:18 GMT -5
[geezer rant alert]
There, I said it. BLNY, I just got back from one of them thar audio video stores and heard all about cables. What ever happened to buying a TV, carrying it home, plugging it in, and watching ['course, I'm old enough that "remote control" means yelling at one of the kids to come change the channel for me].
Yup, found out that I need an HDMI cable . And a super-duper surge protector. And a tilting wall bracket. I knew about an HD box rather than my digital box if I'm going to watch HD-TV.
No one mentioned a tuner -- what do you mean? Or is this the upgrade for surround sound?
I was going to spent x$ on a TV -- I have to double the budget to get the thing up and running. I may have to wait a bit until I make the purchase [ya, right]
[/geezer rant]
|
|
|
|
Post by Andrew on Apr 28, 2010 14:17:58 GMT -5
I haven't stayed on top of the industry since buying one over a year ago, but agree with BLNY that CNet is a good source for information. When I was researching, the general consensus seemed to be that Samsung was the way to go for LCD, and Panasonic for Plasma. I went with a Samsung 40" 500 series and am happy with it (would have gone 600 series, but wasn't lookinig to spend the extra $600 at the time).
|
|
|
|
Post by LoupDogg on Apr 28, 2010 14:26:06 GMT -5
I always told myself I'd get and HDTV when the price would fall under 500 bucks. I got this one for 450, and I can say I'm well satisfied. www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_05771021000P?keyword=samsung+32I think many people now go for TVs bigger than 32'', which is fine if you have a massive living room, but in my opinion can be too big. This one would please Franko, as you buy it, plug an antenna and boom, you have CBC in HD and you can watch the habs. Oh no, wait. You can watch Boston-Buffalo... (still, CNET review said it was one of the best for the size and the blacks are good on it. Not a pun on PK Subban). |
|
|
|
Post by blny on Apr 28, 2010 15:38:30 GMT -5
[geezer rant alert] There, I said it. BLNY, I just got back from one of them thar audio video stores and heard all about cables. What ever happened to buying a TV, carrying it home, plugging it in, and watching ['course, I'm old enough that "remote control" means yelling at one of the kids to come change the channel for me]. Yup, found out that I need an HDMI cable . And a super-duper surge protector. And a tilting wall bracket. I knew about an HD box rather than my digital box if I'm going to watch HD-TV.
No one mentioned a tuner -- what do you mean? Or is this the upgrade for surround sound?
I was going to spent x$ on a TV -- I have to double the budget to get the thing up and running. I may have to wait a bit until I make the purchase [ya, right]
[/geezer rant]When I say tuner, I mean something that you run your entire home theatre through. Not some dinky Home Theatre in a Box deal, but a real A/V tuner. Something with a built in radio, has connections on the back for all your devices. If you don't have a home theatre set up with speakers and such, then it's just a matter of plugging your devices directly into your tv. I just got this set up to run all my gear through. www.crutchfield.ca/Onkyo_HTS6200_Home_Theatre_Audio_System_p/580ht6200b.htmHas excellent connectivity. Like anything else, you can go cheaper if you want. That said, a decent tuner (which doesn't include Sony product) is gonna set you back at least $300. If you need speakers, it's impossible to find them for a decent price unless you go used. That's why buying the whole shooting match is so effective. IMO, there's no point to HD if you're not going to give yourself the whole movie experience. Part of that equation is sound. I'm not A/V geek. There's mountains of stuff I know I don't know. But I know enough to ask questions. That's half the battle really. WRT HDMI cabling you can spend huge sums on them. Crazy money. $30 should get you a good cable that's plenty long enough to connect your device to another. The current standard is 1.3, but I believe 1.4 is about to hit the market. Just about anything on a store shelf today is 1.3 compatible. These cables are backwards compatible too should you be running an older device (some older DVD players etc). Frank, anytime you want to discuss further, let me know. I'm around.  |
|
|
|
Post by franko on Apr 28, 2010 15:51:43 GMT -5
Went on cnet first: nothing on the Samsung, but that's OK . . . I've decided that's it [though Future Shop thinks I need a Sony -- I'm not going there anyway].
40", LoupDogg, because it is a long narrow room.
500 series because of the $ here too, Andrew, though it is only 60 htz [$200 moe isn't worth it for the amount of TV I watch].
