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Post by montreal on Dec 2, 2002 23:42:40 GMT -5
So Chow wants out? Well if he gets traded, that leaves only Audette, Gilmor, Perreault, Petrov, Dykhuis, Quintal, Traverse, left that I want to see traded, released, or shot. Chow sucks, and I hope he never plays a game with us again. Goal scorer my ass. He can't create any room for himself, he's the softest player on the team, and his lack of effort on the ice is a freakin joke. (but so is Audette's, and Perreault's-on his bad days) How many good shots, has Chow taken, I haven't seen many at all. His 2 goals, a empty net, and a weak backhander. I really don't see how he scored 35 goals in this league, I never see him shoot the puck, and if a player comes within 10 feet of him he spins around and dumps the puck. What a waste of talent. Please trade him for a pick. I'd rather see the 4th liner Jason Ward play on Chow anyday, but whoever takes him should have to take Audette with him. Please! Come on Nashville, Flames, Sabers, Panthers, you need help with offence and we got a former 70pts and a formerr 79pts player.
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Post by PTH on Dec 2, 2002 23:48:19 GMT -5
But if you trade Audette and don't get a good return people are going to wonder ''why did you trade un des notres for nothing'' when it's Chow ''a damn European...who cares what we got...let him whine somewhere else'' Sometime a GM doesn't want to create that kind of distraction... Well, Audette is making it awfully easy for AS.... "André, why did you deal a good hometown boy who was happy to play here? " "Well, he sucked, pretty badly too". What can anyone say to that ? It's true, and anyone who looks at the situation has to admit it, too. Saku and Zed are scoring while playing basically 4 on 5... If Audette were merely mediocre, and looked to be heading for a 15 goal season, people could claim he was just in a funk, but Donald just isn't cutting it. He's the weakest link. Any volunteers for the firing squad ? I'm in, only I want an assault rifle - I'm not letting him get away.
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Post by Ranger Ranchod on Dec 2, 2002 23:51:17 GMT -5
But NYR...are they a good destination? Who do they have at RW? Dvorak? who else? Pavel is a LW no? Loaded at RW... Bure, Dvorak, Sammuelsson, Barnaby, McCarthy, Petrovicky, Lundmark... we've got a number of RWs playing LW.
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Post by seventeen on Dec 3, 2002 0:03:48 GMT -5
But I agree with JV and a few others: Audette is wholly and utterly useless and trading Czerk will not change alter this fact. The numbers are frightening (and, Audette has now played as many games on Saku's line as Czerk): AUDETTE: 20GP, 2G, 4A, 6Pts, -5, 15:43 Min/Gm, 42 Shots, 79:14 PP Min, 0PPG, 3PPA, 0:12 PK Min, 236:59 EV Min, 3 EV Pts, 79:00 EV Min/Point CZERK: 19GP, 2G, 7A, 9Pts, -1, 12:55 Min/Gm, 29 Shots, 20:57 PP Min, 0PPG, 1PPA, 9:44 PK Min, 214:49 EV Min, 8 EV Pts, 26:51 EV Min/Point I realize it would unprecedented for the organisation to eat $8M on Audette (or maybe less, I do not know the details of buyout), but sunk costs are sunk costs. For me, watching the money burn on the Bell Centre ice is worst scenario. And some people are suggesting Savard will not take this step because he loses face or incurs wrath of French media (which is not monolithic as Doc and Paul says). I am not convinced. This organisation traded Roy and then the local boy (Thibault) it acquired for Roy. Captains Carbo and Turgeon were sent packing. In each case life went on, no? So why would Audette ruin Savard? Sorry to make this post about Audette and Savard's options, but this looks like an unsettling (and unsettled) issue that will impact on ice effectiveness and clubhouse unity. Well....couple of points. First, Asham has 2 goals, 4 assists, averaging 10 minutes a game. (Had to get that in). Secondly with regard to the Habs moving players like Roy, Carbo and Turgeon....weren't the coaches of the day in a strong position vis a vis the player? Certainly, Tremblay seemed to have great sway over Houle. I can't recall the reason for Carbo's trade (another terrible one), but Turgeon seemed to be in the coaches and media's dog house at the time. (Please correct me if I'm wrong....once every dozen years, I am). Czerkawski has annoyed MT now by spouting off, but Audette appears to have Teflon skin with regard to the above scenarios. He's impotent, not a boil on someone's AS. The only deal Savard has made where he moved the player again was Berezin. And I hardly call that an earth shattering decision. Last time I looked, Berezin was Russian, not Quebecois. Sorry, guys, it just seems that AS has a really hard time dealing any French Canadian players. So it's really, really unfortunate that most of our very worst performers this year happen to belong to that club. It makes the possibility that AS will move them remote. Audette's contract is another factor, naturally, but how else does one explain the amount of quality ice time with very little return? If he was a stock, I'd have sold him and claimed my capital loss months ago. I can see AS taking his time dealing Jeff Hackett, because he's a quality person and excellent goaltender and we want our trading partner to be desparate with a capital D. But Audette? Traverse? Quintal? These guys are never going to get better and you can't get anything for them. Lots more guys like them are around, at a much lower cost. Just buy them out GG.
