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Post by Doc Holliday on Jan 2, 2003 11:37:43 GMT -5
Apparently they ran out of financial option and couldn't make their last payroll (wednesday). Beyond hockey, that is a very sad day for the dozens of regular Sens workers (admin and maintenance) that did not get a pay check they certainly needed badly...
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Post by MPLABBE on Jan 2, 2003 12:01:39 GMT -5
Sens not Pens(although the Pens may be in trouble as well)
I heard the players didn't get their pay checks...the employees as well? ouch...
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Post by jerry_dog on Jan 2, 2003 12:58:42 GMT -5
since corrections seem to be in order ... "mystery"
The Sens will pull through. They are playing too well and as such will garner a lot more "Oh look at me I'm a good guy" financial help than if they were, oh say Buffalo.
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Post by Doc Holliday on Jan 2, 2003 14:32:59 GMT -5
From what I've read, the Sens have been put together through depth alone (like GG did when he acquired the HABS) and the revenue of the franchise is barely enough to pay for the interest of that alone. Sens carry a huge depth and have very little chance of getting out of it.
GG and Boivin have been very active in making the Montreal franchise profitable (tax relief deal, new broadcast deal, Bell Center deal that got turned into immediate cash to payoff depth) and still Gillett said that the current CBA would not insure long term stability of the HABS and that the 2004 negotiations would be critical. With that in mind, we can imagine what it looks like for the Sens… They don't have much brand recognition, they are just 19th in the league in attendance and are sandwiched between the enormous hockey market of Toronto and Montreal. They could be in an even worst shape then Buffalo for all we know.
I don't see a bright future for that franchise in Ottawa.
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Post by MPLABBE on Jan 2, 2003 16:05:50 GMT -5
Their only hope is being a cup contender every year and racking in playoff profits...
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Post by Ryan on Jan 2, 2003 16:11:13 GMT -5
That's sad for sure.
But honestly I'm already preparing for being a Seattle Canadiens fan, and since I live outside Montreal and see the games on NHL Centre Ice anyways I can't really say I care that much.
Yeah sentimentally it will hurt, but I think the fact is in 10 years there won't be a Canadian NHL franchise if there's still an NHL at that point.
And shut up Toronto fans, if we would have been told 5 years ago the Habs would be owned by an American even you would have laughed.
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Post by Willie Dog on Jan 2, 2003 16:25:06 GMT -5
The problem the Sens faced is that they came into the league when the NDP had power in Ontario and they cost the Sens huge. The sens had to build an over pass from the highway to the Corel Centre because the province wouldn't do it and this forced them to add a surcharge to the tickets (the overpass is used by everyone, even ones not going to the corel centre, what a joke). The NDP gave them a hard time with the Ontario Municipal Board because the Sens needed to rezone the land that the Corel Centre was going to be built on from farming to commercial and the NDP said that a creek running through the land was navigable (it was at most 3 feet deep, a guy in a canoe would have had a hard time, damn NDP). I live in Ottawa and I think alot of the sens problems date back to the NDP. If the Sens were going to be based somewhere around the centre of the universe (Toronto) the NDP would have given them carte blanche, but since they were located in Ottawa (the Capital of Canada) the NDP were a pain in the butt.
I want the Sens to stay because then Leaf games are blacked out during the week on TV, and it pisses all of the leafs fans off. Oh what joy that brings me.
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Post by habwest on Jan 2, 2003 18:13:41 GMT -5
Good points MHab. The Sens debt, as Doc says, is pretty big. It's over $100M and for some reason the figure $160M sticks in my mind but I could be wrong. The annual interest payments are $15M per year, which is just about what they lost last year.
Bryden had a deal worked out with a Boston Bank concerning the debt and once that came off someone with big bucks from the US was going to buy in so the Sens would get a cash infusion to pay off some of the debt and plow it back into their operations. However the bank pulled out at the last minute and the whole thing fell through.
Things look pretty bad from a long term perspective. They are a well run organization with a payroll of only $30M but that huge debt load is gradually strangling them. Add to that the crash in the high tech sector which really hit this town, and the Sens, hard. The club has had trouble selling enough season tickets which may be why the bank pulled out. According to a team announcement players will soon be paid and the payroll will be met on schedule for the remainder of the season. I imagine the owner is now scrambling trying to put another deal together. But what happens beyond the end of this season is anybody's guess.
The owner himself has yet to issue a statement on "what next".
