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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jan 22, 2015 19:00:17 GMT -5
I've been using that website for years ... always forgot to check CapGeek ...
Cheers.
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Post by Boston_Habs on Jan 23, 2015 9:59:56 GMT -5
I have question marks about Gonchar too, unless MT starts to give him some games off. Heck putting Weaver into his place wouldn't hurt that much. We lose some offense, but lose nothing on defense. A few games rest would work wonders for a 40year old, and for Markov as well. Hopefully, toward the end of the season, if a playoff spot is in the bag, MT can rotate a few of our oldies. Makes sense and you can argue that it's Beaulieu that is anchoring that pair and not Gonchar. I think Beaulieu with Weaver on the right side is a decent 3rd pair and a way to manage Gonchar's minutes. I don't think the plan was for Gonchar to be a fixture in the top 4 but that's kind of how things have worked out. Risky, though. I'd feel better if that wasn't the case. As for Tinordi, it's either a numbers game or Berg must be seeing things he doesn't like because I actually like Tinordi a lot. The mistakes are to be expected but he's actually a better skater and puck handler than he gets credit for and he has the size and toughness to be effective down low in pressure situations. Bergevin is a former dman and knows what he likes so you have to trust him, but I'm thinking that he wishes he had a "do over" on the Emelin contract. I loved Alexei and the big hits, but at $4 million a year for the next 3 years he is a grossly overpaid 3rd pair guy.
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Post by jkr on Jan 23, 2015 10:27:53 GMT -5
I don't what happened to Emelin. He doesn't hit anybody any more. It seems like the last time he did hit someone, he was injured ( on Lucic) and now he's gun shy. Without that aspect of his game he's very, very ordinary.
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Post by habsorbed on Jan 23, 2015 12:06:13 GMT -5
I don't what happened to Emelin. He doesn't hit anybody any more. It seems like the last time he did hit someone, he was injured ( on Lucic) and now he's gun shy. Without that aspect of his game he's very, very ordinary. He's not even ordinary. He's a liability with excessive unforced turnovers and icings. He does seem to get up for the Bruins still and was great last year in the playoffs but if he wants to earn his $4 then he's got to play like that all the time. I'd much rather Weaver or tinordi in the line up than emeiln. In fact , now that Bourque (remember him - sorry to ruin everyone's Friday) is gone Emeiln is my whipping boy.
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Post by Skilly on Jan 23, 2015 16:19:46 GMT -5
I don't what happened to Emelin. He doesn't hit anybody any more. It seems like the last time he did hit someone, he was injured ( on Lucic) and now he's gun shy. Without that aspect of his game he's very, very ordinary. I think Emelin is just trying to protect himself. Every bone crunching hit he makes is followed by someone trying to mug him ... And remember , he can't fight due to his metal plate. So a lot of the league probably considers him a chicken, cause he won't back up his hits with fights when the other team wants a little payback. That's the hockey culture. Now, if Emelin knew someone would do that for him ..... But we don't have anyone like that.
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Post by Polarice on Jan 23, 2015 16:28:59 GMT -5
He leads the team in hits again this year.....not sure what more we can ask in that department.
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Post by habsorbed on Jan 23, 2015 19:11:40 GMT -5
He leads the team in hits again this year.....not sure what more we can ask in that department. If tinordi got emeiln's ice time i suspect tinordi would lead the team. And fewer turnovers and would answer the bell if a fight was needed.
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Post by HFTO on Jan 23, 2015 19:20:34 GMT -5
Have seen Tinordi twice post fight...don't get it?? Beaulieu with a month under his belt is already pushing upwards. Tinordi would do the same IMO...and even if he didn't next year he'd be in a much better position...unless MB makes significant adds this team is a couple years away barring CP321 playing out of his mind.
HFTO
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Post by seventeen on Jan 23, 2015 23:01:04 GMT -5
He didn't play tonight and I don't know if he's injured or if it was a coach's decision. Dogs beat Marlies 3-0, Condon in goal.
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Post by stoat on Jan 24, 2015 1:52:48 GMT -5
Coaches play their best players, they don't have the time to teach players the fundamentals of the game, that's what the minors are for. Even Marc said that Jared had to work on his skating. Smaller markets can get away with it because they don't have the demand for winning that the bigger markets have. If a coach makes a mistake or two by playing the kids they can get away with it. In a bigger market they loose their job. are They may not be as numerous but I have my doubts that fans in smaller markets are less intense than those in the traditional cities and that they are more tolerant of losing teams. We can judge it when attendances drop.
