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Post by GoMtl on Dec 4, 2002 17:22:09 GMT -5
with the offseason aquisition of mariusz czerkawski the habs created one of their biggest problems this season. they have 3 soft, relatively small, scoring right wingers. AS has tried to move both czerkawski and audette, but absolutely no one wants them. rather than playing both former 30 goal scorers on the top two lines and using them to their full potential michel therrien prefers to sit one of them for multiple games, czerkawski being the latest victim. simple solution to this problem would be trading petrov, the cheapest, and easiest to move of the 3. one problem, petrov is like a brother to the teams fastest rising defensive star andrei markov who speaks relatively no english. what should the team do about this problem?
-leave it the way it is? have czerkawski sit, and or play the 4th line with little ice time, and even less intensity?
-move petrov or audette to the left side and see if they can adapt to playing their off wing like richard zednik has and let czerkawski once again play the right side on one of the top lines? (or give czer some more games on the left side to see if he can adapt better)
-break up the checking 3rd line and give all 3 a spot on the right side of a scoring line?
-trade petrov, and possibly aquire another russian speaking player to assist markov
that's about all i can think of to do with this problem... if u have any other ideas let's hear em.
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Post by montreal on Dec 4, 2002 17:29:55 GMT -5
I would sit Chow. Why is everyone so upset at Chow sitting? Am I the only one that wants to puke everytime I see Chow on the ice. This guy never gives a good effort. I saw him on the top line, I saw him on the 2nd line, I saw him on the 4th line, I saw him on the PP, I saw him on the PK. He never shoots, or creates anything. He has 1 goal that was a weak backhander. (and an empty net) So sit him so games, then sit Petrov for some or McKay or Audette. I don't care they all suck, whats the difference what one is playing like crap doing nothing worth while?
I just don't believe that people are so upset for Chow, like he's a personal friend of there's that Therrien just beat up. IMO he doesn't deserve to be in the lineup, but then again neither does Audette. But Audette is getting a ton of shots, while Chow can't do anything with the puck, I don't know how he even has 28 shots so far. I never seen him shoot, and if its along the boards, he doesn't even fight for it.
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 4, 2002 17:32:35 GMT -5
Hey Montreal can you remind me what you think of Chow again? ;D
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Post by JohnnyVerdun on Dec 4, 2002 17:40:25 GMT -5
Hey. I could see Chow with around 20 goals and 40 assists if he was just left on the top line, despite the slow start and the circus that Therrien and Savard have created. He's a better player than Audette. He's getting more points per minute than Audette already, despite playing less on the powerplay. He skates better. He can handle a crisp pass. He passes better than Audi. His shot is as good. He's more creative. He's bigger. He's more effective in one on one battles for the puck. He's more versatile. He's not as bad as Audette at backchecking and playing without the puck in the neutral zone. He's cheaper. He's not under contract for 2 and a half more years. I don't know, there are a few reasons why I think that, as between the two, Czerk should get the call. He should never have been yanked from the first line for Audi to begin with. That worked (Audette produced) for all of two games. In the five games prior to that, Czerk had 7 points, I think, and did that even though he played about half the amount on the pp that Audette got when he returned, and continues to get despite sucking so bad that it makes me want to throw canned goods at the goddamned television....
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Post by The New Guy on Dec 4, 2002 20:48:12 GMT -5
I think the Chow issue is not one of "Doesn't Chow make you sick?" so much as "Who makes you sicker - Chow or Audi". Given my druthers I wouldn't play either of them, but that's not an option and so personally I would rather see Chow float up and down the ice on a line with Zednik and Koivu. Why? Here's a list:
(1)Audette is slow. Now I'm not saying Chow is fast, but he's faster than Audette and wouldn't hold the dynamic duo back nearly as much
(2)Chow has a better shooting percentage. Granted, 2.1% isn't that big a difference, but when you consider that Audette, having spent more of his time on the first line, had higher quality chances.
(3)The Polish Prince has scores 0.04833 points/minute. The import car averages 0.01896 points/minute.
(4)Czerkawski had an excellent pre-season, and is know to run either really hot or really cold. I think I'd handle him running cold for a month if he could run hot for a month after. Audette has yet to really show anything this year.
(5)Koivu has praised Mariuz's work ethic in public. Has anyone said anything good about Donald lately? Did you see his half assed attempt to hold Zednik away from Dykhuis? Hey, let me stick my arm in front of you - one of the biggest guys on the team and the kind that forces his way around defencemen even bigger than him. Nothing.
(6)Audette is known as a whiner - the reason why Dallas got rid of him so quickly last season. He doesn't conform to roles. We know from Koivu's statement during spring training that Czerkawski is at least trying to pick up his defensive work. And while he's not a poster boy for the ideal player, his reputation is tarnished by his lack of work ethic on some nights rather than his unwillingness to work with the coach.
