WJC 2021

[Cranky]

Guhle is getting a lot of ice time despite his first goal brain cramp. They ned to shut down the Yanks cycle so they need a leg breaker...lol

[Cranky]

Yeeesshhh...they better win because there is a woman 5 feet from me who's making more noise the a 1000 excited turkeys....

[Cranky]

Aside from a few hiccups, we played lights out and lost.

It happens.

Byram...wow.

Guhle...good but needs more quickness.

Caufield....he is what he is....and there should be no illusions that he needs to work on. Get stronger, more speed/quickness and pain level for the dirty areas. Otherwise DD has some warm coffee waiting...

[BadCompany]

Outcome aside, that was a fun game. The WJC usually are. The players are outrageously skilled, but still young enough and wild enough to not play perfect, structured games. There are more mistakes, more free-wheeling, more opportunities. Which of course NHL coaches hate!

I was surprised by how much ice time Guhle kept getting, because he was caught turned the wrong way on more than one occasion. But Tourigny kept rolling the three defensive pairs, which I guess made sense given that Schneider and Harly weren't much better than Guhle and Barron. Which isn't to say that both pairings were bad, just that they were clearly behind Byram and Drysdale (as one would expect). If Touringy is coach again next year I could see Guhle wearing a letter.

I thought Caufield again flashed instances of brilliance, coupled with a whole lot of steady-but-hardly-inspiring play. He can sure shoot though. I would love to know what his average shift time was, because as Willie said his shifts sure seemed short. But then I think all US shifts were short, as their plan clearly seemed to be to just keeping coming at Canada in waves. Attack-attack-attack, in all areas of the ice. Which is what a deep team should do. Claude, did you notice?

[Tankdriver]

A few days ago I mentioned that they were lacking true game breakers (like a McDavid, Crosby, McKinnon). Tonight proved it. Perferetti, McMichaels, Quinn, might be very good NHL players in the future but left me wanting more from them. The US played a good game and forced Canada to the outside. We like to talk about Guhle and Caulfield, but the real disappointment for me was Byfield. 2nd overall pick, and that's now 2 juniors where he has been invisible minus the one big game.

[The Habitual Fan]

I like Caufield but somehow see him being more of a Daniel Briere type in the NHL. Very good hands and opportunistic but not a great all round player and needs to be on a top 2 line to be effective. That isn't a bad thing but just fairly one dimensional.

I won't feel nearly as bad now when he is part of the package for Pierre Luc Dubios.

[PTH]

Jan 6, 2021 10:10:49 GMT -5 The Habitual Fan said:

I like Caufield but somehow see him being more of a Daniel Briere type in the NHL. Very good hands and opportunistic but not a great all round player and needs to be on a top 2 line to be effective. That isn't a bad thing but just fairly one dimensional.

I won't feel nearly as bad now when he is part of the package for Pierre Luc Dubios.

I've always been worried he'd turn into a Daniel Audette: a small guy who can score on the PP, but not a top 6 player.

[folatre]

I concur. Those are two reasonable comparisons.

I believe what people have to understand is that not every small guy is a reasonable comparison. I remember talking with some guys while our boys were at an open skate right after the 2019 draft and I was hearing names like Marty St. Louis and Johnny Gaudreau tossed around. I never saw those as logical comparables. Caufield does not have the speed and feistiness of St. Louis and he is not a play-driver zone entry specialist like Gaudreau who just has the puck glued to his blade when he is focused.

I think the key for Caufield at the NHL level is whether he can be elusive without being exclusively a perimeter player. By elusive, I mean two things. First, elusive as in the ability to find and operate in those soft spots that momentarily open in the slot. Second, elusive as in having a knack for avoiding big hits while still being responsible with the board work that a winger has to give his team.

[Willie Dog]

Jan 6, 2021 11:22:21 GMT -5 folatre said:

I concur. Those are two reasonable comparisons.

