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Post by wetcoasthabsfan on Feb 21, 2011 16:51:42 GMT -5
Along with Niskanen for Goligoski. Neal is just the kind of guy I wish we would pick up.
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Post by BadCompany on Feb 21, 2011 16:54:47 GMT -5
Seems like a very high price to pay for Goligoski, if you ask me. Neal could be a great power-forward, especially on Crosby and/or Malkin's wing. This could be his John Leclair moment.
In the meantime, the East just keeps getting biggger...
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Post by wetcoasthabsfan on Feb 21, 2011 17:01:51 GMT -5
Seems like a very high price to pay for Goligoski, if you ask me. Neal could be a great power-forward, especially on Crosby and/or Malkin's wing. This could be his John Leclair moment. In the meantime, the East just keeps getting biggger... No kidding Pittsburgh made a great deal for themselves |
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Post by Marvin on Feb 21, 2011 17:15:17 GMT -5
Goligoski has 31 pts (9 goals). Who would be our equivalent to Goligoski? Probably Subban. Another deal that Mtl could not have made.
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Post by GNick99 on Feb 21, 2011 17:19:01 GMT -5
Yeah, I can't figure Pierre Gauthier out. Neal would be ideal type of player we need. Young, big with skill. Brewer last week went for little nothing, he was the big, veteran defenseman we need.
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Post by Marvin on Feb 21, 2011 17:36:37 GMT -5
Neal would have been a great addition, but I'm guessing that he would have costed a min of Subban in return. Brewer is making a big salary (relatively speaking), and a soon to be free agent.
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Post by GNick99 on Feb 21, 2011 17:40:47 GMT -5
Not really, Subban value way higher than Goligski, Subban upside is franchise defenseman. He'd be in the untouchable category, where Goligski went much cheaper. Plus, Dallas threw in Niskanen. Brewer didn't cost much and took a lot of minutes off of our top 3 defenseman. But guess doesn't matter as Habs don't appear to be planning for playoffs
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Post by Marvin on Feb 21, 2011 17:58:33 GMT -5
Not really, Subban value way higher than Goligski, Subban upside is franchise defenseman. He'd be in the untouchable category, where Goligski went much cheaper. Plus, Dallas threw in Niskanen. Brewer didn't cost much and took a lot of minutes off of our top 3 defenseman. But guess doesn't matter as Habs don't appear to be planning for playoffs In a trade for Neal, I don't see anyone on our roster that would interest Dallas - at least not anyone that we'd be willing to give up. Our 'untouchables' are the only ones that would draw interest from any other team. |
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Feb 21, 2011 18:16:55 GMT -5
I just rolled by eyes when I read it.
Seriously ... I'm shaking my head right now.
... incredible ...
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Post by CentreHice on Feb 21, 2011 18:17:44 GMT -5
Amazing how other teams such as Philly, Boston, and Pittsburgh have good players deemed expendable to improve their chances.....whereas we have either untouchable players or crap nobody wants.
Maddening.
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Post by jkr on Feb 21, 2011 18:20:12 GMT -5
Not really, Subban value way higher than Goligski, Subban upside is franchise defenseman. He'd be in the untouchable category, where Goligski went much cheaper. Plus, Dallas threw in Niskanen. Brewer didn't cost much and took a lot of minutes off of our top 3 defenseman. But guess doesn't matter as Habs don't appear to be planning for playoffs In a trade for Neal, I don't see anyone on our roster that would interest Dallas - at least not anyone that we'd be willing to give up. Our 'untouchables' are the only ones that would draw interest from any other team. You're absolutely right. It's easy to say MTl should be in on that deal but who do they give up to get Neal? Other than Subban there is no one on the blueline that could fetch this guy. PS: according to Sportsnet the Leafs were talking to the Avs about Liles but apparently feel their asking price is way too high. Any idea of his value? He's 30 years old, has 36 points & has a cap hit of 4.2 until the end of next season. |
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Post by jkr on Feb 21, 2011 18:29:29 GMT -5
Seems like a very high price to pay for Goligoski, if you ask me. Neal could be a great power-forward, especially on Crosby and/or Malkin's wing. This could be his John Leclair moment. In the meantime, the East just keeps getting biggger... was that extra g in bigger for emphasis?  |
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Post by blny on Feb 21, 2011 18:38:24 GMT -5
I'm surprised to see Dallas move Neal. IMO, that means they're not going to be keeping Richards.
