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Post by Skilly on Mar 24, 2008 19:13:49 GMT -5
If you ever wondered why Americans (especially Republicans) want fences built across both their borders ....well here is one reason....
Stowaways get by Halifax guards prompting security queries By Michael Tutton, THE CANADIAN PRESS HALIFAX - Four stowaways on a cargo ship managed to slip by guards at a Halifax port gate on Sunday and take a cab to Truro, N.S., before being captured, prompting the chair of the Senate's defence committee to question security at the harbour.
Three of the men were being held Monday in a Halifax jail while the other was under guard in a Truro hospital recovering from a respiratory illness.
The four were arrested at the train station in Truro on Sunday afternoon.
Laurie Gillmore, spokeswoman for the Canada Border Services Agency, said Monday it was "a good possibility" the four men are Algerian, adding officers were still interviewing them to confirm their nationality.
She said the interviews and hearing would determine if the men pose a security risk or are a risk to flee.
Gillmore declined to provide details of how exactly the men got off the cargo vessel in Halifax and made it Truro, about an hour's drive away. The spokeswoman said the federal Privacy Act prevented her from revealing those details.
However, The Canadian Press has learned that the men were aboard an empty cargo bus that was transported aboard the Atlantic Container Lines vessel Atlantic Cartier from northern Europe to Halifax.
A source said the men managed to slip off the vessel, get to the security port's gate, then flee from guards after they were asked to produce identification.
Truro police spokesman Sgt. Randy MacKenzie said the men attempted to board a train at the Via Rail station in Halifax.
When they were refused a ticket, MacKenzie said they took a taxi to the Truro station.
Truro police arrested them at the station after Via officials noticed the men attempting to use foreign currency to buy tickets to Montreal.
"Three of them were attempting to buy tickets with French money and that told the story right there," said MacKenzie.
Colin Kenny, chair of the Senate committee on defence and national security, said the incident shows the need for improved scanning of all cargo coming off container ships.
"This should trouble us greatly," said Kenny.
He noted that ports in the Far East have gamma-ray scanning systems that take images of all cargo coming off the ships, aiding in the detection of stowaways.
"We think that ports in Canada, and particularly a port as important as Halifax, need to move in that direction," said Kenny.
Gillmore said her agency is looking into the incident to see if improvements are needed.
"We will look into the circumstances and see if there's something that could have been done differently," she said.
Asked if the incident prompts wider concerns about security, Gillmore responded: "No, not at all. I wouldn't say so because it was taken care of swiftly."
The four men are expected to be brought before officials with the Immigration and Refugee Board on Tuesday for a hearing into whether they will stay in detention.
Lee Cohen, a Halifax-area immigration lawyer, was concerned that the border security agency wasn't revealing more information on the case.
"It's mysterious," he said. "Usually the government will quickly confirm one way or another that someone is stowed away and come ashore in Halifax."
Television stations reported on the stowaways Sunday, but the agency declined to confirm how the four men entered Canada when it issued a news release Monday morning.
Last April, speculation that the Cypriot-registered Cala Puebla was carrying up to 200 stowaways to Halifax turned out to be false.
However, the arrival of stowaways in the port of Halifax has been a problem in the past, with Canadian immigration officials saying in 2001 that up to 30 a year were arriving in the city.
In December 2002, 12 stowaways from Romania arrived aboard a container ship from Spain.
Companies face fines of up to $15,000 per stowaway if it's determined that sufficient security measures weren't taken to prevent them getting on a ship.
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Post by Skilly on Mar 24, 2008 19:16:38 GMT -5
There was an editorial in the local newspaper about this last weekend. Apparently, the Via ticket agent refused to let them buy tickets and was suspicious of the European money, so he called Border Services.... they told him it wasn't their jurisdiction. The ticket agent kept calling around (RCMP, local police) until someone agreed to pick these guys up. So they weren't caught due to any security measures ... they were caught because of the persistence of a civilian...