I believe what people have to understand is that not every small guy is a reasonable comparison. I remember talking with some guys while our boys were at an open skate right after the 2019 draft and I was hearing names like Marty St. Louis and Johnny Gaudreau tossed around. I never saw those as logical comparables. Caufield does not have the speed and feistiness of St. Louis and he is not a play-driver zone entry specialist like Gaudreau who just has the puck glued to his blade when he is focused.

I think the key for Caufield at the NHL level is whether he can be elusive without being exclusively a perimeter player. By elusive, I mean two things. First, elusive as in the ability to find and operate in those soft spots that momentarily open in the slot. Second, elusive as in having a knack for avoiding big hits while still being responsible with the board work that a winger has to give his team.

Hopefully Caufield is a Cammalleri with more:

speed - faster than last year, he's worked on that
passing - he made some great passes which the Atari's he was playing with couldn't process.
creativity - he handles the puck well, protected it and moved it around
end to end player - he showed more defensive awareness (Habs told him to work on that I assume) and I think this may have impacted his offence.... along with short shifts

[Willie Dog]

Jan 6, 2021 11:22:21 GMT -5 folatre said:

I think the key for Caufield at the NHL level is whether he can be elusive without being exclusively a perimeter player. By elusive, I mean two things. First, elusive as in the ability to find and operate in those soft spots that momentarily open in the slot. Second, elusive as in having a knack for avoiding big hits while still being responsible with the board work that a winger has to give his team.

What I noticed was that teams were collapsing the box on the PK and made the slot a small place... Caufield was going there but there was no room to get him the puck. If he was on the half wall, that may have opened things up in the slot.

Even when the other team were hemmed in their own end 5 on 5, they collapsed and gave up the outside shot, why Caufield was going to the slot is beyond me... round peg square hole thinking from the coaches, a bigger body should be there

[frozone]

I wasn't particularly impressed with many of the 2020 draftees in this tournament. Even Drysdale was disappointing. Imo, Byram made him look way better than he actually played. Believe it or not, Guhle actually outproduced Drysdale in the tournament. If Byram wasn't his D partner, I think he would have been exposed.

Playing the comparison game, was Guhle any better or worse than Jack Quinn, Perfetti, Holloway, Schneider, Byfield, Mercer, Zary, etc? It's a resounding no imo. All good players, all had their highs and lows this tourny, but none were particularly impressive. Mysak may have been one of the stronger 2020 draftee performers in fact. Regardless, next WJC will be the year in which we see how they're all developing. This remains a 19 year old tournament.

[frozone]

Jan 6, 2021 11:50:33 GMT -5 Willie Dog said:

Jan 6, 2021 11:22:21 GMT -5 folatre said:

I think the key for Caufield at the NHL level is whether he can be elusive without being exclusively a perimeter player. By elusive, I mean two things. First, elusive as in the ability to find and operate in those soft spots that momentarily open in the slot. Second, elusive as in having a knack for avoiding big hits while still being responsible with the board work that a winger has to give his team.

What I noticed was that teams were collapsing the box on the PK and made the slot a small place... Caufield was going there but there was no room to get him the puck. If he was on the half wall, that may have opened things up in the slot.

Even when the other team were hemmed in their own end 5 on 5, they collapsed and gave up the outside shot, why Caufield was going to the slot is beyond me... round peg square hole thinking from the coaches, a bigger body should be there

Another odd choice was making Caufield the trailing man on on the PP that carried the puck into the O-zone. Why this wasn't Zegras, I have absolutely no clue.

Pleasant surprise was that Caufield did pretty well with this task. Never realized he had the skillset to be much of a puck carrier.

[BadCompany]

Jan 6, 2021 11:50:33 GMT -5 Willie Dog said:

What I noticed was that teams were collapsing the box on the PK and made the slot a small place... Caufield was going there but there was no room to get him the puck. If he was on the half wall, that may have opened things up in the slot.