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Post by stoat on Jan 24, 2015 1:57:54 GMT -5
I have question marks about Gonchar too, unless MT starts to give him some games off. Heck putting Weaver into his place wouldn't hurt that much. We lose some offense, but lose nothing on defense. A few games rest would work wonders for a 40year old, and for Markov as well. Hopefully, toward the end of the season, if a playoff spot is in the bag, MT can rotate a few of our oldies. Makes sense and you can argue that it's Beaulieu that is anchoring that pair and not Gonchar. I think Beaulieu with Weaver on the right side is a decent 3rd pair and a way to manage Gonchar's minutes. I don't think the plan was for Gonchar to be a fixture in the top 4 but that's kind of how things have worked out. Risky, though. I'd feel better if that wasn't the case. As for Tinordi, it's either a numbers game or Berg must be seeing things he doesn't like because I actually like Tinordi a lot. The mistakes are to be expected but he's actually a better skater and puck handler than he gets credit for and he has the size and toughness to be effective down low in pressure situations. Bergevin is a former dman and knows what he likes so you have to trust him, but I'm thinking that he wishes he had a "do over" on the Emelin contract. I loved Alexei and the big hits, but at $4 million a year for the next 3 years he is a grossly overpaid 3rd pair guy. I don't think Bergevin traded for Gonchar primarily because he was hot for Gonchar. It was probably more to get rid of Moen's contract. Chances are that Gonchar won't be re-signed. If he is, I'll freely admit I was wrong,
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Post by stoat on Jan 24, 2015 1:59:57 GMT -5
I don't what happened to Emelin. He doesn't hit anybody any more. It seems like the last time he did hit someone, he was injured ( on Lucic) and now he's gun shy. Without that aspect of his game he's very, very ordinary. Doe the Habs have 6 Dmen who are better than Emelin?
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Post by stoat on Jan 24, 2015 2:02:33 GMT -5
He leads the team in hits again this year.....not sure what more we can ask in that department. If tinordi got emeiln's ice time i suspect tinordi would lead the team. And fewer turnovers and would answer the bell if a fight was needed. Maybe, but I haven't been impressed by Tinordi so far.
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Post by frozone on Jan 24, 2015 10:08:26 GMT -5
He didn't play tonight and I don't know if he's injured or if it was a coach's decision. Dogs beat Marlies 3-0, Condon in goal. He was out of the lineup due to illness (flu). I won't expect him to be back in the lineup for tonight's game but who knows.
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Post by seventeen on Jan 24, 2015 10:19:16 GMT -5
He didn't play tonight and I don't know if he's injured or if it was a coach's decision. Dogs beat Marlies 3-0, Condon in goal. He was out of the lineup due to illness (flu). I won't expect him to be back in the lineup for tonight's game but who knows. Thanks.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jan 24, 2015 10:57:54 GMT -5
Makes sense and you can argue that it's Beaulieu that is anchoring that pair and not Gonchar. I think Beaulieu with Weaver on the right side is a decent 3rd pair and a way to manage Gonchar's minutes. I don't think the plan was for Gonchar to be a fixture in the top 4 but that's kind of how things have worked out. Risky, though. I'd feel better if that wasn't the case. As for Tinordi, it's either a numbers game or Berg must be seeing things he doesn't like because I actually like Tinordi a lot. The mistakes are to be expected but he's actually a better skater and puck handler than he gets credit for and he has the size and toughness to be effective down low in pressure situations. Bergevin is a former dman and knows what he likes so you have to trust him, but I'm thinking that he wishes he had a "do over" on the Emelin contract. I loved Alexei and the big hits, but at $4 million a year for the next 3 years he is a grossly overpaid 3rd pair guy. I don't think Bergevin traded for Gonchar primarily because he was hot for Gonchar. It was probably more to get rid of Moen's contract. Chances are that Gonchar won't be re-signed. If he is, I'll freely admit I was wrong, He's certainly getting more bang for his buck with Gonchar ... a few people have already mentioned the mentoring he's providing Beaulieu and in that context I think Berg got a more of a return ... edit: I kind of feel bad for Tinordi not being able to benefit from Gonchar's experience the way Beaulieu has ... Cheers.
