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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jul 5, 2014 11:53:45 GMT -5
Just my opinion, but I think Bergevin is possibly the best GM we've had since Serge Savard ... the only thing he hasn't been able to do that Savard did, is land that big no.1 centre ... Savard rolled the dice when he sent out two top offensive players, Keith Acton and Mark Napier, to Minnesota for Bobby Smith ... he's still looking for a goal scorer, but the team is getting bigger ... the following info provided by Bleacher:
Players in:
Tom Gilbert, P-A Parenteau, Manny Malhotra, Jiri Sekac
Players out:
Brian Gionta, Josh Gorges, Thomas Vanek, Daniel Briere, Francis Bouillon, Douglas Murray, Ryan White, George Parros
Cheers.
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Post by Habs_fan_in_LA on Jul 5, 2014 12:44:53 GMT -5
Very goog. Deleted problems and added some size.
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Post by UberCranky on Jul 5, 2014 12:52:48 GMT -5
He's done a 6 out of ten on the PP (Pollock Pole, yes, Pollock Pole, it's obscene sounding but live with it!). On the same pole, Gainey-Is-God started around 4 and then Gomez greased it to the basement.
Everything The Borg done has been logical, methodical, cautious, cold and heartless. BUT he has not traded for a masterpiece which in the end, raises him up to the exceptional rather then very competent.
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Post by GNick99 on Jul 5, 2014 13:25:04 GMT -5
I voted very good....but he hasn't been able to land the big fish to put us over the top.
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Post by Andrew on Jul 5, 2014 14:07:15 GMT -5
Very good. - The Parenteau trade was great, filling a top 6 RW need by trading a player I'd assumed was un-tradable.
- Fixed the log jam at left defence with a trade and 2 signings. Went from 5:1 to 4:3 ratio on July 1.
- Timing was right for the Gorges trade, which I'm sure was a tough decision, but the right one. Would have liked to see better return than Minnesota's 2nd round pick (likely in the 50-60 range)
- There's still a top 6 need on the RW in my opinion, and too many centres.
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Post by stoat on Jul 5, 2014 15:47:04 GMT -5
He's done a 6 out of ten on the PP (Pollock Pole, yes, Pollock Pole, it's obscene sounding but live with it!). On the same pole, Gainey-Is-God started around 4 and then Gomez greased it to the basement. Everything The Borg done has been logical, methodical, cautious, cold and heartless. BUT he has not traded for a masterpiece which in the end, raises him up to the exceptional rather then very competent. The biggest-name player he brought in, Thomas Vanek, didn't live up to our expectations. The fine tuning he did in adding Weise, Weaver, and Tokarski, however, proved more than useful in the playoffs. The contracts he got rid of have eased the Habs' cap situation. Also, they are no longer burdened with Briere (I didn't expect Briere to be gone so soon). He succeeded in convincing De la Rose to sign and come over. I don't know how to rate the Sekac signing but Bergevin wasn't alone in showing serious interest. I'm glad he didn't renew Bouillon, Murray, Gionta, and White. My only concern at this point is Subban's next contract.
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Post by Polarice on Jul 5, 2014 16:07:22 GMT -5
Average.....he made good moves, but he also signed DD, DB, Moen, Cube, he made a mistake with the bridge contract with subban.
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Post by billypilgrim on Jul 5, 2014 16:18:52 GMT -5
Very good, but the moves are more so for the 2015-16 season. This year the Habs are ripe for the picking by Milan 'I'm going to farking kill you' Lucheech.
I expect a lot of horse collaring and sucker punches with the current lineup.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jul 5, 2014 17:52:40 GMT -5
I expect a lot of horse collaring and sucker punches with the current lineup. This is a concern for sure ... I still think Bergevin has done an excellent job, though ... would be nice to land a deterrent kind of player ... how many quality ones are available ... Cheers.
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Post by Polarice on Jul 5, 2014 18:07:22 GMT -5
I expect a lot of horse collaring and sucker punches with the current lineup. This is a concern for sure ... I still think Bergevin has done an excellent job, though ... would be nice to land a deterrent kind of player ... how many quality ones are available ... Cheers. Not many......Bissonnette, Ott.