Even when the other team were hemmed in their own end 5 on 5, they collapsed and gave up the outside shot, why Caufield was going to the slot is beyond me... round peg square hole thinking from the coaches, a bigger body should be there

I think the logic from the coaches on the power play was that they had two elite shooters in Caufield and Kaliyev, but obviously only one of them can man that half-wall spot. So their choice was to either sit one of those shooters (or have them on the 2nd unit), or move one to the bumper spot in the slot. Hard to justify sitting one of your two best (on paper) goal scorers during the power play, so I guess they figured they would put one in the middle and since Caufield was better at both "bumper" passes out of the slot, and deflections on shots from the point he got the job. In a bizarre sort of way it appears to me that they thought Caufield was better than Kaliyev, and thus more likely to adapt better. Didn't exactly work out but I sort of get the logic.

[Boston_Habs]

Caufield is a designated shooter and just isn't a guy you notice that much unless he's scoring goals. That's not a bad thing per se, but he's not a playmaker and he doesn't have the physicality or edge to his game like Brendan Gallagher. I don't regret the pick, but I'm not sure about Caufield. He's nothing if he can't score. I think they are trying to develop his 2-way game and playmaking skills at Wisconsin this year to broaden his game, but at the same time he's a guy who thrives away from the puck finding seams, lurking around the perimeter... sort of like Max Pacioretty but without Max's size. We'll see..

[mikeg]

The Recrutes article about Guhle and Caufield at WJC:

Recrutes spoke with one NHL scout a couple of days ago before the semi-finals and two more after the Gold Medal game regarding Cole Caufield and Kaiden Guhle.

The scout who was interviewed before the semi-final matches had high praise for Caufield, and looked at him not meeting offensive expectations as more of a by-product of mismatched linemate than his own performance.

“Just play Caufield with (Trevor) Zegras and he’d be fine,” said the scout, echoing the sentiments of many Habs’ fans during the event. “Caufield has a lot more dance in his game than Kaliyev, he can go east west or north south. He’s got the really good hands, he’s elusive, whereas Kaliyev has a hard time just getting away from anybody.”

The longtime NHL amateur scout saw marked improvements in Caufield’s game since last year’s WJC.

“He’s really close (to breaking out),” said the scout. “He’s better away from the puck and hanging on in traffic better too. He’s got a little more poise now, he’s got a little more strength, so he feels more confident in traffic, which is good, because he needs to be that, he’s needs to get in and get out with the puck, and we already know he can shoot it. He’s nifty.”

Caufield’s center at the WJC is a highly-regarded prospect for the 2020 draft. Matt Beniers has a lot of great qualities in his game – vision and playmaking would not be at the top of the list, however, and he had problems finding Caufield for scoring chances.

“You’ve got to play with somebody you can get some synergy with and I don’t know if Beniers is that guy,” added the scout. “He just doesn’t see it very well. His creativity is very average…he’s a net driver. Caufield needs a centerman that finds him for that lethal one-timer, and that isn’t Beniers.”

We’ve heard the excuses for Caufield’s disappointing production, but the fact remains that Caufield failed to make a major impact offensively 5-on-5 for his second-straight tournament, not scoring one even-strength goal. You can blame linemates to a certain extent, but Caufield should have been able to score a goal against Austria playing on a line with a wheelchair and a pylon.


“He still has work to do to sustain impact away from the offensive zone but he has taken steps,” noted one scout. “I know he will be good and score on the powerplay in the NHL…5-on-5, I still wonder.”

This reporter/scout has seen strides made in Caufield’s overall game both in Wisconsin and during the WJC, so while his production wasn’t great, there are signs that he’s going to be able to hold his own even strength at the NHL level once he makes the jump.

“He has significantly improved his play away from the puck,” noted one scout. “He demonstrated an ability to make plays many didn’t realize he possessed. His quickness and speed have reached another level. He’s physically stronger which is noticeable in puck battles.”

Kaiden Guhle made his presence known physically at the WJC, and was the first 18-year-old Canadian defenceman to score two goals at the WJC since Dougie Hamilton in 2012.

