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Post by CentreHice on May 20, 2015 13:42:47 GMT -5
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Post by franko on May 20, 2015 13:53:30 GMT -5
I'll be damned. The one time Leaf fans said somebody wants to come to Toronto, it actually happens! might be a difference between wanting to come and not being able to say no. |
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Post by habsorbed on May 21, 2015 0:58:36 GMT -5
In true leafs fashion, they can spend hoards of money when there is no applicable cap. And now they're praising Shanny for being so magnificent. We'll see how he does when he's unable to induce/seduce a player with an open vault. Leafs must be longing for their hey day in the 90's before the cap was born.
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Post by jkr on May 21, 2015 6:22:30 GMT -5
In true leafs fashion, they can spend hoards of money when there is no applicable cap. And now they're praising Shanny for being so magnificent. We'll see how he does when he's unable to induce/seduce a player with an open vault. Leafs must be longing for their hey day in the 90's before the cap was born. I don't understand all the praise for Shanahan. Opening your wallet is hardly a stroke of genius. |
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Post by CentreHice on May 21, 2015 6:56:05 GMT -5
In true leafs fashion, they can spend hoards of money when there is no applicable cap. And now they're praising Shanny for being so magnificent. We'll see how he does when he's unable to induce/seduce a player with an open vault. Leafs must be longing for their hey day in the 90's before the cap was born. I don't understand all the praise for Shanahan. Opening your wallet is hardly a stroke of genius. Which is exactly how Leiweke lured Shanahan away from the NHL head offices.  I'm gonna make him an offer he can't refuse…The ONLY thing that's keeping Shanahan "patient" with his roster is the salary cap. |
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Post by BadCompany on May 21, 2015 7:08:31 GMT -5
While I am loathe to praise anything Toronto let's not forget that Randy Carlyle had that team in a playoff spot just before he got fired. Which considering the mess they were in was quite something. Toronto's biggest problem wasn't lack of talent (I'd take their roster over Buffalo's for example), but the off-ice circus that went on there. Babcock buys them time to get the rest of their house in order.
It's too much money of course, and too much term, but it's not like the Leafs care about either. All they care about is getting through the next three years, while they rebuild the organization the right way. And they needed a name to help them do that. So they got one.
I hate to say it, but this is a good move by Toronto.
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Post by CentreHice on May 21, 2015 7:17:42 GMT -5
Sure….one would think that the media will bow and scrape at the feet of Babcock…and, as you say, buy the Leafs time…
But this deal, and the way it went down (i.e. leaving Buffalo twisting once again), just might have eroded that respect.
I'm hoping his ego leads him to be dismissive of the media….a "How dare you question me?" attitude.
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Post by jkr on May 21, 2015 7:27:58 GMT -5
Sure….one would think that the media will bow and scrape at the feet of Babcock…and, as you say, buy the Leafs time… But this deal, and the way it went down (i.e. leaving Buffalo twisting once again), just might have eroded that respect. I'm hoping his ego leads him to be dismissive of the media….a "How dare you question me?" attitude. Not just the Tim Murray - how about Guy Boucher. Sounds like both these people got screwed over. |
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Post by Willie Dog on May 21, 2015 7:31:34 GMT -5
Leaf nation will be thumping their chest all summer.
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Post by Gogie on May 21, 2015 7:44:50 GMT -5
Leaf nation will be thumping their chest all summer. Unfortunately for Leaf fans they play the games in the winter, by which time the leaves Leafs will have fallen off the tree under the bus. |
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Post by CentreHice on May 21, 2015 7:50:51 GMT -5
So much for listening to TSN690's morning show.
One of the hosts is a Leafs' fan….I think it's Elliott Price (who sounds remarkably like Gord Miller).
I'll wait for Marinaro at 10.
==========================================
EDIT: I moved this thread here.
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Post by CentreHice on May 21, 2015 13:01:59 GMT -5
Babcock at his presser:
“Whether you believe it or not, I feel this is Canada’s team. We need to put Canada’s team back on the map.”
Yay!
Whatever, dude.
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Post by franko on May 21, 2015 13:07:26 GMT -5
Babcock at his presser: “Whether you believe it or not, I feel this is Canada’s team. We need to put Canada’s team back on the map.”Yay! Whatever, dude. pandering already, wonder if it was in the contract. I guess once you've sold out . . . |
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Post by blny on May 21, 2015 15:01:03 GMT -5
Who says Babcock isn't a good salesman?