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Post by Cranky on Jul 5, 2014 18:16:32 GMT -5
Tinordi can play with the heavyweights.....but I rather not see him breaking his hand on Lucy's face. Although I love to see Lucy on a stretcher....and sucking through a straw for a couple of months.
Yes, I'm adorably mean....
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Post by Douper on Jul 5, 2014 18:33:06 GMT -5
I expect a lot of horse collaring and sucker punches with the current lineup. This is a concern for sure ... I still think Bergevin has done an excellent job, though ... would be nice to land a deterrent kind of player ... how many quality ones are available ... Cheers. Tarnasky for the bruiser games
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Post by habsask on Jul 5, 2014 18:56:49 GMT -5
I voted Very Good for the reasons mentioned & I really think that he understands how to build a team in a Cap constrained era and his moves are always done with an eye for where the team should be several years down the road.
I'll decide if he's Excellent or not in three years when I see the results.
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Post by blny on Jul 5, 2014 20:39:43 GMT -5
I voted for VG because it's better than average. The Gorges trade leak may have reduced his value somewhat, but a second isn't a terrible pick. It was a necessary move. Gilbert is a veteran guy, who in theory should fit in with our transition game a whole hell of a lot better than Gorges did. Gorges salary hit was turned into Gilbert, and most of what Weaver is getting for one year. Weaver can do what we liked most about Gorges, for half the price. Briere was turned into a significantly younger player, bigger player, on the wing, still capable of producing. Parenteau had 3 very good seasons before this year. Some will say, 'he played with Tavares'. Sure, but I believe that to play well with good players you have be pretty good yourself. A square plug in a round hole isn't going to be able to keep up with Tavares, predict his plays, be in position to finish. The lockout year was a strong year as well. This year was two knee injuries. I think he should fit in, and be able to provide 50-60 points at least.
I'm still hoping one of DD or Pleks gets turned into a legit top 6 winger. That's my only really hope for the summer. If he can flip Budaj for a pick, we clear even more cap space.
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Post by habsask on Jul 5, 2014 23:11:59 GMT -5
I voted for VG because it's better than average. The Gorges trade leak may have reduced his value somewhat, but a second isn't a terrible pick. It was a necessary move. Gilbert is a veteran guy, who in theory should fit in with our transition game a whole hell of a lot better than Gorges did. Gorges salary hit was turned into Gilbert, and most of what Weaver is getting for one year. Weaver can do what we liked most about Gorges, for half the price. Briere was turned into a significantly younger player, bigger player, on the wing, still capable of producing. Parenteau had 3 very good seasons before this year. Some will say, 'he played with Tavares'. Sure, but I believe that to play well with good players you have be pretty good yourself. A square plug in a round hole isn't going to be able to keep up with Tavares, predict his plays, be in position to finish. The lockout year was a strong year as well. This year was two knee injuries. I think he should fit in, and be able to provide 50-60 points at least. I'm still hoping one of DD or Pleks gets turned into a legit top 6 winger. That's my only really hope for the summer. If he can flip Budaj for a pick, we clear even more cap space. Good post blny. The way I look at it is that Gorges salary for 2014/15 pays for his replacement Weaver, who is a better dman, + Weise + Malhotra with $275k left over. That is great asset management! And the team ends up being incrementally better. Gainey or his Dufus successor never could have done that.
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Post by christrpn on Jul 6, 2014 6:45:22 GMT -5
I voted VG because he hasn't signed any of his plugs for more than 2 yrs. He's giving his young guys time needed to develop properly and ice a team that can compete. Will we win a cup with these guys? Probably not, but we have size AND speed AND toughness coming in the ranks and he's giving these guys time to play in Hamilton.
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Post by Tankdriver on Jul 7, 2014 9:38:43 GMT -5
Is this based on this summer or his total reign? If it is on this summer I vote incomplete. Still has to sign Subban to a reasonable offer and needs to get us another top 6 winger.