“He did a great job of killing plays especially off the rush,” said one scout. “He was hard to play against, mean and a physical presence. His skating a major asset to create time and space and also to allow him to have good gaps . He also showed his ability to one-time point shots.”

Guhle was deemed the culprit on USA’s first goal by Alex Turcotte last night even if there were several to blame, so the common consensus was that he struggled against the US.

That is at the very least debatable, but even if it were true, it has to be kept in perspective that he was an 18-year-old defenceman facing one of the most talented 19-year-old junior classes in WJC history. The Americans had six 19-year-olds (Caufield is now actually 20) who were top-15 selections in last year’s draft.

“His youth at this level and position was on display at times but he’ll learn from it and be better for it next year,” added the scout. “You rarely see an 18-year-old dominate this event.”

Guhle led all Canada players in hits (4), shot blocks (4), and was tied for second in shots on goal (3) last night in the Gold Medal game. He will be back, and he will be even better next WJC.

“He’s a young guy feeling it out,” said one scout. “He’s still got to get a lot stronger. He’s got a little more puck game than he’s showing right now. You know he’s going to be hard against an opponent. He’s a tough kid. You know how it is….this year they are alright, then at 19 they are all stars. It makes a big difference from one year to the next…most make such a jump in maturity between 18 and 19. He’s a good player.

[Skilly]

I saw a stat on Twitter that graded control zone entries and zone entries defended against ... the graph had all the defense men from the tournament on it. The one thing evident from the graph was one name stood out from the rest because he was way off the chart . Kaiden Guhle was the absolute best in the tournament at these two things , and it wasn’t even close

[seventeen]

I have been skeptical of much of the advanced stats for Canada in the WJC. If they used just the playoff rounds I'd feel better, but those early games against really weak teams has skewed the numbers IMO. I didn't like the divisional breakdown right from the beginning. The tough teams in the tournament IMO, were Sweden, the US and Finland. Russia was ok but not strong this year. Canada was in with Germany, the Swiss and the Slovaks. That was not good. You need a challenge to get yourself up to speed and the lack of enough challenges for Canada showed. It took them too long against the US to get up to speed and by then the US was pumped. With kids of that age you have to mentally beat them down early and then they're easy fixins. If you let them gain momentum, you're asking for it and Canada wasn't up to it. Dach would have helped a lot. In my mind he is the best forward of that Cdn group, by far. He can be an elite centre in the NHL, while the other Cdn centres (I"m not a big Byfield fan) are all more 2nd line NHL types. Eliteness matters. Zegras and Stuetzle are exhibits A and B.

[Cranky]

Jan 7, 2021 8:29:54 GMT -5 mikeg said:

The Recrutes article about Guhle and Caufield at WJC:

Good article but I disagree a bit....

Caufield "elite" scoring was not there. Yes, his teammates were not a great match, but that shouldn't stop him from being dangerous.

Worse was that you can tell straight up that he was playing a perimeter game, waiting to be fed. In Julien world....he's dead.

He can improve...add muscle, add quickness and/or speed, add toughness. He needs hard work, but it's just hard work. His desire to do that will make him an NHLer. Or not.

Guhle did impress. He flubbed a basic play leading to a goal but he also did very well after that. I thought that mistake was going to get him stapled to the bench, but the boys needed his muscle to stop the runaway American freight train. He did his job...but still.

Then there is his skating. Maybe my eyes are deceiving me but what I saw was choppy strides on the breakout. Maybe there is still some speed there, but he is certainly not a smooth skater or NHL level. That is one area where there can be lots of improvement with training.

His reads looked good. Kind of hard to be definitive, but he wasn't loosing his man, particularly on the outside. Komisarek he's not. You can teach and work on skating, you can't teach vision and processing the game. That is why Komi is out of the NHL.

Right now, he's Tinordi as is, but easily can move up into Weber Lite with work. At 18.....lots of light and hope.

My view of the two was...I'm bit concerned about Caufield...I'm delighted about Guhle.