AFAIC, he's got free reign for the next 4 years. He knows that many of the names are going to change this summer. He knows that mgt are going to strip it down to the studs as much as they can. He also has guarantees that he won't be made the scape goat in that window. He's all but guaranteed the full 8 years.
My only piece of advice to him would be to consult Kessel and Phaneuf before they're traded. Both know the quick way to the Muskokas.
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Post by NWTHabsFan on May 21, 2015 15:07:26 GMT -5
My only piece of advice to him would be to consult Kessel and Phaneuf before they're traded. Both know the quick way to the Muskokas. ...and the best early season golf courses. Cannot have millionaires slumming it on winter greens.  |
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Post by Willie Dog on May 21, 2015 15:23:46 GMT -5
Babcock at his presser: “Whether you believe it or not, I feel this is Canada’s team. We need to put Canada’s team back on the map.”Yay! Whatever, dude. pandering already, wonder if it was in the contract. I guess once you've sold out . . . When Babs is in MTL someone needs to ask him who is Canada's team? Clown.... would be nice for him and Shammy to fail miserably. |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on May 21, 2015 15:56:27 GMT -5
No smoked meat for you, Babs.
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Post by CentreHice on May 21, 2015 17:34:57 GMT -5
Ironic statement or what?
How can any team be Canada's Team if they're not even on the map?
It's a self-imposed assertion, fuelled by the fans and media....and reeks of arrogance.
THAT'S why I dislike that organization so much. They've won jack squat since May 2nd, 1967. Sgt. Pepper's wouldn't be released for another month. The top-rated prime-time TV shows were Bonanza and The Red Skelton Hour. The #1 song on the radio was Somethin' Stupid (appropriately) by Nancy and Frank Sinatra.
Yet, year after year, we've been bombarded with Leafs this and Leafs that....shoved down our throats on our national broadcaster by the likes of sycophant (psycho fan) Don Cherry and the rest of the toadies at CBC.
The only respite we've had from that occurrence, was this year...when SN decided to NOT show their embarrassment of a team on a Saturday night.
And now....right back at it. Zero humility. All bravado...all the time.
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Post by seventeen on May 21, 2015 20:01:25 GMT -5
While I am loathe to praise anything Toronto let's not forget that Randy Carlyle had that team in a playoff spot just before he got fired. Which considering the mess they were in was quite something. Toronto's biggest problem wasn't lack of talent (I'd take their roster over Buffalo's for example), but the off-ice circus that went on there. Babcock buys them time to get the rest of their house in order. It's too much money of course, and too much term, but it's not like the Leafs care about either. All they care about is getting through the next three years, while they rebuild the organization the right way. And they needed a name to help them do that. So they got one. I hate to say it, but this is a good move by Toronto. I think he's going to be an improvement on Horacek (Thanks Captain Obvious). I wonder how much of an improvement over Carlyle, though, who's a pretty good coach himself. Buys time, definitely, but Shanahan's going to be GM. No one else will want to be in that position. |
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Post by CentreHice on May 22, 2015 9:32:07 GMT -5
Babcock said the Sabres offered him more money than the Leafs did.
The Sabres have not refuted that claim. So now the media is saying that Babcock "didn't go to the Leafs just for the money". Whatever…..
Wonder what Murray offered.
I doubt the deal broke down the same way, though.
Would the Sabres have agreed to the front-loaded aspect?
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Post by Skilly on May 22, 2015 10:07:29 GMT -5
Babcock said the Sabres offered him more money than the Leafs did. The Sabres have not refuted that claim. So now the media is saying that Babcock "didn't go to the Leafs just for the money". Whatever….. Wonder what Murray offered. I doubt the deal broke down the same way, though. Would the Sabres have agreed to the front-loaded aspect? Thats smoke and mirrors, playing with numbers ... Sabres could have offered 10yrs, 55 million, 5.5 million a year That's more money than 8yrs, 50 million, 8-8-8-8-5-5-4-4 |
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Post by CentreHice on May 22, 2015 10:26:34 GMT -5
Very plausible. The total $$ might've been more (SPIN begins and ends there)….but the terms likely weren't close. (I'm sure Buffalo's terms will come out somewhere.)