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Post by Willie Dog on Jul 7, 2014 10:01:41 GMT -5
Very good, but the moves are more so for the 2015-16 season. This year the Habs are ripe for the picking by Milan 'I'm going to farking kill you' Lucheech. I expect a lot of horse collaring and sucker punches with the current lineup. I wouldn't worry about Boston, I think they have learned that the goon game won't work and when the Habs knocked them out, they realized they didn't get the blind eye from the refs that they got in 2011. Chara is finished and so are the B's.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jul 7, 2014 10:41:26 GMT -5
Is this based on this summer or his total reign? If it is on this summer I vote incomplete. Still has to sign Subban to a reasonable offer and needs to get us another top 6 winger. I only wanted to ask about his moves in this off-season, TD ... I gave him an excellent vote because he's 'full steam ahead' with getting the club bigger ... another reason I voted that way was because he's proved to me that he's more than capable of making a hard decision (see Gorges) ... while I found the move to be somewhat cold, it was made with the best interests of the club in mind (not so much the player) ... Gainey could argue that bringing in Gomez and Gionta was in the club's best interests, but it was counterproductive and in the end the club just marked time for those years ... I don't know how he's going to bring in a goal scorer, but if his off-season moves have been any indication, it wouldn't surprise me in the least to learn that he has several irons in the fire ... Cheers.
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Post by billypilgrim on Jul 7, 2014 10:49:11 GMT -5
Very good, but the moves are more so for the 2015-16 season. This year the Habs are ripe for the picking by Milan 'I'm going to farking kill you' Lucheech. I expect a lot of horse collaring and sucker punches with the current lineup. I wouldn't worry about Boston, I think they have learned that the goon game won't work and when the Habs knocked them out, they realized they didn't get the blind eye from the refs that they got in 2011. Chara is finished and so are the B's. Wouldn't that make them more violent, not less? Boston's MO is to taunt and fight mismatched fights. Fear is what keeps them in line. Fear of our Power Play. Things almost always get out of hand when one team is leading by 3 goals, unless the Habs have a heavyweight in the lineup. The Bruins have gotten away with a lot of stuff before the Orpik incident, and they'll get away with a lot more, citing that Lucic and Chara have never been suspended as they always do when they run a goalie, sucker punch a player or run someone from behind.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jul 7, 2014 10:54:59 GMT -5
Very good, but the moves are more so for the 2015-16 season. This year the Habs are ripe for the picking by Milan 'I'm going to farking kill you' Lucheech. I expect a lot of horse collaring and sucker punches with the current lineup. I wouldn't worry about Boston, I think they have learned that the goon game won't work and when the Habs knocked them out, they realized they didn't get the blind eye from the refs that they got in 2011. Chara is finished and so are the B's. I thought we had enough of our own breaks especially down the playoff stretch ... we were getting the calls and we were getting the bounces ... that came to a crashing halt against NY ... still, it was nice to see us getting the breaks for a change ... I think the current Boston lineup is getting older and I'm not sure just how many quality prospects they have in their system ... letting go Tyler Seguin gave them some temporary, short-term gains, but Dallas got the best player in that deal ... Seguin would have been putting up points for Boston for a long time and trading him just weakened their future, IMHO ... Cheers.
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Post by seventeen on Jul 7, 2014 11:41:23 GMT -5
I wouldn't worry about Boston, I think they have learned that the goon game won't work and when the Habs knocked them out, they realized they didn't get the blind eye from the refs that they got in 2011. Chara is finished and so are the B's. Wouldn't that make them more violent, not less? Boston's MO is to taunt and fight mismatched fights. Fear is what keeps them in line. Fear of our Power Play. Things almost always get out of hand when one team is leading by 3 goals, unless the Habs have a heavyweight in the lineup. The Bruins have gotten away with a lot of stuff before the Orpik incident, and they'll get away with a lot more, citing that Lucic and Chara have never been suspended as they always do when they run a goalie, sucker punch a player or run someone from behind. They dumped Shawn Thornton, though, who was a leader in the goon category and often the first Bruin to initiate an actual fight (to save Chara and Lucic from missing time in the Box). I think that's a message that they'll be toning it down. I think they'll still 'try' stuff, because Julien seems to like that, but we showed that while it might work against the Sedins, it won't work against us. If Henrik or Daniel had stuffed their stick in Marchands gonads, he might have stopped his act as well. Besides, we have a reasonably tough team if Tinordi is in the line-up. Tinner, Prust and Moen are decent and if Bourque would ever develop a mean streak, he'd be a handful. Conner Crisp is on the way, and will be in Hamilton. If a call-up of that type is needed, he'll be there and he's cheap...a key point these days.