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Post by Willie Dog on Jan 24, 2015 11:02:11 GMT -5
I don't think Bergevin traded for Gonchar primarily because he was hot for Gonchar. It was probably more to get rid of Moen's contract. Chances are that Gonchar won't be re-signed. If he is, I'll freely admit I was wrong, He's certainly getting more bang for his buck with Gonchar ... a few people have already mentioned the mentoring he's providing Beaulieu and in that context I think Berg got a more of a return ... edit: I kind of feel bad for Tinordi not being able to benefit from Gonchar's experience the way Beaulieu has ... Cheers. I agree Rick. I think Beau has the confidence now and i would like to see Tinordi brought up and given the same opportunity to learn.
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Post by seventeen on Jan 24, 2015 11:11:51 GMT -5
He's certainly getting more bang for his buck with Gonchar ... a few people have already mentioned the mentoring he's providing Beaulieu and in that context I think Berg got a more of a return ... edit: I kind of feel bad for Tinordi not being able to benefit from Gonchar's experience the way Beaulieu has ... Cheers. I'd like to know if Gonchar really is 'mentoring' Beaulieu or if it's a case of two players just meshing well together. Beaulieu has gained a lot of confidence and while he's made the occasional mistake, MT hasn't nailed him to the bench after that's happened. I think that's probably as big a factor as anything Gonchar may have done. Does anyone have any knowledge of Gonchar 'teaching' Beaulieu any techniques? While I like the idea of a player 'mentoring' another, no one has every made that statement of Markov, yet Markov's partners all seem to play quite well. In some cases, he's made their careers.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jan 24, 2015 12:01:09 GMT -5
He's certainly getting more bang for his buck with Gonchar ... a few people have already mentioned the mentoring he's providing Beaulieu and in that context I think Berg got a more of a return ... edit: I kind of feel bad for Tinordi not being able to benefit from Gonchar's experience the way Beaulieu has ... Cheers. I'd like to know if Gonchar really is 'mentoring' Beaulieu or if it's a case of two players just meshing well together. Beaulieu has gained a lot of confidence and while he's made the occasional mistake, MT hasn't nailed him to the bench after that's happened. I think that's probably as big a factor as anything Gonchar may have done. Does anyone have any knowledge of Gonchar 'teaching' Beaulieu any techniques? While I like the idea of a player 'mentoring' another, no one has every made that statement of Markov, yet Markov's partners all seem to play quite well. In some cases, he's made their careers. Guess it depends on your definition of 'mentoring' ... as a 23-year soldier and a 12-year teacher/prof, I can tell you that 'mentoring' occurs quite frequently whether the word, proper, is used or not ... case in point; several of the young privates I mentored back in the day now troop warrant officers, company sergeant-majors, etc (some have left the service and some are MCpls and Sgts ... that's the way it goes) ... I didn't tell them "I'm mentoring you now" ... as a military instructor I can tell you that many of my students have returned to the school as instructors, themselves ... again, I didn't tell them they were being mentored ... all I did was give them the best chance I could at succeeding ... if my experiences aren't enough maybe consider what Pat Hickey writes ... Habs Gonchar Mentors Beaulieu ... Cheers.
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Post by frozone on Jan 24, 2015 13:16:17 GMT -5
Reading through this thread makes me realize that development of our defensive prospects has been a serious weakness over many years now. I can't think of many defensemen that we have drafted and successfully developed in North America. There's PK obviously, and McDonagh, Robidas, Beauchemin and Hainsey have made it with other clubs. I know MB has patched some holes in the development program, but I'm still worried about development of the D prospects. We probably shouldn't count on Beaulieu and Tinordi both having successful years with the Habs... that is if history is any guide.
I'm pretty sure MB realized that Gonchar would have a positive impact on a young defenseman like Beaulieu. Sometimes, to have a positive influence, all you have to do is set a good example. At the very least, Gonchar does just that. It sounds like he has very good habits, a good attitude, prepares well for games, etc - a true professional. At only 22 years old, I'm sure Beaulieu is learning tons from him, even if it's just through observation.
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Post by seventeen on Jan 24, 2015 16:54:31 GMT -5
I totally agree about the variety of 'mentoring' that can go on. I just hadn't read anything where for example, Beaulieu mentions having learned something by watching how Gonchar handled it...whether on or off the ice.
