Would you trade Hamrlik for Souray?

[Forum Ghost]

Just to make things clear, this isn't a rumour that I heard or anything like that. It's just me thinking out loud and wanting to get the thoughts of the board.

The Oilers are still trying to trade Souray and apparently want a defenceman in return. According to the article, Edmonton would prefer to deal Souray before training camp so that he's not a distraction. Hamrlik is familiar with Edmonton and would not tie them down long-term. With Markov out for the first month we could use a guy like Souray on the PP. Even with Markov back, it would give the Habs two potent PP units with a rotation of Markov, Souray, Subban and Spacek.

Thoughts?


www.faceoff.com/Oilers+still+trying+trade+Souray+sign+others/3433908/story.html

[Disgruntled70sHab]

Great seeing you check in, FG. Hamrlik stated just after he signed with Montreal that he wanted to stay in a Canadian city where hockey was appreciated (a paraphrase though). Yet, moving Hamrlik, or more importantly, his salary, (I think Redscull suggested this a while back) would give Gauthier more options than he has now.

That said, I'm not so sure bringing Souray back would be all that good a thing given the way team chemistry has developed and the way it continues to develop (hopefully). He's tough and he sticks up for anyone wearing the same jersey has he does. And I think he's got one of the best canons in the league from blue line. However, I don't know if that offsets some of the problems that comes with him.

I don't know man ... is his family still in the LA area? That could be a distraction for him. And when Souray's in town things tend to revolve around him from time to time. I don't want to be unfair to the man ... I mean, how would I know what went on behind closed doors. But, Souray seemed to be in the press quite a lot when he was in Montreal. For his shot and point production, yes, but also for some of the wrong reasons as well.

Would he disrupt team chemistry? Well, it's hard to say. But, me ... I wouldn't give him the chance.

Could be talking out of my ear here, but that's the way I see anyway.

Cheers.

[Skilly]

Aug 24, 2010 7:40:09 GMT -5 Forum Ghost said:

Just to make things clear, this isn't a rumour that I heard or anything like that. It's just me thinking out loud and wanting to get the thoughts of the board.

The Oilers are still trying to trade Souray and apparently want a defenceman in return. According to the article, Edmonton would prefer to deal Souray before training camp so that he's not a distraction. Hamrlik is familiar with Edmonton and would not tie them down long-term. With Markov out for the first month we could use a guy like Souray on the PP. Even with Markov back, it would give the Habs two potent PP units with a rotation of Markov, Souray, Subban and Spacek.

Thoughts?


www.faceoff.com/Oilers+still+trying+trade+Souray+sign+others/3433908/story.html

Hamrlik has a NTC until Feb. 1 , 2011 .... he can list six teams in each conference he will accept a trade to. I'm sure he could waive that clause at anytime, and Edmonton may even be on his short list, but I would think he'd like to see the Habs trade him to his preferences first.

On Feb. 2nd however .... well we can trade him where ever we want ...

[franko]

Hammer 5.5 this season, UFA next
Souray 4.5 next 2 seasons.

no.

[blny]

It's a tough call. Sentiment gets in the way. Having his NTC expire in February means we'll have Markov back, and a good indication of where Subban is. If he's progressed enough that Roman can be moved at the deadline for an upgrade elsewhere I say go for it. At this point though, it's hard to move him with Markov on the shelf.

WRT to trading him for Souray, I don't think it helps us. Souray has 2 years left on his deal. The main reason to trade Roman is to get the cap space, and acquiring Souray in the deal makes things worse, not better, in that regard.

[Polarice]

Though call, I do miss having Souray around...his toughness, his 100 mile slapshot, everyone said he was a good leader in the dressing room. I'm just not sure about his health these days, and that extra year on his contract.

[CrocRob]

I wouldn't trade Hamrlik at this point. Not with Markov in a questionable state and very little depth that can be depended on for 20+ minutes per night behind him.

And on the return, Souray has played less than half a season in 2 of the past 3 years.

Moving Hamrlik last year made sense. This year it makes none because he's an expiring contract and we'll never get assets that are valuable or useful enough to outweigh his presence short term. Add in the Markov injury and I think it's a non-starter.

[Patty Roy]

Aug 24, 2010 8:26:45 GMT -5 franko said:

Hammer 5.5 this season, UFA next
Souray 4.5 next 2 seasons.

no.

I agree. I'd rather have Souray than Hammer for this season if we could walk away from both next year. But Souray's 2 years remaining is the reason why nobody is touching him.

[PTH]

Interesting idea, but no.

Added:
-commitment is shorter with Hamrlik (and the end of Hamrlik's contract fits in well with Markov's potential extension)
-Hammer is a better-rounded player; you can give Hamrlik far more minutes
-I'm against trading guys who signed as UFAs, unless it's at their own request (except for at the trade deadline)
-Fact is, I'd be looking at an extension (at fewer dollars) for Hamrlik (just for a season though)

[BadCompany]

So now that Sheldon has cleared waivers and has been sufficiently humbled, what would everybody say to a Spacek/Andrei for Souray/Brule deal?

Salary-wise it’s virtually identical: 7.25 for Souray/Brule, $7.0833 for Spacek/Andrei

Souray for Spacek: We get the better player, but only if he actually plays. Both Souray and Spacek have two years left on their deals. Souray’s is a higher cap hit, but Spacek can’t be bought out. Spacek has played in Edmonton before, Souray has played in Montreal before. We need the power-play blast and the grit, but Souray’s “presence” may disrupt the dressing room. Edmonton needs to get rid of the “presence” but Spacek just isn’t that good a player. Has pluses and minus for both teams.