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Post by MC Habber on Mar 24, 2008 22:51:29 GMT -5
Fences won't help. I don't think port security is the US is any better.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Mar 25, 2008 6:54:19 GMT -5
Fences won't help. I don't think port security is the US is any better. I found the best security, and the most frustrating to get through, to be in Israel. I was coming home for a few weeks midway through my UN tour in the Golan Heights and had to go through what I thought would be a routine luggage check. It started out with: "... good evening ... how long have you been in Israel?" Then they found out I was a UN soldier stationed between the Syrians and Israelis, and I got on the plane after answering 90 minutes worth of questions. Our luggage (me and the guys I was with) was run through their x-ray device several times and we were the last to be allowed to board. Our interrogation ended with the supervisor saying, "... you may not think this is necessary, but there are a lot of countries who don't want to see Israel exist." I don't think it's as extreme in the USA but after 9/11 the Americans took on a similar mindset. However, I think it's virtually impossible for us and the Americans to properly cover our borders. It's just too long. Cheers.
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Post by jkr on Mar 25, 2008 7:39:10 GMT -5
There was an editorial in the local newspaper about this last weekend. Apparently, the Via ticket agent refused to let them buy tickets and was suspicious of the European money, so he called Border Services.... they told him it wasn't their jurisdiction. The ticket agent kept calling around (RCMP, local police) until someone agreed to pick these guys up. So they weren't caught due to any security measures ... they were caught because of the persistence of a civilian... That ticket agent should be commended. Most people would have moved on after the snub by Border Services. OTOH, someone at Border Services should have be hauled up to explain.
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Post by Skilly on Mar 25, 2008 9:48:15 GMT -5
Via agent called border services about stowaways from Algeria
From the London Free Press
HALIFAX -- A Via ticket agent suspicious of the behaviour of four men who turned out to be stowaways called a Canada Border Services Agency tipline on Sunday, but was told the agency couldn't act without more information.
Colin Kenny, chair of the Senate national security committee, received an e-mail from Jeff Cox yesterday, the day after the senator criticized the federal government for not doing more to tighten port security in Halifax.
The agent's e-mail paints an unflattering portrait of the system set up to respond to the possible illegal entry of people into Canada.
In Sunday's case, the four stowaways travelled across the Atlantic Ocean hidden in a bus and then sprinted away from a single commissionaire staffing the entrance of the Cerescorp container terminal.
The four Algerian men then made their way to the Via Rail station in Halifax, where they offered to pay more than the listed price for tickets. They also wanted to buy the tickets using European currency.
"Their insistence on using either Euros or French currency . . . and their willingness to pay in excess of the actual fare was certainly a red flag," Cox wrote to Kenny.
"I tried to contact the special unit of the RCMP, but there was no answer. I then called the 800 number for border services and in turn, the suspicious activity hotline.
"I spoke to a woman there and incredibly, she told me that it was not within their jurisdiction to act without names, or more information."
Cox's e-mail says he contacted the RCMP's detachment in nearby Tantallon and informed them the men were on their way to the airport to convert currency, and that they intended to continue on to Truro -- about an hour from Halifax by car -- to catch a train.
The men got to Truro in a taxi and were captured by town police before boarding a train.
In his e-mail, Cox told Kenny the case raises serious questions.
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Post by Skilly on Mar 25, 2008 9:50:22 GMT -5
Via agent called border services about stowaways from Algeria
From the London Free Press
HALIFAX -- A Via ticket agent suspicious of the behaviour of four men who turned out to be stowaways called a Canada Border Services Agency tipline on Sunday, but was told the agency couldn't act without more information.
Colin Kenny, chair of the Senate national security committee, received an e-mail from Jeff Cox yesterday, the day after the senator criticized the federal government for not doing more to tighten port security in Halifax.
The agent's e-mail paints an unflattering portrait of the system set up to respond to the possible illegal entry of people into Canada.
In Sunday's case, the four stowaways travelled across the Atlantic Ocean hidden in a bus and then sprinted away from a single commissionaire staffing the entrance of the Cerescorp container terminal.
The four Algerian men then made their way to the Via Rail station in Halifax, where they offered to pay more than the listed price for tickets. They also wanted to buy the tickets using European currency.
"Their insistence on using either Euros or French currency . . . and their willingness to pay in excess of the actual fare was certainly a red flag," Cox wrote to Kenny.
"I tried to contact the special unit of the RCMP, but there was no answer. I then called the 800 number for border services and in turn, the suspicious activity hotline.
"I spoke to a woman there and incredibly, she told me that it was not within their jurisdiction to act without names, or more information."
Cox's e-mail says he contacted the RCMP's detachment in nearby Tantallon and informed them the men were on their way to the airport to convert currency, and that they intended to continue on to Truro -- about an hour from Halifax by car -- to catch a train.
