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Post by rocky on Dec 13, 2002 13:45:55 GMT -5
Good, nothing against Hack, but this is great. Its time for our lone super-star to rise again. He was a star in every level that he's played including the NHL, guys just don't lose it overnight. One another front, the yo-yo games will continue, Audi in Czer out. All this from RDS.ca. Send them away, please.
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Post by montreal on Dec 13, 2002 14:17:29 GMT -5
Good, nothing against Hack, but this is great. Its time for our lone super-star to rise again. He was a star in every level that he's played including the NHL, guys just don't lose it overnight. One another front, the yo-yo games will continue, Audi in Czer out. All this from RDS.ca. Send them away, please. Yes Theo playing is good, cause I would like to see us get a really good pick this year in the draft. After Saturday, I would expect Theo's gaa to be over 4.0 It's going to be ugly.
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Post by rocky on Dec 13, 2002 14:32:57 GMT -5
Nice to see such great support, just what Theo needs . Don't forget that its a long career
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Post by JohnnyVerdun on Dec 13, 2002 14:37:30 GMT -5
This is a bad idea. The chances of the Habs knocking off the Broons twice in one week aren't all that great to begin with, and Hackett is still on top of his game. If you want to help Theo get back to form, start him against Ottawa on the road or at home against the Sharks, but let Hackett deal with the heat at home tomorrow night.
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Post by BCHab on Dec 13, 2002 15:13:17 GMT -5
This is a bad idea. The chances of the Habs knocking off the Broons twice in one week aren't all that great to begin with, and Hackett is still on top of his game. If you want to help Theo get back to form, start him against Ottawa on the road or at home against the Sharks, but let Hackett deal with the heat at home tomorrow night. I must admit I don't get this one. I was sure they would have started Hackett against Boston. He played well against Tampa last night. Maybe Theodore and Audette will come up big. Let's hope so.
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Post by montreal on Dec 13, 2002 17:05:56 GMT -5
Nice to see such great support, just what Theo needs . Don't forget that its a long career Well we could all hold Theo's hand for him, and tell him everything will be aright. Maybe even sing folk songs around the camp fire. Now that would be great support. Funny, but Theodore didn't need any support when he was holding out for all those millions. Yea it's a long career, but thats what Jim Carey thought too. Lets face it, if you dont' stop the puck, you wont have a job for too long. Tell me what these games have in common, 6-1 loss to Buf, 6-2 loss to phi, 6-2 loss to phi, 5-1 loss to stl, 7-3 loss to Canes, 5-1 loss to star's, 7-6 loss to Avs. Yup thats right Jose "red light" Theodore. Oh I know it's the coaches fault, that damn MT, no wait it's the defense, yea it's there fault, damn Traverse/Quintal/Dykhuis, no it's our small forwards fault, no it's Savard's fault for putting this team together. No even better it's Hackett's fault just for being here. Funny thing is that Hackett has the same team in front of him as Red Light does, yet his gaa is under 2.4 while JT's is 3.8, but it's not Theo's fault, no can't be.
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 13, 2002 17:12:32 GMT -5
Dumb dumb dumb decision You bring back Theodore against a far less dangerous team like the Rangers or the Sabres or the Islanders...not against the best team in the east this year. MT outdoes himself once again. And Ratdette is back...*sigh* ..why not Lindsay? what has Audette done to get his spot back? Now watch Theo get a SO tomorrow and Audette score a hat trick
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 13, 2002 17:29:31 GMT -5
I am still shaking my head at this one... did Theodore show great improvement in the practices? did Rollie the goalie tell the coaching staff the ''fire'' is back in his eyes? did AS just get fed up and tell MT to play Theodore? What is going on? First Theodore gets a SO against the Isles and doesn't play the next game Then there was the game at home against the Canes when for some dumb reason he started despite being not even close to 100% Now this.
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Post by GoMtl on Dec 13, 2002 17:37:16 GMT -5
well if your looking at the numbers so far this year then this is a HORRIBLE move, and will never work. but i'm gonna neglect to think of it that way, i'm gonna think more along the lines of "Jose Theodore is the best goalie in the league, he has the hardware to prove it" and "Donald Audette is a great player, he scored quite a few clutch goals in the playoffs for us last season". At the start of the season both of these statements were likely thought of as true... so i'm just gonna pretend the first 29 games haven't happened for their sake. Time for two of our best players on paper to step up, and start over.
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 13, 2002 18:00:16 GMT -5
Well maybe MT is saying something along those lines. Maybe he thinks this is the confidence booster Theodore needs to get going, maybe he thinks beating the Bruins is exactly what Theodore needs to re-gain his confidence...maybe he thinks Hackett should have stopped the winning goal last night...who knows?
as for Audette, they are just benching Chow for the horrible defensive play he made last night...Audette and MT hate each other with a passion..