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Post by UberCranky on Jul 7, 2014 12:22:14 GMT -5
Crisp is a real fighter, McCarron is a hugger. Crisp is a year away and Lernout, who knows if he will make it past the AHL.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jul 7, 2014 12:23:42 GMT -5
Wouldn't that make them more violent, not less? Boston's MO is to taunt and fight mismatched fights. Fear is what keeps them in line. Fear of our Power Play. Things almost always get out of hand when one team is leading by 3 goals, unless the Habs have a heavyweight in the lineup. The Bruins have gotten away with a lot of stuff before the Orpik incident, and they'll get away with a lot more, citing that Lucic and Chara have never been suspended as they always do when they run a goalie, sucker punch a player or run someone from behind. They dumped Shawn Thornton, though, who was a leader in the goon category and often the first Bruin to initiate an actual fight (to save Chara and Lucic from missing time in the Box). I think that's a message that they'll be toning it down. I think they'll still 'try' stuff, because Julien seems to like that, but we showed that while it might work against the Sedins, it won't work against us. If Henrik or Daniel had stuffed their stick in Marchands gonads, he might have stopped his act as well. Besides, we have a reasonably tough team if Tinordi is in the line-up. Tinner, Prust and Moen are decent and if Bourque would ever develop a mean streak, he'd be a handful. Conner Crisp is on the way, and will be in Hamilton. If a call-up of that type is needed, he'll be there and he's cheap...a key point these days. I thought Lucic did more to damage the Bruins image than anyone else ... spearing opponents in the pills, then stating that 'he's not that type of player' was dismissive, and it probably gave the rest of his teammates a good laugh, but in the end it I thought it disrespected his opponents, the officials and the integrity of the game while damaging the reputation of he and his team in the process ... I thought this happened in 2011 but, on the surface anyway, it looks as if the league may have had enough ... one thing Lucic can take with him this summer is that he's a loser ... on many different levels ... there's a changing of the guard coming in the division but it can't happen fast enough pour moi ... the Bruins are getting older, the Red Wings are in a gradual rebuild and the Leafs are ... a joke ... #keepmovingforwardCheers.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jul 7, 2014 12:28:58 GMT -5
Crisp is a real fighter, McCarron is a hugger. So, we have a Chris Murray and a Dustin Penner in the system? Cheers.
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Post by The Habitual Fan on Jul 7, 2014 14:10:59 GMT -5
I think Bergevin has done a very good job since taking over and this summer. It took some time to move out the dead wood and bad contracts from the previous GM's and as much as I loved Gainey the player he did little to advance the team in his tenure while other teams passed them by. Gauthier IMO was nothing more than Gainey-Lite with no long term vision. Berg has made some big decisions from firing Price`s buddy as goalie coach to hiring a head coach he knew would have mixed reactions for the fans. He went after Vanek knowing full well he would not be able to keep him long term but gave the team a shot to win now without giving up too much future. He let the captain walk and traded a long term defenseman because they were the right things to do for the greater good. Gionta or Georges are good players and may have helped this year but under the contract for three years from now they would be a liability to live with. The current defense looks stable and each player will have a specific role that they should excel the best they can. I think the team is still missing a top 6 winger so Galy can play center and a legitimate tough guy to replace what Parros did when he was healthy. He never played much but I feel his presence was definitely felt in Boston, Toronto, Philly and by all the guys in the dressing room. This can probably be filled at the waiver wire when teams are trying to make cap room. There are consistent rumours linking the Habs to guys like Kane or Sharp and Iginla before he signed so I don`t doubt something will be addressed before training camp opens. As for PK everyone seems worried but really he isn`t going anywhere for two more years without Montreal wanting it so a deal will be done in time.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jul 7, 2014 17:45:27 GMT -5