Daly has regressed a little, but is still good and just entering his prime. So, I'm surprised Goligoski is what they wanted. I think they over paid for him too.
Neal IS what we need, but I'm not prepared to give up Subban for him. Dmen like Subban are harder to replace. We've had enough injuries on the back end to make ya sick. I'd have offered Weber/Tinordi, and a couple of picks.
Hard to say whether Neal gets to play with Sid this year or not, but he immediately ups the skill quotient on the wing for the Pens. Could be the best forward that Sid's had to play with since Hossa. Certainly the best power forward. When healthy, I think Sid and Neal become an elite combo.
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Post by Skilly on Feb 21, 2011 20:32:20 GMT -5
I actually think our equivalent of Goglioski is Wiznieski ... roughly same age, same production, same usage on PP ... the only difference is Goglioski has a year left on his contract - which seems to be the norm this trading year. The only guy we have fitting that category is Spacek.
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Post by seventeen on Feb 21, 2011 22:45:45 GMT -5
His style seems a lot like Webers. Not big, decent skater and more of an offensive than defensive guy. Thirty one points in 60 games. but the big number this year is his +/- which, at 20, ties him with Crosby, well ahead of everyone else on the team. This year is one of his best, though.
Weber could turn into this guy if he improves defensively, which is happening. And he's younger. Not saying he'd have gotten us Neal, but it would be a start. Unfortunately, that's not enough.
I'm still really surprised Neal was even available. I wouldn't trade him for Golly G even up.
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Post by BadCompany on Feb 22, 2011 7:35:04 GMT -5
His style seems a lot like Webers. Not big, decent skater and more of an offensive than defensive guy. Thirty one points in 60 games. but the big number this year is his +/- which, at 20, ties him with Crosby, well ahead of everyone else on the team. This year is one of his best, though. Weber could turn into this guy if he improves defensively, which is happening. And he's younger. Not saying he'd have gotten us Neal, but it would be a start. Unfortunately, that's not enough. I'm still really surprised Neal was even available. I wouldn't trade him for Golly G even up. I wouldn't have made that trade either, especially since the Stars also threw in a serviceable defenseman with upside too. Not sure what their reasoning was in this one. I guess they either really like Goligoski or Neal has issues somewhere. But he's a personal friend of Bob McKenzie so somehow I don't think it's character driven. Wojtek Wolski: 6’3, 210 lbs, 10 goals. 24 years old Jack Skille: 6’1, 215 lbs, 7 goals, 23 years old Mike Fisher: 6’1, 209 lbs, 15 goals, 30 years old, Blake Wheeler: 6’5, 210 lbs, 11 goals, 24 years old, Chris Stewart: 6’2, 228 lbs, 15 goals, 23 years old, James Neal: 6’2, 208 lbs, 21 goals, 23 years old Who says you can't trade for young size with skill? |
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Post by Skilly on Feb 22, 2011 7:36:29 GMT -5
His style seems a lot like Webers. Not big, decent skater and more of an offensive than defensive guy. Thirty one points in 60 games. but the big number this year is his +/- which, at 20, ties him with Crosby, well ahead of everyone else on the team. This year is one of his best, though. Weber could turn into this guy if he improves defensively, which is happening. And he's younger. Not saying he'd have gotten us Neal, but it would be a start. Unfortunately, that's not enough. I'm still really surprised Neal was even available. I wouldn't trade him for Golly G even up. I was going to use Weber as a comparison too ... but I think that to find the Hab comparable we have to look at a whole host of things; production, use, age, contract, experience, etc ... |
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Post by Skilly on Feb 22, 2011 7:38:53 GMT -5