[folatre]

Guhle impressed me too. As one would expect for a big-bodied d-man of his age, at times he looks a little raw, but projecting ahead he definitely looks like a top 4 d-man in the NHL.

But all of this potential is going to take time to develop. Honing the craft, in particular for young d-man, is a process.

It is really a shame that Guhle cannot go dominate in the WHL right now. I am not so sure playing with the Rocket this season best aligns with what he is ready for developmentally.

[mikeg]

Jan 7, 2021 19:48:38 GMT -5 Cranky said:

Jan 7, 2021 8:29:54 GMT -5 mikeg said:

The Recrutes article about Guhle and Caufield at WJC:

Good article but I disagree a bit....

Caufield "elite" scoring was not there. Yes, his teammates were not a great match, but that shouldn't stop him from being dangerous.

Worse was that you can tell straight up that he was playing a perimeter game, waiting to be fed. In Julien world....he's dead.

He can improve...add muscle, add quickness and/or speed, add toughness. He needs hard work, but it's just hard work. His desire to do that will make him an NHLer. Or not.

Guhle did impress. He flubbed a basic play leading to a goal but he also did very well after that. I thought that mistake was going to get him stapled to the bench, but the boys needed his muscle to stop the runaway American freight train. He did his job...but still.

Then there is his skating. Maybe my eyes are deceiving me but what I saw was choppy strides on the breakout. Maybe there is still some speed there, but he is certainly not a smooth skater or NHL level. That is one area where there can be lots of improvement with training.

His reads looked good. Kind of hard to be definitive, but he wasn't loosing his man, particularly on the outside. Komisarek he's not. You can teach and work on skating, you can't teach vision and processing the game. That is why Komi is out of the NHL.

Right now, he's Tinordi as is, but easily can move up into Weber Lite with work. At 18.....lots of light and hope.

My view of the two was...I'm bit concerned about Caufield...I'm delighted about Guhle.

I had a different view of both

I thought Caufield was very active when he was out there, he was moving around (yes around the perimeter) but moving around a lot and I found him very quick. His passing is underrated as well, if he was with better linemates I think you would have seen more assists and goals. But it's painfully obvious he needs to play with the right players who can feed him and play at his level. Put him on a line with Kotka or Suzuki and I think he will dazzle, those are 2 very smart players who can find the open man and Caufield will benefit tremendously from that. The only hurdle he will have is Julien. By all accounts he works his butt off and knows what he needs to improve, he won't grow any taller but he can get quicker and he is whip smart with both his shot and passing. Coached right he will be a gem I hope. I was disappointed he wasn't used more defensively, I think his backchecking is underrated, he won't bull anyone over but he has an active stick and is very sneaky and I think he will generate turnovers and odd man rushes from that if he is coached right and given the chance to screw up a bit and learn.

Guhle played like a man out there and he is only 18. The scout was right, he was up against guys a year older and all 1st rounders with size and speed and he held his own. I hadn't really seen him before this tournament but I was having mini Weber hot flashes. He has a rocket of a shot, he is quick and his skating can look choppy but it's only because he is still growing. He is fast for his size, played all over and has way more offensive upside than I imagined. If he breaks into the league with a year or two of Weber mentorship I think he will benefit greatly. Also, he is a leader who doesn't dwell on mistakes, I think the coaches saw that. I don't see the Komi comparisons at all tbh. Other than the size, they are not at all the same to me. Komi also looked like an angry puppy out there and Guhle looks more like a mature and controlled german shepherd.

[Cranky]

I brought up Komi as what Guhle isn't. Komi never rose above a junior level understanding of the game. He wasn't stupid, it was because he didn't play the game until he was 11.

Given that hockey is just too fast to "think it through" and relies on instinct level response, Komi was never going to be the monster defenseman we dreamed of.

Guhle is NOT that. I didn't see anyone beat him on the outside nor bait him out of position. So Komi was brought up as what Guhle isn't.

[Disgruntled70sHab]

Didn't want to open another thread for this one ... do you guys know much about Simon Edvinsson ...