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Post by Habs_fan_in_LA on Dec 13, 2002 22:11:10 GMT -5
Theo may not play the whole game. He may get lifted in the third if the score is too bad. Seriously, it's a tough spot to rejoin the team after Hack beats the Bruins, but it is a good chance for Theo to prove he still can do it under pressure. I really hope that Thornton and the rest of his gang aren't allowed to treat Theodore like a school teacher sitting under a bucket of ice water while his students throw baseballs at the bullseye to drown him. Play some physical defense for !@@#$%^&*('s sake.
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Post by habwest on Dec 13, 2002 22:37:39 GMT -5
Well count me in with those who think these are two bad decisions. I would love to be proved wrong but I'm not holding out any hopes.
Montreal, you beat me to the punch about coddling Theo. Aww, poor little Theo. If he wants to make the big bucks and claim he belongs with the super stars, then he d**n well better deliver like a superstar. No excuses, because superstars don't need excuses.
Is Theo a one year wonder? I don't seem to remember Plante, Dryden & Roy going through this after they'd established themselves as superstars.
One of the most important things in being regarded as a superstar is CONSISTENCY. Sure, you can have a bad night now and then, or take a bit of time to get rolling at the beginning of the season, but a third of the season and 16 games?
Frankly, I'll have faith in Theo when he's proven that he can CONSISTENTLY deliver at a high level, that you can count on this guy when you really need him throughout the season for more than one season.
At the end of last year I thought the kid had it. And he got his rewards for what he did and more with that fancy contract. But this is a new year and it's time to do it all over again.
Jeez I'm disgusted with this kid. I absolutely hate these so called professionals who demand & take the big money, then kick back, take the summer off and live the good life, don't prepare properly for the next season and then stink. Even if Theo gets back to where he was he may cost this team a playoff spot and the chance for a top return on Hackett.
This guy owes everybody big time. Frankly, if I was GG I'd have him in for a chat and pointedly ask him what the hell was up and whether I'd wasted my money. Too bad owners can't recover on these contracts for non delivery of goods and services as specified, like in the real world.
The Packers are my team in the NFL and they have a true superstar in Brett Favre. He just delivers, year, after year, after year. 10 years in a row with 3,000+ yards passing, a new record I believe. So far, Theo is just a nothing punk hocking some crummy cakes compared to him.
Ahhh, that feel's much better. I promise I won't do it again.
As for Audette, he's damaged beyond repair. This business about trying to "jump start" him is getting a little pathetic. MT has been cutting Czerk's ice time down but, at home, he ought to be able to get the Ribs line and Czerk out in the most advantageous situation possible to get the most out of these guys. Of course that appears to be a foreign concept to MT.
Harummphh. Grumble, mutter......
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Post by seventeen on Dec 13, 2002 23:09:34 GMT -5
Count me in for playing Hackett for the next 10 games at least, but there are 2 seriously good reasons to play Theo next:
1) Him not being up to snuff is putting a big time cramp into Savard's plans to acquire another 30+, pseudo goal scorer.
2) If you've been watching (and I'm sure all we Bruin dislikers have indeed been doing so), Boston's bubble may have been burst by our win over them last week. Has it been 2 losses in a row or 3? (ok, I really haven't been tracking Ursus minor all that closely).
Therrien (or AS) really want to get JT out of his funk.
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Post by JohnnyVerdun on Dec 14, 2002 0:02:53 GMT -5
For what it's worth, the coaches are saying that Theodore has looked as good or better in practice than he did last year. Rollie the goalie coach is noted for his candour, so I suppose if it weren't so he wouldn't say it. Nonetheless, I wish MT would stop playing hunches so much, since he has a terrible track record, and just go with stats and momentum. Throwing Theo in against the bruins is a hunch and a hope. Putting Ribeiro out on the first line instead of Kilger, late in a close game, was a hunch. Leaving Lindsay out to take a crucial face off against the Canes last year was a hunch. I don't like MT's hunches. He went with a hunch long enough for Audette to rack up over 90 minutes of powerplay time without a goal. That's bad guesswork and that's sticking with an idea in spite of the numbers. I don't like either of thes traits in a head coach. Give me a guy with glasses and a slide rule and the kind of inner fire that doesn't require making faces and punching walls to demonstrate when you're angry.....