(7)Finally - Audette suffered a major injury last season and has not had his laser like shot back since then (which he built his career on). Audette is damaged goods as far as I'm concerned and not at all valuble to the team as it it. Czerkawski at least isn't suffering from any injuries.
Phew... so there. That's at least why I'm pissed Czerkawski was waived and Audette still plays on the top line.
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Post by montreal on Dec 5, 2002 0:31:53 GMT -5
I think the Chow issue is not one of "Doesn't Chow make you sick?" so much as "Who makes you sicker - Chow or Audi". Given my druthers I wouldn't play either of them, but that's not an option and so personally I would rather see Chow float up and down the ice on a line with Zednik and Koivu. Why? Here's a list: (1)Audette is slow. Now I'm not saying Chow is fast, but he's faster than Audette and wouldn't hold the dynamic duo back nearly as much (2)Chow has a better shooting percentage. Granted, 2.1% isn't that big a difference, but when you consider that Audette, having spent more of his time on the first line, had higher quality chances. (3)The Polish Prince has scores 0.04833 points/minute. The import car averages 0.01896 points/minute. (4)Czerkawski had an excellent pre-season, and is know to run either really hot or really cold. I think I'd handle him running cold for a month if he could run hot for a month after. Audette has yet to really show anything this year. (5)Koivu has praised Mariuz's work ethic in public. Has anyone said anything good about Donald lately? Did you see his half assed attempt to hold Zednik away from Dykhuis? Hey, let me stick my arm in front of you - one of the biggest guys on the team and the kind that forces his way around defencemen even bigger than him. Nothing. (6)Audette is known as a whiner - the reason why Dallas got rid of him so quickly last season. He doesn't conform to roles. We know from Koivu's statement during spring training that Czerkawski is at least trying to pick up his defensive work. And while he's not a poster boy for the ideal player, his reputation is tarnished by his lack of work ethic on some nights rather than his unwillingness to work with the coach. (7)Finally - Audette suffered a major injury last season and has not had his laser like shot back since then (which he built his career on). Audette is damaged goods as far as I'm concerned and not at all valuble to the team as it it. Czerkawski at least isn't suffering from any injuries. Phew... so there. That's at least why I'm pissed Czerkawski was waived and Audette still plays on the top line. Very good points. Mine aren't so good, but 1. Audette is getting a ton of shots, way more then Chow (I know he's on the 1st line/PP) but it's not even close and he has sat out too. 2. Audette was our leading goal scorer in the playoffs (6), and I keep having flash backs that he will find his way again. But I dont like Audette either. So sit Chow, then sit Audette, then Chow, then Audette.
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Post by PTH on Dec 5, 2002 0:45:30 GMT -5
Hey. I could see Chow with around 20 goals and 40 assists if he was just left on the top line, despite the slow start and the circus that Therrien and Savard have created. He's a better player than Audette. He's getting more points per minute than Audette already, despite playing less on the powerplay. He skates better. He can handle a crisp pass. He passes better than Audi. His shot is as good. He's more creative. He's bigger. He's more effective in one on one battles for the puck. He's more versatile. He's not as bad as Audette at backchecking and playing without the puck in the neutral zone. He's cheaper. He's not under contract for 2 and a half more years. I don't know, there are a few reasons why I think that, as between the two, Czerk should get the call. He should never have been yanked from the first line for Audi to begin with. That worked (Audette produced) for all of two games. In the five games prior to that, Czerk had 7 points, I think, and did that even though he played about half the amount on the pp that Audette got when he returned, and continues to get despite sucking so bad that it makes me want to throw canned goods at the goddamned television.... Agree through and through. Audette just sucks, sometimes he hustles hard, but his understanding of the game is so poor that it doesn't help much. Audette is like a Brian Savage - sometimes hustles, but it doesn't change much. Chow is like Rosie - never seems to be working hard, but never really terrible in terms of defensive positioning, and a player with better all-around skill.
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Post by JohnnyVerdun on Dec 5, 2002 1:15:28 GMT -5
In fairness to Audette, I don't think he's 100%, as TNG describes in some detail. He doesn't have the hands and the shot that made him effective before he got sliced last year. His goals in the playoffs were not pretty ones at all, and certainly weren't the one-timers and lasers for which he's famous.
Having said all that, he just has nothing with which to compensate for a lack of pure goal-scoring ability, and that's a real problem. In a way, the story is a sad one for Audette and the Habs. They're now more or less stuck with oneanother. So we can vote for Czerk all we like, but we'd still see Audette no matter what they did or didn't do with Czerk. The only way out of this is for Audette to somehow start racking up some points and for someone to get interested sometime before the deadline. But I can't see that. I mean, unless he gets 15 goals between now and then, it's just not going to happen, and it probably won't happen even if he has decent numbers this year. I mean, there are going to be better players available. I'm sure of it. So what do you do if you're AS right now? It's not all his fault -- as I think Audette would be more effective but for the injury -- but it sure as hell is all his problem. You have to play him. There's just nothing else you can do. I mean, you can't just send him home or pay him to sit in the pressbox, right?