But I'll have 30 days to change my mind.
|
|
|
|
Post by franko on Apr 28, 2010 16:04:58 GMT -5
When I say tuner, I mean something that you run your entire home theatre through. That's what I thought you meant. Don't have it hooked up to a tuner/home stereo set-up, 'cause the old system was "turn on the TV and turn up the volume". Actually, I'm buying HDTV 'cause that's all you can buy now. Don't watch a lot of TV -- a movie with the kids some Sunday afternoons, HNIC RDS, and news. Not much more time than that, though come playoff time I do tend to tune in more [because the Habs have been out early every year it hasn't interferred with my yeasr-end stuff]. You're telling me! They were saying $30-$250, "but a $100 cable should do it". |
|
|
|
Post by blny on Apr 28, 2010 17:06:03 GMT -5
Frank, you should be happy with the Samsung. Congrats. I'm surprised the Futureshop guy tried to upsell you. They're not on commission (like Bestbuy staff are). They're typically far better trained than Bestbuy too. That $100 cable is for the guy that wants the 'best' whether he can tell the difference or not. He 'has to have it'. Sony's tvs are still decent, but not the best. Taking in the entire range, Samsung is widely regarded as the best. Sony has some good sets, but their price to feature ratio is often high when compared to the rest. If you're not a big tv watcher you've done fine with a Samsung 500 series. Was it this one? www.futureshop.ca/en-CA/product/samsung-samsung-40-1080p-lcd-hdtv-ln40c530-ln40c530f1fxzc/10140413.aspx?path=6f34b5f5cf3f40cd4f2be56e1f2a84aben02If so, you should be able to put a thumb drive in the usb port and watch movies off it. Great if you're a downloader or your kids are. |
|
|
|
Post by Yossarian on Apr 28, 2010 17:59:40 GMT -5
After much research and in-store comparisons, I bought a 50" Panasonic Viera just after Christmas (TCP50S1), and I absolutely love it. The colour, contrast, brightness, and ability to view from an angle was unmatched for me. It is in my basement, where its dark with little natural light. I subscribe to Bell, and use the 6131 receiver, which I turned into a PVR with an external hard drive hook up via USB connection, and the resolution is dynamite, (even if Bell has a slightly compressed signal). I also have a BlueRay player hooked up, with fantastic resolution. My family and I also play Wii on it. At first I wasn't that happy with the resolution, but I was using poor quality HDMI cables (GE) that I bought at Crappy Tire with a gift card I had. Upon the recommendation of a friend, I switched to better quality cables and the difference is night and day. I really don't know how to tell the difference between good and bad quality cables, other than to say the ones I'm using now have a much thicker diameter than the GE ones. A friend recommend that I by the cables from this on-line retailer. www.monoprice.com/home/index.aspThe product is comparable to Monster cable, at a fraction of the price. I'll certainly vouch for both the quality and price. |
|
|
|
Post by franko on Apr 28, 2010 18:43:20 GMT -5
you should be happy with the Samsung. Congrats. Haven't bought it yet but will. Even though for some reason the TV has great colour tonight! Here it's FS that is on commission and BB that is not. Yes and no. This from FS is this year's model; I'm looking at last year's model [called Samsung, who said that there was absolutely no difference between the 2 other than the number: B or C model]. If I can get a lower price with last year's model, why not? |
|
|
|
Post by Habs_fan_in_LA on Apr 28, 2010 23:08:26 GMT -5
6 cylinder or V8.
Is the six a Nissan 370Z or a Porsche. Is the V8 a Corvette or a Mustang.
My vote is 1080P LCD but in reality, if I'm not wearing my eyeglasses, and often I am not, I can't tell the difference.
What is on sale the day you go and which one looks best.
LCD uses less power. Be advised technology is constantly changing and todays best is tomorrows 8 track.
If the Habs win, 1080 doesn't matter.
|
|
|
|
Post by Cranky on Apr 29, 2010 0:22:08 GMT -5
As far as I am concerned, the discusssion is over. LED LCD and onward we go!