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Post by TheHabsfan on Jan 3, 2003 9:18:32 GMT -5
This sad to say , but maybe contraction is exactly what the league needs to push the Salary Cap through. It's the only way to save hockey IMO. If we keep going on like this, there will be no more teams in Canada. It's a shame that 4 or five teams have driven salaries up (we know who they are...) and are killing all the other smaller market teams. I hope the players can put their greed aside in 2004 and save the game they love. cheers
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Post by Boston_Habs on Jan 3, 2003 11:17:52 GMT -5
It's a shame, but hockey is heading for a huge day of reckoning in 2004. Players are getting paid like it's the NBA, but the national and local broadcast revenue is nowhere near those levels.
Like Doc said, Ottawa was poorly capitalized with too much debt so that even if they sell out every game, there is not enough cash flow to meet payroll and service the debt. It's a real mess, and hard to see who is going to pick up the slack. The NHL could step in like MLB does with the Expos and cover the losses in exchange for control of the team, but that would ultimately mean the team would be sold and moved. The banks aren't going to forgive the debt and unless there's a white knight in Ottawa to come in and recap the team, I think the Sens are a goner.
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Post by BadCompany on Jan 3, 2003 12:13:37 GMT -5
Ottawa in ruins, and Buffalo not too far behind. Calgary, Edmonton, and Pittsburgh just hanging on. These are all teams with good fan bases. If they go, and help doesn't come with the new CBA, what's going to happen to teams with mediocre, declining fan bases? Like Atlanta, Nashville, Florida, Tampa, New Jersey, Boston ( ), Carolina, Washington and so on?? Where else can they move to, or expand to? Hockey is in serious trouble. I really, really hope the Players Union gets it, and the Owners get it (because they are a huge part of the problem too) and a fair, equitable, and workable agreement is reached. Maybe if a couple of more teams miss their paydays, the players AND owners will get scared. Cause I know as a fan I am.
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Post by TheHabsfan on Jan 3, 2003 12:45:44 GMT -5
Wouldn't it be strange going back to a 6 team league?...what...could happen!
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jan 3, 2003 13:12:51 GMT -5
Ottawa is a funny market. They supported the Rough Riders for years. There were Grey Cup victories and a team whose players remained in Ottawa and took up jobs in the city during off season. That team more than any, left it's personality on the city. The city of Ottawa was associated with the Rough Riders. However, the team went on a 15-year losing skid and when the Riders finally ceased operations, they did so with a very small loyal fan base. The Ottawa franchise resurfaced but unlike the Alouettes in Montreal, they failed to keep the original name of the team. It seemed rather awkward calling Montreal the Concords and not the Alouettes. I mean the Als are a CFL icon as were the Rough Riders, the Lions, the Eskimos, et al. The Ottawa 67's were in dire straight as well until their new owner, Jeff Hunt, came on board. Next to the Riders, the 67's are a team that always turned out solid NHLers and had excellent fan support. That support was in jeopardy though as the 67's went on a skid of their own for a few years. However, Hunt, knew how to market the franchise and bingo; check the sponsors out on this site: www.ottawa67s.com/site/sponsorship/adopt.phpCertainly it takes more to sponsor a NHL franchise than it does a junior club. But, now the Senators are in financial dire straights albeit with a winning hockey team. And there isn't a Sens broadcast where I hear either Dean Brown, or Greg Millen mention the amount of empty seats for each game. One suggestion came out that the NHL approve the private industry advertising on jerseys. This would encourage local and international companies to get financially involved in helping out teams while marketing their own companies. It's a practice used by European teams right now. The only drawbacks I can see are the following; 1. you run the risk of altering the jersey's appearance to reflect that of a cereal box, which might take away from the attention to the original logos; and 2. you would also be committed to altering the jersey's appearance as new sponsors come on line and old ones leave. Anyway, there are positives as well. I mean, what Canadian-based company, or international company wanting to open a Canadian market for that matter, wouldn't jump at the chance at affiliating themselves with the Habs or Leafs? I'd be willing to bet that these clubs, along with any consistently successful clubs, would have the luxury of picking what high-profile corperation they'd be associated with. Coming full circle on you, a lot of the Sens' game packages can be had for about $200 bucks for 6 games. That's not too bad at all especially when you compare it to what other teams are asking. However, they're still having problems selling their tickets. Hard to figure out the Ottawa sports community at times. Tough market for any team. Cheers.
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Post by TheHabsfan on Jan 3, 2003 13:42:15 GMT -5
This reminds me of boxing...you know when a boxer has a web site advertised on his back...that's just wrong. I personnally never want to see Viagra advertised on the Holy jersey, or anything else for that matter.
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Post by MPLABBE on Jan 3, 2003 13:43:36 GMT -5
some Habs could use viagra to get the puck up ;D Sorry I just had to...the door was wide open... ;D
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