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 3, 2002 9:26:04 GMT -5
Well, Audette is making it awfully easy for AS.... "André, why did you deal a good hometown boy who was happy to play here? " "Well, he sucked, pretty badly too". What can anyone say to that ? It's true, and anyone who looks at the situation has to admit it, too. Saku and Zed are scoring while playing basically 4 on 5... If Audette were merely mediocre, and looked to be heading for a 15 goal season, people could claim he was just in a funk, but Donald just isn't cutting it. He's the weakest link. Any volunteers for the firing squad ? I'm in, only I want an assault rifle - I'm not letting him get away. Oh for sure I want him shot like you do ;D
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 3, 2002 9:26:53 GMT -5
Loaded at RW... Bure, Dvorak, Sammuelsson, Barnaby, McCarthy, Petrovicky, Lundmark... we've got a number of RWs playing LW. Lundmark is a center and he is the minors so he doesn't count ;D
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Post by legaspesien on Dec 3, 2002 10:02:41 GMT -5
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 3, 2002 10:20:04 GMT -5
Thanks for digging that up Gaspe
Let's look at what appears before that phrase:
Asham is one player who is likely getting his last hard look. He was a healthy scratch against Ottawa on Saturday and has yet to make a consistent positive impression as an Islander. The only solace the team can take from Asham's ineffectiveness is the player they traded him for
Think both teams regret the trade?
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Post by UberCranky on Dec 3, 2002 10:28:43 GMT -5
Way to go Savard. Trade for him, don't play him and then place him on waivers. Buddy, you are getting worse in every deal. You finally earned your C grade with this brilliant bit of strategy.
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 3, 2002 10:32:52 GMT -5
I would wait and see if another source reports this before blasting Savard.
A NY newspaper is probably not the most reliable source
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Post by The New Guy on Dec 3, 2002 10:52:22 GMT -5
Andre did what???
For Christ's Sake please be right Marc. Please let it be some idiot with his head in the clouds who confused two different things (Czerkawski wanting to be trade with him being placed on waivers maybe).
Czerkawski has been ineffectual? Yeah - I agree, though I would point out that it's had to be effective playing from the bench without many minutes. On the wrong bloody wing mostly. Yeah - and MT is still playing that... that... dammit, I can't think of a non-vulgar name for Audette.
Eyagh. Two days ago I was defending Savard, but I may very well be jumping off the bandwagon if this is confirmed. Hope the ground is soft.
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Post by Viper on Dec 3, 2002 11:12:09 GMT -5
I can't even look at the man. the very sound of his name on CJAD strikes anger and hatreds in my heart. My beloved habs are being coached by insanity and it has to end. If i we're old like HA, DIS and other's i'd surely have been killed by a heart failure by now. Seeing travesty on the ice in the dying minute while Markov sits. The infamous playoff daceoff and 2 man disadvantage. AAARRRGGGHHH. where's that lethel injection syrum when i need it. d**n i missed that part about the waiver's i'm with the New guy in hoping that's a misinformed article. Otherwise the last pinky finger i had on the AS wagon will come off and for me since i'm already on the ground it doesn't matter if it's soft. New guy if you need to i'll break your fall from one hab fan to another. Dis would you be mad if i changed my name to Disgruntled_80's_hab I wouldn't be surprised if.. Mariusz is back in the lineup Wednesday on the top line. Increasing that value of his................. The sad part is his production will most likely jump because the only time he did well thus far is on the top line. He'll do well actually far better than Audiette. Then we'll trade him and be stuck with the latter. Man i was optimistic before this season started i'd hate to dig up my post's from the summer i'd probably cry at how insane they now sound.