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Post by seventeen on Dec 14, 2002 1:59:31 GMT -5
I don't mind a coach playing hunches, but those that are good at it, are so because their hunches are based on cues they pick up, and then, using solid deductive reasoning (the 'gut feel'), it works out more often than not. Therrien's gut feel more than likely is gas from those burritos HA keeps feeding him. Also coaches usually change something when it's not going well. For the life of me I can't figure out why MT changes things when they're working. (replacing Kilger with Ribeiro for example)
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Post by Vichab on Dec 14, 2002 3:09:13 GMT -5
this just blows me away. i would have bet my last dollar that Hack would be playing. Don't get me wrong - i think jose has to get in there and soon but you do it on the road against a team that doesn't have too much fire power not against a team that is going to be hungry for revenge and a win after losing two in a row and hasn't lost 3 in a row all season. Couple that with the fact that Hack has been playing well and was the difference in the third period against this same bruins team is just unbelievable. aside from putting the two points at risk another blow out against Jose which with the bruins is very possible could be devastating for the kid whose confidence has been rocked. MT has done it again. After the road trip i started thinking that maybe AS hasn't done that bad a job putting this team together but he has not got the right guy using the tools. He has a tool abusing the guys.
Audette is no big deal as he and Cz are just playing 4 th line until one hopefully breaks out and i'm betting it will be Cz before Aud.
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Post by Yeti on Dec 14, 2002 7:26:33 GMT -5
This could be ugly.
First of all, I think Audette should be put on waivers, and sent home if he's not picked up. His comments and whining in the past two weeks were embarassing ( I was not the worst, I'm a victim, bla, bla, bla.). Considering he was benched in Dallas, and now in Montréal, so by two organizations interested in winning, he should look in the mirror and stip being selfish.
I would like to be optimistic about Theo but I'm not. I know some of you will strongly disagree, but I always felt Garon was the real goalie of the future. He's bigger and, according to Melanson, technically better than Theodore (who rely on instinct and reflexes, both seem gone this year). I know Garon was not picked-up on waivers, I don't know what happened, still seem unbelievable to me. Garon is dominating the AHL again, he had 3-4 bad games in the NHL but the habs were on the road and playing terrible. He was inactive in the 3 weeks before that. The guy deserves another chance before being called a bust.
If it's another blown-out, the crowd will get on his case. I don't like this scenario.
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Post by rocky on Dec 14, 2002 8:52:46 GMT -5
Ok, I started this thread and took my lumps ( white flag ). First I wish to apologize to Montreal for a snide remark which I directed his way. Everyone has responded with a negative view on MT's decision, fair enough. For me however, I know that Theo will return to form and when he does we'll be a more difficult team to beat. Theo is obviously struggling, but he is no Johnny-come-lately. He has been a superb goalie throught his career, it just breaks my heart to see him struggle like this. Right or wrong decision,lets all hope that he starts his comeback tonight. Cheers
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 14, 2002 9:21:41 GMT -5
Therrien: ''We want our goalies to not go a week without playing'' ''I am convinced he will have a good game'' plus what JV said how he looked good in practice...but I don't think I have ever seen Theodore look as depressed as he does in the picture in the paper today...holy cow....he looks like he's on the verge of suicide
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Post by JacquesInFL on Dec 14, 2002 10:07:44 GMT -5
Rocky, considering the investment the organisation made in José, it is entirely necessary to find way out of deep slump and this requires starts. But timing here worries me, as others say. Boston should be hungry for this one. And Bruins have combination of skating (faster than Habs, IMO) and strength to dominate flow through neutral zone. It is hard to forecast quiet night for JT.
I would rather see Lindsay or Blouin tonight than Audette. Look in the numbers:
AUDETTE: 21GP, 2G, 4A, 6Pts, -6, 15:40 Min/Gm, 45 Shots, 84:23 PP Min, 0PPG, 3PPA, 0:12 PK Min, 246:14 EV Min, 3 EV Pts, 82:05 EV Min/Point
Ratdog's lack of productivity is stimply staggering. 82 minutes of even strength for each point...82 minutes!! And Donald was the beneficiary of big minutes -- almost 16 per game. Bad luck cannot explain such statistical outlier. I mean, for instance, we have guys who had few games slump or not offensive player and their numbers are not even close -- Gilmour 35 EV Min/Point, Juneau 37. And then you see the productive guys like Koivu 23, Zednik 25, Bulis 24. Or maybe MT's hunch is Audette can help the PP. I hope he's right but this is like playing lottery...
Is Savard planning on carrying 15 forwards until Christmas? Until March?
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Post by UberCranky on Dec 14, 2002 11:55:19 GMT -5
Thge B's are going to try and prove as point. If they have a chance to blow us out they will do everything they can to do so. This will do wonders for Theo's confidence. *bangs head*
Be afraid, be very afraid.