|
|
|
|
Post by halihab on Apr 29, 2010 6:25:42 GMT -5
I'm currently shopping for a new TV too franko ... just remodelled our family room, and we are going to put a TV in there now. We resisted it for awhile because the kids would be glued to it, instead of making crafts, colouring, going outside, etc. The rec room has a Sony Vega Trinitron, but the girls dont like going downstairs alone . I've been told, and I have no idea if it is true, that the type of TV depends on the room. The sales people tell me if the room is downstairs/darker you should go with plasma, if the room is upstairs where it is presumably a little brighter, LCD is the way to go. I've made up mind that I am going with LCD, even though the cost of the plasmas is very enticing. Seen a 46 inch Plasma for $599 the other day (I could have sworn that was the price, but didnt really look, since I am going with LCD). My question now, is what brand names are good? And does it really matter? I'm thinking Samsung or Sharp. (The Sony's are still pretty hefty in price relative to them) Skilly, I have a 42" Panasonic Plasma in the basement. Love it. It's true, Plasma tend not to deflect the sun rays as well as LCD's. get this, I bought it 4 or 5 years ago at a bargain price of $ 2200.00  |
|
|
|
Post by Cranky on Apr 29, 2010 11:48:03 GMT -5
OK . . . it's been a couple of years, technology has changed, prices have come down, and I have less than 24 hours to research and buy. Looking at 40-42 inch set. Could care less [or not ;D] about Blu-ray. Want to enjoy a hockey game [winning would make the enjoyment soooo much better. So: 780p Plasma or 1080p LCD? Did you buy? If not, have some patience. First off, ALWAYS buy as big as you can afford. Second, the new generation of LED LCD's which turn their LED on and off to match the background are really good. Sharp introduce their first generation LED which were simply flourescent replacments. This year, they will have individual LCD that will turn on and off according to the background. I think that some LED LCD's already have this feature but are a bit expensive. Good luck with whatever you chose. |
|
|
|
Post by franko on Apr 29, 2010 13:27:13 GMT -5
on my way out this afternoon to buy one.
I'm going for a Samsung 40" 1080p 120htz . . . though my wife, who actually will have a greater say in the decision than I'd like to admit [just being honest here] says "you don't need something so fancy -- 60htz whatever that is is good enough!".
the size is right for the room and I've been convinced that the extra $ are worth it for 120 [though honestly we don't watch a lot of TV . . . Sunday afternoon movie [no BluRay] and hockey games when I get the chance]. I'd probably have been [mostly] OK with what we've got if it wasn't on the edge of death.
definitely can't afford LED just yet or I'd probably look at one . . .
thanks for all the advice, all.
|
|
|
|
Post by Disp on Apr 29, 2010 20:16:13 GMT -5
Bought my plasma a few years ago now and at the time there was no comparison in picture quality. LCD wasn't even close to my eyes. Colors much better on the plasma and LCD had a very noticable blurring/smudging along the edge of moving objects. Really annoying when viewing sports. I've seen the new 120/240hz models in stores and from a quick glance they look a lot better than they were. I'd check it out closely before buying though. I was told about the light room/lcd dark room/plasma thing a lot as well. I have my plasma in a very large living room with a very large window and never had a problem.
|
|
|
|
Post by franko on Apr 30, 2010 8:36:14 GMT -5
once again, thanks for all the input.
I am a happy camper.
set it up last night, put the SJ/Det game on "just to see how it looked". now I'm asking why didn't I do something to kill the old set years ago! [as an aside, mrs franko walked into the room and said "wow" when the game was on. after I picked myself up off the floor, I realized that there would be no "guilt penalty" for buying up. and that a BluRay was probably closer than I thought].
|
|
|
|
Post by halihab on Apr 30, 2010 12:58:05 GMT -5
once again, thanks for all the input. I am a happy camper. set it up last night, put the SJ/Det game on "just to see how it looked". now I'm asking why didn't I do something to kill the old set years ago! [as an aside, mrs franko walked into the room and said "wow" when the game was on. after I picked myself up off the floor, I realized that there would be no "guilt penalty" for buying up. and that a BluRay was probably closer than I thought]. Congrats Franko - Enjoy the game tonight. |
|
|
|
Post by franko on Apr 30, 2010 20:36:19 GMT -5
got home in time to see the Gio goal; big set in use so watched on "the other one" . . . glad I didn't sully the new one with that game.
|
|
|
|
Post by Yossarian on Apr 30, 2010 22:28:06 GMT -5
Welcome to the world of HD!! Watching sports in HD takes on a whole new dimension. You'll love it.
Actually, hockey isn't my favorite sport to watch in HD. I find with my Panasonic Plasma, because the colours are so enhanced, the ice is way too bright, and some times washed out with the arena lights. Some arenas are worse than others. The Bell Centre is extremely bright.
I love football in HD, soccer looks great, as does baseball, golf, and although I'm not a follower, NASCAR racing has a mesmerizing feel to it in HD...
enjoy!!!
|
|
|
|
Post by franko on May 2, 2010 18:17:06 GMT -5
well wow. saw the game [didn't expect to] on HD -- simply amazing. it was going to be a '"try it out and try to convince thev Mrs." -- she walked into the room, said "wow, looks great" and when the folks we were with changed the channel to regular cable she went "wow" again and . . . well, now I'm on the phone with Rogers trying to get a deal [and if they won't give me one I'll call my buddy in corporate and see what he can do]. need this in my home by next game.
|
|
.