[Habs_fan_in_LA]

Jan 7, 2021 19:48:38 GMT -5 Cranky said:

Jan 7, 2021 8:29:54 GMT -5 mikeg said:

The Recrutes article about Guhle and Caufield at WJC:

Good article but I disagree a bit....

Caufield "elite" scoring was not there. Yes, his teammates were not a great match, but that shouldn't stop him from being dangerous.

Worse was that you can tell straight up that he was playing a perimeter game, waiting to be fed. In Julien world....he's dead.

He can improve...add muscle, add quickness and/or speed, add toughness. He needs hard work, but it's just hard work. His desire to do that will make him an NHLer. Or not.

Guhle did impress. He flubbed a basic play leading to a goal but he also did very well after that. I thought that mistake was going to get him stapled to the bench, but the boys needed his muscle to stop the runaway American freight train. He did his job...but still.

Then there is his skating. Maybe my eyes are deceiving me but what I saw was choppy strides on the breakout. Maybe there is still some speed there, but he is certainly not a smooth skater or NHL level. That is one area where there can be lots of improvement with training.

His reads looked good. Kind of hard to be definitive, but he wasn't loosing his man, particularly on the outside. Komisarek he's not. You can teach and work on skating, you can't teach vision and processing the game. That is why Komi is out of the NHL.

Right now, he's Tinordi as is, but easily can move up into Weber Lite with work. At 18.....lots of light and hope.

My view of the two was...I'm bit concerned about Caufield...I'm delighted about Guhle.

i too am ambivolant on Caufield He is one dimensional, a sniper, not as big as Shutt and not as rugged as Cournoyer. He might be another COREY lOCKE Except he is excellent at what he does. i don't criticize Tom Brady for his lack of foot speed or Mohammud Ali for his lack of knockout power. It took years for Cournoyer to be trusted 5 on 5. It took years for Bergevin to produce a decent team. The future is more accurate than my hunches.

[Willie Dog]

Feb 8, 2021 4:45:42 GMT -5 Habs_fan_in_LA said:

Jan 7, 2021 19:48:38 GMT -5 Cranky said:

Good article but I disagree a bit....

Caufield "elite" scoring was not there. Yes, his teammates were not a great match, but that shouldn't stop him from being dangerous.

Worse was that you can tell straight up that he was playing a perimeter game, waiting to be fed. In Julien world....he's dead.

He can improve...add muscle, add quickness and/or speed, add toughness. He needs hard work, but it's just hard work. His desire to do that will make him an NHLer. Or not.

Guhle did impress. He flubbed a basic play leading to a goal but he also did very well after that. I thought that mistake was going to get him stapled to the bench, but the boys needed his muscle to stop the runaway American freight train. He did his job...but still.

Then there is his skating. Maybe my eyes are deceiving me but what I saw was choppy strides on the breakout. Maybe there is still some speed there, but he is certainly not a smooth skater or NHL level. That is one area where there can be lots of improvement with training.

His reads looked good. Kind of hard to be definitive, but he wasn't loosing his man, particularly on the outside. Komisarek he's not. You can teach and work on skating, you can't teach vision and processing the game. That is why Komi is out of the NHL.

Right now, he's Tinordi as is, but easily can move up into Weber Lite with work. At 18.....lots of light and hope.

My view of the two was...I'm bit concerned about Caufield...I'm delighted about Guhle.

i too am ambivolant on Caufield He is one dimensional, a sniper, not as big as Shutt and not as rugged as Cournoyer. He might be another COREY lOCKE Except he is excellent at what he does. i don't criticize Tom Brady for his lack of foot speed or Mohammud Ali for his lack of knockout power. It took years for Cournoyer to be trusted 5 on 5. It took years for Bergevin to produce a decent team. The future is more accurate than my hunches.

CC is smart enough to find open ice, all he needs is a centre with vision and D with vision, we have those right now in our young guys Suze, KK and Romanov