His style seems a lot like Webers. Not big, decent skater and more of an offensive than defensive guy. Thirty one points in 60 games. but the big number this year is his +/- which, at 20, ties him with Crosby, well ahead of everyone else on the team. This year is one of his best, though. Weber could turn into this guy if he improves defensively, which is happening. And he's younger. Not saying he'd have gotten us Neal, but it would be a start. Unfortunately, that's not enough. I'm still really surprised Neal was even available. I wouldn't trade him for Golly G even up. I wouldn't have made that trade either, especially since the Stars also threw in a serviceable defenseman with upside too. Not sure what their reasoning was in this one. I guess they either really like Goligoski or Neal has issues somewhere. But he's a personal friend of Bob McKenzie so somehow I don't think it's character driven. Wojtek Wolski: 6’3, 210 lbs, 10 goals. 24 years old Jack Skille: 6’1, 215 lbs, 7 goals, 23 years old Mike Fisher: 6’1, 209 lbs, 15 goals, 30 years old, Blake Wheeler: 6’5, 210 lbs, 11 goals, 24 years old, Chris Stewart: 6’2, 228 lbs, 15 goals, 23 years old, James Neal: 6’2, 208 lbs, 21 goals, 23 years old Who says you can't trade for young size with skill? And this was Nieuwendyk .... you think being an integral part of the Iginla deal, he wouldn't have pulled this trigger. Dallas is alot further from the Cup now, then back then .... |
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Post by blny on Feb 22, 2011 7:39:39 GMT -5
His style seems a lot like Webers. Not big, decent skater and more of an offensive than defensive guy. Thirty one points in 60 games. but the big number this year is his +/- which, at 20, ties him with Crosby, well ahead of everyone else on the team. This year is one of his best, though. Weber could turn into this guy if he improves defensively, which is happening. And he's younger. Not saying he'd have gotten us Neal, but it would be a start. Unfortunately, that's not enough. I'm still really surprised Neal was even available. I wouldn't trade him for Golly G even up. I wouldn't have made that trade either, especially since the Stars also threw in a serviceable defenseman with upside too. Not sure what their reasoning was in this one. I guess they either really like Goligoski or Neal has issues somewhere. But he's a personal friend of Bob McKenzie so somehow I don't think it's character driven. Wojtek Wolski: 6’3, 210 lbs, 10 goals. 24 years old Jack Skille: 6’1, 215 lbs, 7 goals, 23 years old Mike Fisher: 6’1, 209 lbs, 15 goals, 30 years old, Blake Wheeler: 6’5, 210 lbs, 11 goals, 24 years old, Chris Stewart: 6’2, 228 lbs, 15 goals, 23 years old, James Neal: 6’2, 208 lbs, 21 goals, 23 years old Who says you can't trade for young size with skill? Andrei Kostitsyn: 6', 214 lbs, 13 goals, 26 years old.  |
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Post by BadCompany on Feb 22, 2011 7:48:21 GMT -5
I wouldn't have made that trade either, especially since the Stars also threw in a serviceable defenseman with upside too. Not sure what their reasoning was in this one. I guess they either really like Goligoski or Neal has issues somewhere. But he's a personal friend of Bob McKenzie so somehow I don't think it's character driven. Wojtek Wolski: 6’3, 210 lbs, 10 goals. 24 years old Jack Skille: 6’1, 215 lbs, 7 goals, 23 years old Mike Fisher: 6’1, 209 lbs, 15 goals, 30 years old, Blake Wheeler: 6’5, 210 lbs, 11 goals, 24 years old, Chris Stewart: 6’2, 228 lbs, 15 goals, 23 years old, James Neal: 6’2, 208 lbs, 21 goals, 23 years old Who says you can't trade for young size with skill? Andrei Kostitsyn: 6', 214 lbs, 13 goals, 26 years old. One can only hope! ;D |
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Feb 22, 2011 8:43:06 GMT -5
Chris Stewart: 6’2, 228 lbs, 15 goals, 23 years old, James Neal: 6’2, 208 lbs, 21 goals, 23 years old Sigh! |
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Post by Skilly on Feb 22, 2011 9:19:48 GMT -5
Chris Stewart: 6’2, 228 lbs, 15 goals, 23 years old, James Neal: 6’2, 208 lbs, 21 goals, 23 years old Sigh! I sigh more over losing that ... 6'2, 230lbs, 23 yr old .... 28 goals in his last 63 games .... |
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Post by blny on Feb 22, 2011 10:00:14 GMT -5
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Post by Marvin on Feb 22, 2011 12:15:13 GMT -5
It's a losing battle if you're wondering why we couldn't trade for any of these guys. We simply don't have, or are not willing to give up, what the other team would want.
