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Post by Cranky on Sept 16, 2004 10:03:17 GMT -5
..for Koivu, Zednik AND Bulis?
For whatever very little it's worth, there was a rumour of a deal this time LAST YEAR for Lacavalier. Montreal was ready to part with Koivu and Zednik.....but Tampax also wanted Bulis. So....no deal.
Would you make this deal today?
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Post by maci4life on Sept 16, 2004 12:03:21 GMT -5
in my opinion, his stock is too high right now. If i remember correctly, at that time he was slumping, and people were getting on his case for either his attitude, or work ethic, or lack of physical presence ( i forget which one). now would not be the time to grab him.
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Post by blaise on Sept 16, 2004 12:17:10 GMT -5
Lecavalier is out of reach. If the Habs had him, he would become an instant favorite of francophones and anglophones alike. Fortunately, the Habs have improved their standing in the league to the point that they won't be in the position of drafting the next Lecavalier (or Ovechkin or Crosby, for that matter). They'll just have to win the Cup the hard way, with a number of high quality players who don't quite rate as superstars. I don't believe they can do it with the players presently in the system (and that includes the prospects). In particular, the defense needs upgrading.
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Post by ethan on Sept 16, 2004 15:22:25 GMT -5
Let me preface this by saying that I am a HUGE Koivu fan, and I hope that he ends up finishing his career in the bleu blanc rouge...
that being said, Lecavalier is a premier player, clearly ready to make the step to superstardom. He's a big, talented 1st line centreman who looks like he's finally figured out the importance of devoting as much intensity to his defensive game as to his offensive game.
He's got a great combination of heart, grit and skill and he's already got a Stanley cup and a World Cup (MVP to boot) on his resume and he's only 24!!!!! You don't pass up picking up that kind of player, french canadian or not, when you have the chance.
While Koivu still has a lot to offer us, he is 30 years old and is always a very big injury concern...
Personally I think that both Zednik and Bulis are replaceable, especially with the young guys we have coming up (higgins, plecks, perez, kots, laperriere),
so if this deal were on the table, I'd do it in a heartbeat!!!
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Post by Habs_fan_in_LA on Sept 16, 2004 16:52:12 GMT -5
Let me preface this by saying that I am a HUGE Koivu fan, and I hope that he ends up finishing his career in the bleu blanc rouge... that being said, Lecavalier is a premier player, clearly ready to make the step to superstardom. He's a big, talented 1st line centreman who looks like he's finally figured out the importance of devoting as much intensity to his defensive game as to his offensive game. He's got a great combination of heart, grit and skill and he's already got a Stanley cup and a World Cup (MVP to boot) on his resume and he's only 24!!!!! You don't pass up picking up that kind of player, french canadian or not, when you have the chance. While Koivu still has a lot to offer us, he is 30 years old and is always a very big injury concern... Personally I think that both Zednik and Bulis are replaceable, especially with the young guys we have coming up (higgins, plecks, perez, kots, laperriere), so if this deal were on the table, I'd do it in a heartbeat!!! It's like being offered Brittney Spears for my wife and my girlfriend. Brittney is young and at the top of her game but my wife and I have been through a lot together and is a reliable known quantity. My girlfriend knows exactly what needs to be done and plays with a minimum of supervision. It's a risky messy deal and who is to say that Lecavalier will continue to perform at the current level. (Montreal getting Lecavalier and me getting Spears are equally likely hypotheticals, and in any case, I'd keep my wife) I'm much more disposed to trading for Lecavalier now than I was a year ago. Back then Lecavalier had shown promise that was unfulfilled. TB has so many stars on the team; would they consider Koivu and Zednik an upgrade? |
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Post by blaise on Sept 16, 2004 17:15:29 GMT -5
Lecavalier is entering the superstar phase of his career. It would make much more sense to have Lecavalier and Koivu, who would complement each other, than to have Lecavalier and Ribeiro. Lecavalier can do eveything Ribeiro can, and then add some because of his superior size, skating, physical play, and shot.
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Post by blaise on Sept 16, 2004 17:21:05 GMT -5
It's like being offered Brittney Spears for my wife and my girlfriend. Brittney is young and at the top of her game but my wife and I have been through a lot together and is a reliable known quantity. My girlfriend knows exactly what needs to be done and plays with a minimum of supervision. It's a risky messy deal and who is to say that Lecavalier will continue to perform at the current level. (Montreal getting Lecavalier and me getting Spears are equally likely hypotheticals, and in any case, I'd keep my wife) I'm much more disposed to trading for Lecavalier now than I was a year ago. Back then Lecavalier had shown promise that was unfulfilled. TB has so many stars on the team; would they consider Koivu and Zednik an upgrade? I wouldn't have taken Brittney at any stage of my life. She and I wouldn't have gotten along, mostly because she's a shallow, neurotic, ninny. Besides, she isn't all that attractive. I could think of many greater beauties who also have more substance. In hockey terms, a GM would look to trade her after one season. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 18, 2004 18:37:10 GMT -5
Lecavalier was one of Tampa's best players in Game 7. Not to mention that trade would heavily favour the Habs.