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Post by habruti on Dec 3, 2002 13:43:21 GMT -5
???Audette is not nearly half the player he was last year whih was already not the best guy we could have get but we have him so be it. Unfortunatly for us the only RW we have not had any problems with is Dackell. All others Petrov, Czerkawski, Audette, Mackay are underperforming IMO.
In the mean time we have Ward who is tearing up the league in the AHL, Audette and Czerkawski who wants to be traded, Petrov not being half the player he was last year. They is not many ways to fix those problems AS needs to trade and quick cause it will be too late after this long road trip unless he wants to be in the race for Zherdev or Horton.
Seems like everyone agrees that MT is a jackass and that he should be given is pink slip but I get the feeling that there are a lot more problems then that. We have the defense situation who is awfull and yet everyone is looking at making change with our forwards. I think that if AS could manage to swing one or two decent deals to change the face of this team we could be settled for a much better team next year while still hoping to make the playoff this year.
Hoping for some of the following moves: 1. Wave Audette and pray that another team will pick him up. 2. Hope for a quick return of Souray 3. Kick MT out and get decent coaching staff 4. Bring Hainsey, Hossa and Ward from the farm team 5. Swing a deal for Czerkawski/Petrov, Hackett and another player for a decent 2way RW 6. Demote Dykhuis (I actually think he is even worst then Traverse this year)
Possible trades: - Hackett, Czerkawski, Kilger to NYR for Radek Dvorak and 2nd - Dykhuis and Petrov to whom ever is willing to eat there salary in exchange of picks
Create a linup with balance:
1. Zednik, Koivu, Ward Some of you say Ward does not have the speed top be in the top two lines but I do not think he is any slower then Audette and is grit would certainly make him more valuable on that line.
2. Bulis, Perreault, Dvorak Bulis and Dvorak are sound defensively and would certainly cover for Perreult. This could end up an effective line
3. Juneau, Hossa, Dackell Groom Hossa has a center (is natural position). He will do mistake but will be able to old his own defensively after speding 2/3rd of the season with Dacell and Juneau. Next year if all goes well he could be a cnadidate to replace Perreault as our no.2 center.
4. Blouin, Lindsay, McKay Crash and bang line to shake things up when necessary.
Souray, Brisebois Souray's physical presence on the sides of Brisebois would greatly help him be even better. Markov, Quintal I think Quintal would be a better fit then Rivet has he tends to take less chances then Rivet and is IMO slithly better a clearing the front of the net (does not mean he is good). Hainsey, Rivet Rivet has done a good job on the side of Markov and I would use him to do the same thing with Hainsey. Hainsey, Rivet
Garon and Theo in the net...A tandem for years to come.
My personal preference for a new coaching staff: Head coach: Larry Robinson Assistants: Mike Bossy, Rod Langway, C.Jodouin, R.Melancon
But since I am not the GM, AS is, Slather would never trade Dvorak for these three, we will end the year with Chow and Audette in the lineup, MT will complete the year has a head coach and will be fired for missing the playoff, Ward will loose faith and end the year ina slump and Hainsey and Hossa will have a good year in Hamilton but would have been better in the NHL.....
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Post by GoMtl on Dec 3, 2002 13:46:38 GMT -5
someone on fanhome posted that czerkawski is now on waivers, and that newsday have reported it... i tried to find whatever it was that this person read but i couldn't. hopefully they're just making it up.
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Post by Viper on Dec 3, 2002 13:50:01 GMT -5
Welcome Aboard Habruti.
Great post and i hope so0me of that wish list comes true for us especially the part about fire Therrien.
Cheer's and welcome again
Viper.
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Post by darz on Dec 3, 2002 13:54:28 GMT -5
My personal preference for a new coaching staff: Head coach: Larry Robinson Assistants: Mike Bossy, Rod Langway, C.Jodouin, R.Melancon ..... although i have some disagrement with your lineup, especially the ward thing, i LOVE this coaching staff you put together. the only bummer is now that you have posted it, it will never happen, because nothing happens that is ever posted!
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Post by darz on Dec 3, 2002 13:56:04 GMT -5
someone on fanhome posted that czerkawski is now on waivers, and that newsday have reported it... i tried to find whatever it was that this person read but i couldn't. hopefully they're just making it up. i read the newsday article, it said the habs put him on waivers...i don't believe that myself
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Post by GoMtl on Dec 3, 2002 14:14:01 GMT -5
it hasn't been reported anywhere online. i'm gonna be choked if i come home from school to read it everywhere. i can't believe they would do it, so i won't.