A better question would be wondering why we didn't originally draft these players, if we had the option.
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Post by GNick99 on Feb 22, 2011 17:56:25 GMT -5
Not really, Subban value way higher than Goligski, Subban upside is franchise defenseman. He'd be in the untouchable category, where Goligski went much cheaper. Plus, Dallas threw in Niskanen. Brewer didn't cost much and took a lot of minutes off of our top 3 defenseman. But guess doesn't matter as Habs don't appear to be planning for playoffs In a trade for Neal, I don't see anyone on our roster that would interest Dallas - at least not anyone that we'd be willing to give up. Our 'untouchables' are the only ones that would draw interest from any other team. Neal didn't go for much, really surprising cheap. Goligoski is a fine defenseman but nothing we couldn't match. Goligoski kind of in the #3 defenseman line. Letang took ice time away from him. Gonchar last year was ahead of him last yer, he's not something you would get excited about. |
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Post by Disp on Feb 22, 2011 18:11:27 GMT -5
In a trade for Neal, I don't see anyone on our roster that would interest Dallas - at least not anyone that we'd be willing to give up. Our 'untouchables' are the only ones that would draw interest from any other team. Neal didn't go for much, really surprising cheap. Goligoski is a fine defenseman but nothing we couldn't match. Goligoski kind of in the #3 defenseman line. Letang took ice time away from him. Gonchar last year was ahead of him last yer, he's not something you would get excited about. I'd be very happy to get a dman like Goligoski. He's 25, plays 20 minutes, +20, and he'd be 2nd on our team in scoring. Our only comparable is Subban and I don't think anyone would trade him for Neal. |
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Post by Marvin on Feb 22, 2011 18:15:28 GMT -5
In a trade for Neal, I don't see anyone on our roster that would interest Dallas - at least not anyone that we'd be willing to give up. Our 'untouchables' are the only ones that would draw interest from any other team. Neal didn't go for much, really surprising cheap. Goligoski is a fine defenseman but nothing we couldn't match. Goligoski kind of in the #3 defenseman line. Letang took ice time away from him. Gonchar last year was ahead of him last yer, he's not something you would get excited about. Ok if Goligoski is the "#3 defenceman line", what is our equivalent? Weber? I doubt Dallas would have taken him for Neal, and there's no way they would have taken Gill, Wisnewski, Spacek, or Mara. If it's a d-man they were looking for, they would have asked for Subban. |
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Post by PTH on Feb 22, 2011 21:44:55 GMT -5
So we lose our kids that aren't working out/don't have a clear spot for crap like Pouliot, Gomez, Niinimaa, UFAs like Ellis and Boyd, whereas Pittsburgh gets 2 solid young players.
AARRGGG.
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Post by PTH on Feb 22, 2011 21:46:23 GMT -5
Seems like a very high price to pay for Goligoski, if you ask me. Neal could be a great power-forward, especially on Crosby and/or Malkin's wing. This could be his John Leclair moment. In the meantime, the East just keeps getting biggger... No kidding Pittsburgh made a great deal for themselves Dallas was desperate, and if they really thought Goligoski was going to make a huge impact for them, it might be worth it. Offensive D can be a huge element.... guys like Zubov and Ozolinsh went for some impressive forwards, too, as I recall, because of the impact they could have on a team. |
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Post by Skilly on Feb 23, 2011 11:17:05 GMT -5
In a trade for Neal, I don't see anyone on our roster that would interest Dallas - at least not anyone that we'd be willing to give up. Our 'untouchables' are the only ones that would draw interest from any other team. Neal didn't go for much, really surprising cheap. Goligoski is a fine defenseman but nothing we couldn't match. Goligoski kind of in the #3 defenseman line. Letang took ice time away from him. Gonchar last year was ahead of him last yer, he's not something you would get excited about. When you look at our d-corps I think a healthy Markov and Subban are better than Goligoski .... the closest comparable we have, IMO, is Wizniewski. Wiz has 38 points (21 on the PP), Goligoski had 31 points (17 on the PP) prior to being traded. Would Dallas have taken Wiz? Probably not (especially seeing what we paid to get him in the first place). Although Dallas tossed in two players to get Goligoski .... that surprises me. Goligoski is good, but he is not worth a young power forward AND a decent stay at home defenseman ... |
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