It's been reliably reported that the Leafs also offered a 10-year term. But Babcock wanted only 8. (He's 52….perhaps he wants to retire from coaching at age 60.)
With the front-loaded aspect…bucks-per-year over Babcock's desired 8-year term…Toronto was no doubt clearly tops.
Under your likely scenario, Skilly…
Buffalo after 3 years: $16.5 million.
Toronto after 3 years: $24 million.
Buffalo after 8 years: $44 million.
Toronto after 8 years: $50 million.
No brainer to go to the Leafs.
"Whatever it takes, Mike. We can afford it."
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Post by seventeen on May 22, 2015 10:38:12 GMT -5
Not that I'm agreeing with Babcock's choice, but I don't think I'd like to work for Tim Murray.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on May 22, 2015 11:57:34 GMT -5
Babcock said the Sabres offered him more money than the Leafs did. The Sabres have not refuted that claim. So now the media is saying that Babcock "didn't go to the Leafs just for the money". Whatever….. Wonder what Murray offered. I doubt the deal broke down the same way, though. Would the Sabres have agreed to the front-loaded aspect? There are three sides to any argument ... 'this side', 'that side' and the truth ... anything he says at this point is coming out like Charlie Brown's teacher ... it has little to do with putting the Leafs back on the map, and everything to do with $50 million bucks ... but, hey, show me that kind of scratch and I'd be telling people what they wanted to hear ... no worries ... wouldn't feel bad about it either ... Cheers. |
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Post by 24andcounting on May 22, 2015 12:26:51 GMT -5
Babcock said the Sabres offered him more money than the Leafs did. The Sabres have not refuted that claim. So now the media is saying that Babcock "didn't go to the Leafs just for the money". Whatever….. Wonder what Murray offered. I doubt the deal broke down the same way, though. Would the Sabres have agreed to the front-loaded aspect? There are three sides to any argument ... 'this side', 'that side' and the truth ... anything he says at this point is coming out like Charlie Brown's teacher ... it has little to do with putting the Leafs back on the map, and everything to do with $50 million bucks ... but, hey, show me that kind of scratch and I'd be telling people what they wanted to hear ... no worries ... wouldn't feel bad about it either ... Cheers. This, exactly. He even said the Leafs weren't on his radar initially, not even close to contention after Shanny's initial pitch. I'll bet things changed though after Shanny started whispering those sweet numbers in his ear... |
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Post by CentreHice on May 22, 2015 12:57:58 GMT -5
Agreed. And he's already established the criticism/expectation forcefield for the first few years.
Terms he's already used: Massive, massive challenge. Process, process, process….extremely difficult….patience….
I can hear him now at the first hint of unrest from the media, in any one of the first 3 and maybe 4 years…..
"What did I say when I was hired? Next question…."
The Toronto media have been all but neutered until the 2018-19 season….and he'll have collected $24 million.
Unless he gets increased results every year…it'll be fun to watch the dance.
I can really see other teams/coaches being extra-motivated to beat the Leafs now...especially the Sabres, who should become immediately better with Eichel.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on May 22, 2015 17:24:36 GMT -5
There are three sides to any argument ... 'this side', 'that side' and the truth ... anything he says at this point is coming out like Charlie Brown's teacher ... it has little to do with putting the Leafs back on the map, and everything to do with $50 million bucks ... but, hey, show me that kind of scratch and I'd be telling people what they wanted to hear ... no worries ... wouldn't feel bad about it either ... Cheers. This, exactly. He even said the Leafs weren't on his radar initially, not even close to contention after Shanny's initial pitch. I'll bet things changed though after Shanny started whispering those sweet numbers in his ear... I read on Twitter that the last thing Brendan Shanahan said to Mike Babcock was, "... don't sign anything until you talk to me (paraphrase)" ... that came from a journalist, but I forget which one ... what's odd now is just how many of the Leaf faithful are buying into the, it's-not-about-the-money, story ... CBC is running with that (quelle suprise!) ... I was also surprised to see some comments made on CBC's bias towards the Leafs, not because it was odd to see it, but I had a post censored a few weeks ago that expressed the same concern ... I honestly didn't think CBC was beyond criticism, but they seem to think they are and that really did surprise me ... Babcock signs with Toronto is a national story and it's given Leaf Nation renewed hope ... the Leafs always played well against Montreal whether they lost or not ... if we had trouble with them this year, they're going to be pretty tough to beat next year ... they were contending for a playoff spot when they let Randy Carlyle go and ever since then they've been the league's best joke ... not next year me thinks ... Cheers. |
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Post by CentreHice on May 22, 2015 17:41:39 GMT -5
When I was growing up, Montreal had its own crew on CBC Saturday night. Danny Gallivan and Dick Irvin.