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Post by montreal on Dec 3, 2002 15:31:41 GMT -5
Way to go Savard. Trade for him, don't play him and then place him on waivers. Buddy, you are getting worse in every deal. You finally earned your C grade with this brilliant bit of strategy. Please explain this to me, I'm having a hard time figuring out what's so bad? Is it the 5th rounder we lost, cause we had 2 of them, so losing one isn't so bad. Is it losing that blue chip prospect Arron Asham, cause I think Jason Ward can do a better job in the press box then Asham would have this year. Or is it losing the all star Czerk, who runs people over with blinding speed, energy, and thunderous hitting? The guy that everytime I see him play he gives ZERO effort, does create anything, hardly shoots (which is what he's paid to do, cause you can't score if you dont' shoot) and to me he just coasts out there, he should be ashamed of his efforts, and contributions, what a freakin joke. He's no hockey player, and should never play for us again. And he should take Donald Audette with him. I do think Savard should have gotten a pick in return, like a 5th or 6th, but if someone picks him up then we rid ourselfs of 2.6M and a pile of crap. Just a few more piles to go, and we will be crap free!
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 3, 2002 18:07:09 GMT -5
Montreal, it's the fact we could lose a guy who has the talent to score 25-30 for NOTHING.
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Post by montreal on Dec 3, 2002 18:18:15 GMT -5
Montreal, it's the fact we could lose a guy who has the talent to score 25-30 for NOTHING. Well we haven't lost him yet. Plus he sucks, so if we lose him we save 2.6M plus we don't have to pay him 2.9M next year. Also we got him for Asham who would not play this year, and might also be put on waivers. Oh yea we did lose a 5th and that does suck, but lucky us we had 2 of them, so its a little better. I hope he gets picked up, but I feel sorry for any team that does. Either way, its a minor move to me. We lost a 5th, boo hoo.
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Post by MPLABBE on Dec 3, 2002 18:45:29 GMT -5
I won't freak it like most will as well
But it shows to me that AS has once again made a mistake acquiring another one of his smurfs and that worries me. Who will he acquire next? Val Bure? sign Valeri Kamensky?
I thought he learned his lesson with Berezin but he didn't.
Enough with the smurfs, get some REAL players and call up the kids who are ready
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Dec 3, 2002 18:58:43 GMT -5
I don't know if Savard can be blamed for the present situation guys. Savard brought him into town, sure, but I mean it's Therrien who has chosen to not play him.
Cheers.
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Post by BadCompany on Dec 3, 2002 19:20:09 GMT -5
Well we haven't lost him yet. Plus he sucks, so if we lose him we save 2.6M plus we don't have to pay him 2.9M next year. Also we got him for Asham who would not play this year, and might also be put on waivers. Oh yea we did lose a 5th and that does suck, but lucky us we had 2 of them, so its a little better. I hope he gets picked up, but I feel sorry for any team that does. Either way, its a minor move to me. We lost a 5th, boo hoo. Well, like I said in the other thread, its a question of asset management. The object of the game, is to have the most, and best assets. Do that, and you win the Cup. You should make every effort upgrade your assets, in order to do that. Doesn't matter how insignificant you think the assets are, you give up too many of them, and pretty soon you run out of them. Savage Asham 3rd round pick 5th round pick -for- 4th round pick Thats not upgrading...