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 14, 2002 12:16:22 GMT -5
Rocky, considering the investment the organisation made in José, it is entirely necessary to find way out of deep slump and this requires starts. But timing here worries me, as others say. Boston should be hungry for this one. And Bruins have combination of skating (faster than Habs, IMO) and strength to dominate flow through neutral zone. It is hard to forecast quiet night for JT. I would rather see Lindsay or Blouin tonight than Audette. Look in the numbers: AUDETTE: 21GP, 2G, 4A, 6Pts, -6, 15:40 Min/Gm, 45 Shots, 84:23 PP Min, 0PPG, 3PPA, 0:12 PK Min, 246:14 EV Min, 3 EV Pts, 82:05 EV Min/Point Ratdog's lack of productivity is stimply staggering. 82 minutes of even strength for each point...82 minutes!! And Donald was the beneficiary of big minutes -- almost 16 per game. Bad luck cannot explain such statistical outlier. I mean, for instance, we have guys who had few games slump or not offensive player and their numbers are not even close -- Gilmour 35 EV Min/Point, Juneau 37. And then you see the productive guys like Koivu 23, Zednik 25, Bulis 24. Or maybe MT's hunch is Audette can help the PP. I hope he's right but this is like playing lottery... Is Savard planning on carrying 15 forwards until Christmas? Until March? Someone should sent those stats to every french media outlet...they keep on saying Audette deserves a chance on an offensive line...LOL! what a bunch of blind ignorants. I mean didn't he paly 10 games with K and Z and did NOTHING with them? in fact even held them back?
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Post by montreal on Dec 14, 2002 15:58:22 GMT -5
Ok, I started this thread and took my lumps ( white flag ). First I wish to apologize to Montreal for a snide remark which I directed his way. Everyone has responded with a negative view on MT's decision, fair enough. For me however, I know that Theo will return to form and when he does we'll be a more difficult team to beat. Theo is obviously struggling, but he is no Johnny-come-lately. He has been a superb goalie throught his career, it just breaks my heart to see him struggle like this. Right or wrong decision,lets all hope that he starts his comeback tonight. Cheers No harm no foul. It's all in good fun. Theo was great last year, while only making 1.65M, but I guess I'm still pissed that he got so much money. I was hoping he would have signed for 3-3.5-4M (10.5 over 3) And that would have been a lot less money, but he held out and got the big bucks, and he's now doing his best Jim Carey act, which is painful to watch.
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 14, 2002 16:32:26 GMT -5
so you would have prefered seeing AS tell Theodore to stay home and miss training camp, miss the start of the season, just so he could make 4 million instead of 5 million?
what is wrong with 5 million per year for the league MVP and best goalie in the NHL and the guy who brought the Habs millions in playoff revenue last year? he was our best player, shouldn't our best player make more than anyone on the team?
sure he has stunk this year...but there is still 2/3's of the season to go and he has too much talent to stink so much
stop looking at the negatives(Jim Carey) and start thinking of all the other goalies who have struggled for big stretches(like Theodore) and re-gained their form in the past 2-3 years(Potvin, Salo, Belfour, Cloutier, Kolzig,etc)
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Post by Ged on Dec 14, 2002 17:17:06 GMT -5
To me, it looks like the 5 million wonder boy came to camp with an inflated head, and it became abundantly clear early, that he wasn't the same goalie as last year. His angles are awful, and his rebounds are some of the juiciest morsels I've seen in a while. After the first bad goal in these blowouts, the team starts to play on edge, which simply exasperates the situation, as everyone starts running around more than normal. This is a team that has no clue on defensive zone coverage to start with, so after these ugly goals go in, the proverbial snowball gains great momentum on it's way down the slope. The team clearly has more confidence with Hack in the net, because they know he can and will bail them out if they screw up supremely, ala Quintal and Markov last game. I can't stress enough of the different game a team plays when they have confidence in their goalie. As for dressing Audette over Lindsay or Blouin, I can't agree with. In the last game their was some bad blood rekindled with the spearing play, and the subsequent public beaking off. We're already badly overmatched in terms of size with the Booins, so dressing a small, unproductive, non-grinding player like Audette for this game, is exactly the type of move I'd expect from my favourite coach.
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Post by montreal on Dec 14, 2002 17:57:43 GMT -5
so you would have prefered seeing AS tell Theodore to stay home and miss training camp, miss the start of the season, just so he could make 4 million instead of 5 million? what is wrong with 5 million per year for the league MVP and best goalie in the NHL and the guy who brought the Habs millions in playoff revenue last year? he was our best player, shouldn't our best player make more than anyone on the team? sure he has stunk this year...but there is still 2/3's of the season to go and he has too much talent to stink so much stop looking at the negatives(Jim Carey) and start thinking of all the other goalies who have struggled for big stretches(like Theodore) and re-gained their form in the past 2-3 years(Potvin, Salo, Belfour, Cloutier, Kolzig,etc) Its not about Savard, its about Theo doing whats best for the team. He put Savard into a position that he had to sign him and for a lot of money. Fine, then you better play some darn good hockey for the largest contract in Habs history. Instead, he's been one of the worst goalies in the entire league. I don't know why he's struggling, but if he doesn't regain his form, well this team is in serious trouble. Where Theo goes, so does the team.
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