Andrei for Brule: We stockpile another 2005 pick (4-5-6 baby!) who has never lived up to his potential. They get a flake who hasn’t lived up to his potential either, but who has nevertheless lived up “more” than Brule has and who might be poised for a monster (contract) year. We get rid of our headcase in return for a gritty player who at the very least can play bottom six for us, and who might develop some chemistry with a similar styled player in Lars Eller.

[Polarice]

Oct 1, 2010 13:09:05 GMT -5 BadCompany said:

So now that Sheldon has cleared waivers and has been sufficiently humbled, what would everybody say to a Spacek/Andrei for Souray/Brule deal?

Salary-wise it’s virtually identical: 7.25 for Souray/Brule, $7.0833 for Spacek/Andrei

Souray for Spacek: We get the better player, but only if he actually plays. Both Souray and Spacek have two years left on their deals. Souray’s is a higher cap hit, but Spacek can’t be bought out. Spacek has played in Edmonton before, Souray has played in Montreal before. We need the power-play blast and the grit, but Souray’s “presence” may disrupt the dressing room. Edmonton needs to get rid of the “presence” but Spacek just isn’t that good a player. Has pluses and minus for both teams.

Andrei for Brule: We stockpile another 2005 pick (4-5-6 baby!) who has never lived up to his potential. They get a flake who hasn’t lived up to his potential either, but who has nevertheless lived up “more” than Brule has and who might be poised for a monster (contract) year. We get rid of our headcase in return for a gritty player who at the very least can play bottom six for us, and who might develop some chemistry with a similar styled player in Lars Eller.

Done!!

[Disgruntled70sHab]

Oct 1, 2010 13:09:05 GMT -5 BadCompany said:

So now that Sheldon has cleared waivers and has been sufficiently humbled, what would everybody say to a Spacek/Andrei for Souray/Brule deal?

Salary-wise it’s virtually identical: 7.25 for Souray/Brule, $7.0833 for Spacek/Andrei

Souray for Spacek: We get the better player, but only if he actually plays. Both Souray and Spacek have two years left on their deals. Souray’s is a higher cap hit, but Spacek can’t be bought out. Spacek has played in Edmonton before, Souray has played in Montreal before. We need the power-play blast and the grit, but Souray’s “presence” may disrupt the dressing room. Edmonton needs to get rid of the “presence” but Spacek just isn’t that good a player. Has pluses and minus for both teams.

Andrei for Brule: We stockpile another 2005 pick (4-5-6 baby!) who has never lived up to his potential. They get a flake who hasn’t lived up to his potential either, but who has nevertheless lived up “more” than Brule has and who might be poised for a monster (contract) year. We get rid of our headcase in return for a gritty player who at the very least can play bottom six for us, and who might develop some chemistry with a similar styled player in Lars Eller.

I was listening to a sports spot on the radio this morning and it's entirely possible Martin Gerber, who also cleared waivers earlier may end up being placed immediately on re-entry waivers in the hopes he's picked up for half his salary. That's a $250,000 cap hit for an experienced goaltender. That's supposition, though. No guarantee Edmonton will do this.

Souray? I don't know BC. I hate using the term "dressing room cancer" but Souray seems to be more about Souray. It's been all about him and nothing/no one else since he turned down Gainey's offer a few years back. He was insulted the Habs didn't negotiate with him first, and he waited for various teams to make him an offer before eventually signing with Edmonton ... his "dream" being fulfilled. It looks, on the surface anyway, that Souray will indeed be reporting to Oklahoma City. If he does, then I have to say, good on him. His self-absorbed attitude will probably follow him there (just opinions, man).

No one can deny Souray's main asset; his canonading drives from the point ;D But, to send a guy like this into a team that worked hard to establish the identity they have now might just be like throwing a wrench into the gears. He also brings toughness as well, granted, but I have to wonder just how long it would be before the press starts with, "Sheldon's Team" or " Souray wants out?" I'd have to pass on Souray if it were up to me, buds.

AK for Brule? Yeah, sure ... I'd do it. But, would Edmonton?

Cheers.

[franko]

some choice!

[seventeen]

I think I'd do it. In Souray's defense, it seems he really had his big problems with Kovalev. No love fest there. No Kovy in Habland anymore, and Souray did stick up for his teammates on the ice. The downside, is that the ice guys would have a lot more repairs because of the holes dug by Sheldon's pirouettes when his jock strap is (ahem) relocated to the bleachers by a fast shifty forward. But I can't see him as being worse than Spacek in our end. Brule has more grit than AK, but less strength and perhaps a better attitude. Certainly he'd be a better interview.

On balance I'd do it. Will Edmonton?

[blny]

As I see it, the biggest problem with Spacek is him having to play the right side - one he's not played before and clearly isn't comfortable playing. Souray played the right side on the PP, but what side does he play even strength?

I don't question Sheldon's character too greatly. He was in an unhappy situation, felt he was getting treated unfairly with respect to his wrist, and out of frustration blew off steam verbally. Mistake? Yep. Prior to it, he'd shown numerous times he's got character and the willingness and ability to stand up for teammates.

Sheldon on re-entry waivers is half that $5.4 million cap hit right? He signed the deal before he turns 35, so the whole amount doesn't count against the cap. So, monetarily, Edmonton is taking back the $7.0833 and we're taking back Souray's new cap hit of $2.7 million and Brule at $1.85 million. That's $4.55 million cap hit for this season and a significant $2.533 million difference.

Here's something important to consider: Is Souray at $2.7 million a year cap hit for 2 years playing top four minutes better than sayyyyy Bergeron at $1 million playing in the 6-7 hole? Do you get $1.7 million more in value with Souray? He's as bad defensively.