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Post by UberCranky on Dec 3, 2002 22:50:05 GMT -5
???Audette is not nearly half the player he was last year whih was already not the best guy we could have get but we have him so be it. Unfortunatly for us the only RW we have not had any problems with is Dackell. All others Petrov, Czerkawski, Audette, Mackay are underperforming IMO. In the mean time we have Ward who is tearing up the league in the AHL, Audette and Czerkawski who wants to be traded, Petrov not being half the player he was last year. They is not many ways to fix those problems AS needs to trade and quick cause it will be too late after this long road trip unless he wants to be in the race for Zherdev or Horton. Seems like everyone agrees that MT is a jackass and that he should be given is pink slip but I get the feeling that there are a lot more problems then that. We have the defense situation who is awfull and yet everyone is looking at making change with our forwards. I think that if AS could manage to swing one or two decent deals to change the face of this team we could be settled for a much better team next year while still hoping to make the playoff this year. Hoping for some of the following moves: 1. Wave Audette and pray that another team will pick him up. 2. Hope for a quick return of Souray 3. Kick MT out and get decent coaching staff 4. Bring Hainsey, Hossa and Ward from the farm team 5. Swing a deal for Czerkawski/Petrov, Hackett and another player for a decent 2way RW 6. Demote Dykhuis (I actually think he is even worst then Traverse this year) Possible trades: - Hackett, Czerkawski, Kilger to NYR for Radek Dvorak and 2nd - Dykhuis and Petrov to whom ever is willing to eat there salary in exchange of picks Create a linup with balance: 1. Zednik, Koivu, Ward Some of you say Ward does not have the speed top be in the top two lines but I do not think he is any slower then Audette and is grit would certainly make him more valuable on that line. 2. Bulis, Perreault, Dvorak Bulis and Dvorak are sound defensively and would certainly cover for Perreult. This could end up an effective line 3. Juneau, Hossa, Dackell Groom Hossa has a center (is natural position). He will do mistake but will be able to old his own defensively after speding 2/3rd of the season with Dacell and Juneau. Next year if all goes well he could be a cnadidate to replace Perreault as our no.2 center. 4. Blouin, Lindsay, McKay Crash and bang line to shake things up when necessary. Souray, Brisebois Souray's physical presence on the sides of Brisebois would greatly help him be even better. Markov, Quintal I think Quintal would be a better fit then Rivet has he tends to take less chances then Rivet and is IMO slithly better a clearing the front of the net (does not mean he is good). Hainsey, Rivet Rivet has done a good job on the side of Markov and I would use him to do the same thing with Hainsey. Hainsey, Rivet Garon and Theo in the net...A tandem for years to come. My personal preference for a new coaching staff: Head coach: Larry Robinson Assistants: Mike Bossy, Rod Langway, C.Jodouin, R.Melancon But since I am not the GM, AS is, Slather would never trade Dvorak for these three, we will end the year with Chow and Audette in the lineup, MT will complete the year has a head coach and will be fired for missing the playoff, Ward will loose faith and end the year ina slump and Hainsey and Hossa will have a good year in Hamilton but would have been better in the NHL..... Hey Habruti, welcome to HabsRus. I hope you don't have too many lumps on your head after the abduction. I (we) look forward to your insights and opinions so please make yourself comfortable and enjoy the circus. Again, welcome to HabsRus.
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Post by PTH on Dec 4, 2002 0:03:38 GMT -5
Please explain this to me, I'm having a hard time figuring out what's so bad? Is it the 5th rounder we lost, cause we had 2 of them, so losing one isn't so bad. Is it losing that blue chip prospect Arron Asham, cause I think Jason Ward can do a better job in the press box then Asham would have this year. Or is it losing the all star Czerk, who runs people over with blinding speed, energy, and thunderous hitting? The guy that everytime I see him play he gives ZERO effort, does create anything, hardly shoots (which is what he's paid to do, cause you can't score if you dont' shoot) and to me he just coasts out there, he should be ashamed of his efforts, and contributions, what a freakin joke. He's no hockey player, and should never play for us again. And he should take Donald Audette with him. I do think Savard should have gotten a pick in return, like a 5th or 6th, but if someone picks him up then we rid ourselfs of 2.6M and a pile of crap. Just a few more piles to go, and we will be crap free! If Chow was so bad, why did AS go and get him ? As to 5th rounders, as another poster once said, they might be pocket change, but would you just give all your pocket change away ?
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Post by PTH on Dec 4, 2002 0:07:13 GMT -5
Well, like I said in the other thread, its a question of asset management. The object of the game, is to have the most, and best assets. Do that, and you win the Cup. You should make every effort upgrade your assets, in order to do that. Doesn't matter how insignificant you think the assets are, you give up too many of them, and pretty soon you run out of them. Savage Asham 3rd round pick 5th round pick -for- 4th round pick Thats not upgrading... Typically in a draft you want one of the top 2 picks to make it, along with one other guy from later on - 2 real players per draft will keep a franchise going. Giving up every pick from the 3d to the 9th is like giving up a player. Put together a few AS deals, and he's given up 1/2 or 3/4's of a player - so we'll be missing out on a Tucker or a Markov... When it's for something useful enough, it's a worthy gamble (8th for Dackell), but over time it can really come back and haunt you.
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