I lived in SW Ontario, so I got the Leafs and Bill Hewitt.
Both Hewitt and Gallivan called a fair game, though. I remember getting angry with Gallivan whenever he'd praise the opposition.
But ever since the 1993 Cherry-Gilmour kiss, the CBC/HNIC has been 100% Leafs….with Cherry leading the way. An anti-Hab undertone also developed.
I don't think we've seen anything yet with this Babcock-hype. It's just gonna continue to ramp up to a fever pitch for Game 1.
Gee, I wonder who they'll be playing….
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Post by CentreHice on May 22, 2015 18:14:24 GMT -5
I read on Twitter that the last thing Brendan Shanahan said to Mike Babcock was, "... don't sign anything until you talk to me (paraphrase)" ... that came from a journalist, but I forget which one ... Cheers. I think the sticking point was the term. Ken Holland, on TSN690, said Babcock wanted 8 years…and Detroit would go only to 5. (Babcock must really want to retire at 60, or something.) I can see it going something like this…. Shanahan meet with Babcock for 2 days in Prague (as per Holland). They hammer out a $50 million, 10-year deal, but Babcock still wants to see if he can get an 8-year deal somewhere else. Babcock continues shopping, with the agreement to call Shanahan before signing with anyone else, as mentioned above. Babcock meets with Murray and tells him the Leafs' offer. Murray can't go lower than 10 years….butl raises it to $55 million. (Babcock said he was offered more money by the Sabres. i.e the main argument being spun in the "he really wanted to coach the Leafs" spin) Babcock calls Shanahan. "Well, Shanny, I didn't get the 8 years, but I got more money." Shanny gives him his 8 years….and front-loads the first 3 years to offset the $5 million he's leaving on Buffalo's table. Babcock wins HUGE! And why not? He held all the cards. When a Leaf fan says he didn't come just for the money…my response will be, "I agree. He came for the front-loaded term, too." |
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Post by CentreHice on May 22, 2015 20:33:18 GMT -5
I left Cherry on by mistake. But I'm glad I did. The Babcock-era is going to be intolerable for non-Leaf fans. If we thought our main broadcasters were Toronto-centric before.... Cherry showed a clip of Babcock on McCown's show--allegedly making Don's point that the Leafs don't have enough Ontario boys. One problem: Cherry has complained because the Leafs don't draft them. Babcock was talking about luring the great Ontario-born players to Toronto once they're available: e.g. Stamkos in a couple of years. But that didn't stop Cherry from making the link. Ron and Don then echoed/reinforced the "Canada's Team" BS. Enough about those sell-outs. It's what Babcock said to McCown that got me. "How many Ontario-born players are there in the league?" (Inferring that because there are so many, that they're the best...and how much better they'd be playing for Toronto, no doubt.) He said those players have stayed away because the environment hasn't been safe....(i.e. the Leafs suck and the city is too tough on them.) "Once we make it safe, they're comin' home," he asserted. Arrogance and populism at its best. The saviour coach is here....he'll make it safe...and the local saviour players will come home. ======================================= If Ontario boys are the best, how many of them was Babcock able to lure to his safe environment in Detroit? He'd been there for 10 years. Lots of time to lure them, no? This year, there were only 4 Ontario-born Red Wings....and only 1 was a pickup, and could hardly be called a great player, especially at the end of his career. Stephen Weiss, a 32-year-old vet. Riley Sheahan, a Detroit draft pick. Kyle Quincey, a Detroit draft pick. Brendan Smith, a Detroit draft pick. 23 players born elsewhere, comprised of: 7 Swedes 4 Czechs 3 from Michigan 2 Russians 2 from New York 1 Slovak 1 from New Jersey 1 from Newfoundland 1 from Manitoba 1 from British Columbia And who were his 3 best players during his decade in Detroit, without whom there would've been no parade in 07-08? Datsyuk, Zetterberg, and Lidstrom. Three fine examples of Ontario-born boys!  Babcock's really setting that Toronto table, isn't he? Plenty of seats for the gullible. All-you-can-eat! |
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