Tonight was another example, I think, of what we can expect: over 5 minutes of pp time and no goals. He's now got almost an hour and half of pp time under his belt this year, and his numbers are appalling. And I don't see this as something that's likely to change. It may, but I don't think it will. Because it's not a timing thing, or a shape thing, or a hustle thing. He's just not able to find the space and get off a clean shot on goal, and his lack of size and grit is itself a problem and a liability on the pp. He's out there with Koivu and Zed most of the time and they're the ones down low doing most of the diry work. And if Audette can't get inside without getting totally overwhelmed by a d-man, his shot is not going to buy him much from the outside....not against most of today's goaltenders....and not unless the whole box has shifted away from little Donald, leaving him all alone. That's just not going to happen enough to justify him leading the team in pp minutes.
It's a real, real problem. The habs pp was 0-5 in the second period alone tonight. That's just not going to cut it.
One thing's for sure. It'll be interesting to see how Savard handles this over the next three months if Donald doesn't get smoking hot.....
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Post by PTH on Dec 5, 2002 1:59:01 GMT -5
Having said all that, he just has nothing with which to compensate for a lack of pure goal-scoring ability, and that's a real problem. In a way, the story is a sad one for Audette and the Habs. They're now more or less stuck with oneanother. ..... I mean, you can't just send him home or pay him to sit in the pressbox, right? The Habs seem to have decided to go with Audette whatever happens, Chow simply hasn't been getting a chance - but I wonder if AS realises fully that once Chow is gone we are truly stuck with Audette on the first line..... if you couldn't scratch Audette for Chow, do you think we could scratch him to give Ward another look ? Or for Kilger ? I doubt it. As to Audette's lack of other qualities, they're the reason I always hated that trade. I didn't expect the injury, or even Audette to have so many problems scoring (even after the injury!), but over 4 years, a guy with a highly one-dimensional game is a major risk. McKay isn't what he used to be, same for Gilmour, and all kinds of other veteran UFAs too, but they find ways to be at least somewhat useful.... *sigh* We should have just kept Berezin... Yup. 1st line winger getting major minutes, still owed 8 million bucks, and not scoring. Major, major, problem. If AS can get out of this, I might regain faith in him. But he's got his work cut out for him.
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 5, 2002 7:26:38 GMT -5
Audette has nothing left.
No speed, no size and now no hands
Useless. Maybe we can get him to retire just so I don't have to see his rat face ever again!
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Post by JohnnyVerdun on Dec 5, 2002 7:39:14 GMT -5
That'll cost you.......let's see, 70% of 8 million dollars,....carry the two,.....$6,438,952.71.....approximately......please make the cheque payable to The Donald Fund, po box 66 Zurich, Switzerland.....Certified, us funds only...Thank you very much.
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Post by Willie Dog on Dec 5, 2002 9:48:47 GMT -5
The problem with this team is that they suffer from Nordiq-itis. Ever since the WHA and the NHL merged, Canadiens have had to deal with this french speaking player crap (the french media have ruined this team with their meddling). While the Nordiques were drafting the Stasny's we were picking up every used french puck bag there was. Therrien is doing the same thing by playing Audette (a waste of oxygen) and sitting Chow. My feeling is if Koivu says good things about Chow and nothing about Audi, then put Chow on his line and sit Audi's ass down. Last night's game blew chunks. We have a bunch of girls on defence.
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Post by The New Guy on Dec 5, 2002 10:56:34 GMT -5
Audette averages 0.1361 shots per minute on the top line with loads of PP time. Czerkawski averages 0.1168 shots per minute playing on a lesser line, playing the PK more than the PP (why? I haven't got a clue) and playing on the wrong wing for what was it? 4 of his nineteen games? That's not a whole lot of difference when you consider those factors.
As for his playoff performance - I agree. He was great for us. But all he's shown me this season is that either (a) he doesn't care or (b) the playoffs were a fluke. He hasn't brought anything to this team this season. Anything. At least Czerkawski had a good preseason.
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Post by Willie Dog on Dec 5, 2002 15:35:49 GMT -5
I would be interested how production on the Koivu line has changed with the addition of Audette? Has it gotten better, worse or stayed the same. I'm betting on worse and I can bet you that the plus minus has dropped because of Audi's lousy (lazy) defensive work ethic.
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 5, 2002 15:56:56 GMT -5
Well the Koivu line has done nothing the last 2 games.
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Post by HabBoy on Dec 5, 2002 16:06:21 GMT -5
exactly...they have done not too much. Audette is a waste of space out there...he really needs to be down on the 3rd or 4th lines
Does anybody remember in the preseason when Therrien said they had 4 'scoring ' lines?
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 5, 2002 16:14:37 GMT -5
They did!
Chow-Koivu-McKay Zed-Gilmour-Petrov Juneau-Perreault-Audette Then some 4th line combination of Bulis/Ribs/Kilger/Hossa
How things can change..........
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