I think Bergevin has done a very good job since taking over and this summer. It took some time to move out the dead wood and bad contracts from the previous GM's and as much as I loved Gainey the player he did little to advance the team in his tenure while other teams passed them by. Gauthier IMO was nothing more than Gainey-Lite with no long term vision. Berg has made some big decisions from firing Price`s buddy as goalie coach to hiring a head coach he knew would have mixed reactions for the fans. He went after Vanek knowing full well he would not be able to keep him long term but gave the team a shot to win now without giving up too much future. He let the captain walk and traded a long term defenseman because they were the right things to do for the greater good. Gionta or Georges are good players and may have helped this year but under the contract for three years from now they would be a liability to live with. The current defense looks stable and each player will have a specific role that they should excel the best they can. I think the team is still missing a top 6 winger so Galy can play center and a legitimate tough guy to replace what Parros did when he was healthy. He never played much but I feel his presence was definitely felt in Boston, Toronto, Philly and by all the guys in the dressing room. This can probably be filled at the waiver wire when teams are trying to make cap room. There are consistent rumours linking the Habs to guys like Kane or Sharp and Iginla before he signed so I don`t doubt something will be addressed before training camp opens. As for PK everyone seems worried but really he isn`t going anywhere for two more years without Montreal wanting it so a deal will be done in time. I thought Gainey was doing just fine until he and his coaches lost control of that young team ... that, and when he decided to change the direction of the team it set us back just about to square one ... I felt Gauthier had a vision for the future when he drafted Tinordi and Beaulieu ... however, he turned Montreal into a circus and it wasn't a good place to be with him running the show ... Cheers.
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Post by habsorbed on Jul 8, 2014 0:31:55 GMT -5
I think Bergevin has done a very good job since taking over and this summer. It took some time to move out the dead wood and bad contracts from the previous GM's and as much as I loved Gainey the player he did little to advance the team in his tenure while other teams passed them by. Gauthier IMO was nothing more than Gainey-Lite with no long term vision. Berg has made some big decisions from firing Price`s buddy as goalie coach to hiring a head coach he knew would have mixed reactions for the fans. He went after Vanek knowing full well he would not be able to keep him long term but gave the team a shot to win now without giving up too much future. He let the captain walk and traded a long term defenseman because they were the right things to do for the greater good. Gionta or Georges are good players and may have helped this year but under the contract for three years from now they would be a liability to live with. The current defense looks stable and each player will have a specific role that they should excel the best they can. I think the team is still missing a top 6 winger so Galy can play center and a legitimate tough guy to replace what Parros did when he was healthy. He never played much but I feel his presence was definitely felt in Boston, Toronto, Philly and by all the guys in the dressing room. This can probably be filled at the waiver wire when teams are trying to make cap room. There are consistent rumours linking the Habs to guys like Kane or Sharp and Iginla before he signed so I don`t doubt something will be addressed before training camp opens. As for PK everyone seems worried but really he isn`t going anywhere for two more years without Montreal wanting it so a deal will be done in time. Didn't Gainey also let a diminutive captain walk as a FA, as well as some others. In fact i believe that was the beginning of the end as shortly thereafter we ended up with the three amigos. Gomer who was a complete bust (and we gave up a huge asset), Cammy who was overrated and overpriced. And Gio who played his role but I can't say he did a better job than Saku would have done. For MB: he's still in the middle of the rebuild so steady as she goes. But still has some work to do to fill out this line up.
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Post by stoat on Jul 15, 2014 13:37:05 GMT -5
I'd say VG. In his 2-year tenure he brought in some useful veterans (Prust, Weaver, Weise, Malhotra, Gilbert). His draft choices are interesting. His signing of Sekac and the drafting of Scherbak may turn out very well. Getting Buffalo's second rounder for Gorges was a surprisingly good return. He redeemed himself for the Briere signing. Not signing Bouillon, Murray, Gionta, Parros, and White cleared space. The Vanek rental didn't do much harm. Signing a new goaltending coach may have been his best move. Hab fans should be thankful that he stuck with Bourque. The only worrisome issue is Subban's status (and Eller's).
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Post by PTH on Jul 15, 2014 22:42:42 GMT -5
Getting Buffalo's second rounder for Gorges was a surprisingly good return. It would've been a great return if he'd actually gotten it, since it's pretty sure to be in the 30-35 range. But he didn't. He got us Minnesota's second rounder, likely to be a dozen spots later...
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