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Post by Willie Dog on Jan 27, 2015 12:51:25 GMT -5
Below is a link to an interesting article showing Emelin's numbers and the writer concludes that if MB can move him he should, if he can't then pehaps MB should see if there is a spot for him in the KHL, like Lou Lamoriello (given the KHLs money woes, not sure that will happen) Is it time to say goodbye to Alexei Emelin?
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Post by habsorbed on Jan 27, 2015 13:28:21 GMT -5
Below is a link to an interesting article showing Emelin's numbers and the writer concludes that if MB can move him he should, if he can't then pehaps MB should see if there is a spot for him in the KHL, like Lou Lamoriello (given the KHLs money woes, not sure that will happen) Is it time to say goodbye to Alexei Emelin?Interesting article and confirms what i've been saying all season: Emelin is awful. But the article seems to suggest that Emeiln has for the most part been used as a bottom third dman during his career. Maybe I'm wrong but until recently, wan't he a top 4 guy, often playing with markov? Does any team sign a contract to pay $4+ for a bottom 3 D?
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Post by stoat on Jan 27, 2015 13:45:00 GMT -5
We've seen the improvement in Beaulieu. He's ready and isn't a liability. I wish I could say the same about Tinordi. He hasn't had even one standout game yet and I can't tell if he'll ever be a capable NHL Dman. Of course, I'm not a hockey professional, so I may be all wet.
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Post by BadCompany on Jan 27, 2015 14:39:01 GMT -5
Below is a link to an interesting article showing Emelin's numbers and the writer concludes that if MB can move him he should, if he can't then pehaps MB should see if there is a spot for him in the KHL, like Lou Lamoriello (given the KHLs money woes, not sure that will happen) Is it time to say goodbye to Alexei Emelin?The issue I have with that article is that it keeps saying things like "worst of his career" and "below his career average". Would we be selling low? Giving up on him too soon? Don't get me wrong, I'm disappointed in his play this year too, but you don't want to give up on a guy too early.
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Post by GNick99 on Jan 27, 2015 14:53:07 GMT -5
Below is a link to an interesting article showing Emelin's numbers and the writer concludes that if MB can move him he should, if he can't then pehaps MB should see if there is a spot for him in the KHL, like Lou Lamoriello (given the KHLs money woes, not sure that will happen) Is it time to say goodbye to Alexei Emelin?Interesting article and confirms what i've been saying all season: Emelin is awful. But the article seems to suggest that Emeiln has for the most part been used as a bottom third dman during his career. Maybe I'm wrong but until recently, wan't he a top 4 guy, often playing with markov? Does any team sign a contract to pay $4+ for a bottom 3 D? Bergs giving average players big, long term contracts seems to hamper their value to Habs. This is 3rd time it has happened... Emelin, Deshairnais, Moen, Eller could be argued also. Maybe its best to let average players test the open market and replace from within?
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Post by seventeen on Jan 27, 2015 14:54:23 GMT -5
I wouldn't be trading him yet. I don't mind the way Therrien is using him now , (Yes, me agreeing with MT. Has hell frozen over?) Unless he works his way up to the second pairing again, though, that contract is going to hurt Bergs reputation. Hasn't he done this a few times too often? Berg, I mean, not Emelin. DD, Briere, Emelin. While I like locking in a player, you also want to be confident he's worth it. Not the case so far with Emelin or Briere. DD's is still debatable. That subject might be worth its own thread.
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Post by franko on Mar 19, 2015 19:51:50 GMT -5
Capgeek is off line indefiitely. The founder is facing serious health issues. You can try www.nhlnumbers.com. I've only gone as far as the 1st page there so I don't know if it's as in depth as Capgeek was. Matthew Wuest, founder of capgeek, died of cancer today.
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Post by BadCompany on Mar 26, 2015 6:43:42 GMT -5
Tinordi's dad speaking for Jared again. This time revealing that Tinordi played his last stint in Montreal with an injured wrist, assumedly the one that now has him out for three weeks.
So now both Tinordi and Bournival have confirmed that they played when they shouldn't have been playing. By-product of depth? Therrien's tactics "forcing" younsters to hide injuries? Doctor's errors? Or is this the same as it ever was? Hockey culture and all that?
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Post by Disp on Mar 26, 2015 6:49:11 GMT -5
At this point in the season, most players are probably banged up. If a guy doesn't say anything, or minimizes his injury, what can you do? If I was on the fringe of the nhl, trying to make it, it would take an amputation to keep me out. I'd lie my ass off.
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