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Post by Doc Holliday on Dec 21, 2004 9:37:05 GMT -5
..for Koivu, Zednik AND Bulis? For whatever very little it's worth, there was a rumour of a deal this time LAST YEAR for Lacavalier. Montreal was ready to part with Koivu and Zednik.....but Tampax also wanted Bulis. So....no deal. Would you make this deal today? It's hard to immagine that a 3rd/4th line player like Bulis would be the pivotal element of a deal of this magnitude... Especially when you consider the amount of defensive player available to us at the time. But going along with this: I would have done it. Koivu could be a season away from leaving to free agency so getting a franchise center on the upswing, especially one as marketable as Vinny, would have been a steal. |
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Post by Doc Holliday on Dec 21, 2004 9:50:38 GMT -5
Lecavalier is out of reach. If the Habs had him, he would become an instant favorite of francophones and anglophones alike. Fortunately, the Habs have improved their standing in the league to the point that they won't be in the position of drafting the next Lecavalier (or Ovechkin or Crosby, for that matter). They'll just have to win the Cup the hard way, with a number of high quality players who don't quite rate as superstars. I don't believe they can do it with the players presently in the system (and that includes the prospects). In particular, the defense needs upgrading. I would agree with that. Somehow the HABS will have to come up with one or 2 magical trades. On defense Komi, Markov and Souray seem like a good core to build on. But if we can't keep Kovalev and Koivu leaves via free agency after next season, things will suddenly look a little thin up front... |
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Post by franko on Dec 21, 2004 10:20:07 GMT -5
Somehow the HABS will have to come up with one or 2 magical trades . . . if we can't keep Kovalev and Koivu leaves via free agency after next season, things will suddenly look a little thin up front... The problem with the team having heritage and pride is that fans won't accept falling apart for a few years so that the Habs can have a couple of high draft picks. Instead, we fight and claw to get into the playoffs (a seldom-seen occurance this decade), somehow make it to the second round (exceeding expectations), and hope the middle-of-the-pack first round draft pick astounds. Doesn't happen, and we wind up wallowing in the middle, never good enough for the grail but never bad enough to build through a high draft. |
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Post by Doc Holliday on Dec 21, 2004 11:05:04 GMT -5
The problem with the team having heritage and pride is that fans won't accept falling apart for a few years so that the Habs can have a couple of high draft picks. Instead, we fight and claw to get into the playoffs (a seldom-seen occurance this decade), somehow make it to the second round (exceeding expectations), and hope the middle-of-the-pack first round draft pick astounds. Doesn't happen, and we wind up wallowing in the middle, never good enough for the grail but never bad enough to build through a high draft. That resumes it good but I think Gainey can get us out of that vicious circle. If there would have been a season this year, the HABS, with the addition of Bonk and Kovalev, would have been the strongest Montreal team, on paper, in almost a decade. Also one thing to consider for the future is just how much can we expect out of Ribs and Ryder? Having 60+ points seasons at their young age is quite impressive and one can wonder if both these players can build on that and become even more dominant as they mature and progress. Both these guys have character and are hard workers that beat the odds to get where they are, so I would doubt they are flash in the pan. I mean if Ribs become a regular 70-80pts center and Ryder a dependable 30+ goals scorer, things suddenly look diferent. |
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Post by Doc Holliday on Apr 18, 2005 20:37:04 GMT -5
Since it's nearly impossible that Tampa will be able to keep its team together given that both Khabibulin and St-Louis are UFA and that Lecavalier is a RFA, I think the Lacavalier deal must be revisited.
Obviously carrying 2 franchise centers is not something teams will be able to do. IMO Tampa will have to chose between Richards and Vinny and, IMO again, the choice has already been made. Since Vinnie's contract is up, Tampa will be looking at making a move and obviously Montreal is the team that could/should overpay the most.
Sooooo.
If I was BG. Here is the deal I'd try: Mike Ribeiro (who's right now as productive as Vinny without Martin St-Louis on his wing) and Jan Bulis (since according to Cranky is of some interest to Tampa) for Vinny.
Why not Koivu ? IMO his trade value is nil (or close to it). Not only is he as injury prone as you can get but he's flirting with UFA. If we could hang on to him somehow for a not too expensive price (3mil ?), I think he'd make a good 2nd line center to Vinny.
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Post by BadCompany on Apr 19, 2005 8:50:19 GMT -5
Lecavalier? Bah! What do we need Lecavalier for?? We're getting Crosby!
Personally, I'd make a pitch for UFA Jason Allison. He'll come cheap, because of his injury problems, but when he's on, he's a big, point-per-game center. Those are rare to find.
Zednik (2.3) - Koivu (4.0) – Kovalev (5.0)
Ryder (1.4) – Ribeiro (1.4) – Perezhoghin (.8)
Bonk (2.7) – Allison (3.0) – Bulis (1.2) (or, ahem, Crosby )
Ivanans (.3) – Begin (.5) – Ward (.5)
Higgins (.8) , Sundstrom (.8)
Souray (3.0) – Brisebois (2.3)
Markov (2.3) – Rivet (2.0)
Hainsey (.7) – Komisarek (1.0)
Bouillon (.5)
Theodore (5.0)
Huet (.5)
Heck, I could probably get it to fit under a $42 million salary cap, too...
EDIT: And so I did. Total salary, $42.0 million.
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Post by franko on Apr 19, 2005 10:03:46 GMT -5
EDIT: And so I did. Total salary, $42.0 million. Now take out your magic marker again . . . can you get salary down to the 31.5M level? |
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Post by Forum Ghost on Apr 24, 2005 17:42:50 GMT -5
Heck, I could probably get it to fit under a $42 million salary cap, too... EDIT: And so I did. Total salary, $42.0 million. It could be even lower... you forgot to factor in the 24% rollback.  |
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