The men got to Truro in a taxi and were captured by town police before boarding a train.
In his e-mail, Cox told Kenny the case raises serious questions.
"They could have foregone the train and gone in any direction," he wrote. "This, as it turns out, was a lucky catch, and was made in spite of border services."
Cox, reached at this booth in Halifax, said he couldn't comment, adding that he didn't expect his e-mail to become public.
At a news conference earlier Tuesday, Public Security Minister Stockwell Day said there will be a review of how Canada Border Services and other agencies handled the case.
He said port security is improving.
"We are right up there as one of the countries where safety and security is the prime focus of the government," he said when asked about the stowaway incident.
Day said hundreds of thousands of containers come into Canadian ports, creating a huge task for border services.
"The fact is these four people have been apprehended. They were spotted as they left this particular port area. ... That's the basic fact of the matter," he said.
Kenny said the incident was an alarming signal of weak security systems, because the stowaways sneaked into a secure facility in Liverpool, England, before boarding the GO transit buses and then eluding on unarmed commissionaire at the gate in Halifax.
"It's such a long list of failures and when you add on top of it the efforts that Mr. Cox made to report it to people, that's enough to discourage any honest citizen," he said. "Most people wouldn't have gone to that effort after being brushed off the first time."
Day said the Conservative government has improved security since taking power.
"The fact is we are doing better than two years ago," he said. "There are more resources. There are more people."
Chris Williams, a spokesman for the Canada Border Services Agency in Ottawa, said the department will look into how the Border Watch 1-800 call was handled.
"I'm not aware of that (call). But generally we work in close collaboration with law enforcement authorities," he said. "If we receive any information that we believe relevant to our partners, we may in fact share it."
Calvin Whidden, a spokesman for Cerescorp container terminals, confirmed that the guard house was staffed by a single commissionaire at the time.
The security arrangement is part of a plan approved by Transport Canada.
However, he argued that more attention should be paid to how the stowaways managed to board empty transit buses that were loaded on the container ship in Liverpool, England.
"The point of entry is really the concern, I think. They shouldn't be able to get on a vessel and travel," he said.
Tony Burbridge, the Halifax deputy chief of police, said he doesn't blame the commissionaire at the gate because he quickly alerted regional police, who are responsible for the port.
He said police had a response time of under five minutes, but the men had fled.
"I'm actually quite positive about this, considering the number of jurisdictions involved," said Burbridge, who noted the four were arrested within a few hours of their escape.
Stephane Malepart, a spokesman with the Immigration and Refugee Board in Montreal, said the men were scheduled to be interviewed Tuesday to determine if they should remain in detention.
The hearing was to be held via teleconference from the correctional facility where the men are being held in Nova Scotia and was closed to the public.
Malepart wouldn't reveal why the hearing was closed, but said it's likely they had claimed refugee status, which would automatically make the hearing private.
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Post by Habs_fan_in_LA on Mar 25, 2008 11:34:23 GMT -5
Fences won't help. I don't think port security is the US is any better. The US has beefed up security on the Port of LA and the Port of Long Beach. Out of the 1.4 million containers in the ports, approximately 30,000 are abandoned and unused. Every night hundreds of LA's homeless manage to evade Port Security and sleep in the empty containers. If disfunctional mildly retarded homeless can get into the containers, I doubt that Al Kaida would have too much difficulty getting in and out. They are very effective in catching grandmothers with toothpaste tubes, nail clippers and delaying passengers for two hours at LAX.
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Post by cigarviper on Mar 25, 2008 13:50:35 GMT -5
I'm sure this happens more often than we might think. There is no way to make our borders impenetratable.
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Post by CrocRob on Mar 25, 2008 14:26:57 GMT -5
I'm sure this happens more often than we might think. There is no way to make our borders impenetratable. There aren't. I think it's laughable that increased security at ports will actually deter people who want to get in. Canada has the longest unprotected inland border in the world, and one of the longest (pretty much) unprotected coastal borders. Throwing money to feign security isn't a solution to anything except "Ways to spend money with little-to-no return on investment" I drove through customs last night without showing any identification. The border agent's only comment was "sucks that Duty Free is closed, eh?" Perhaps if I'd replied in Arabic he might have piqued interest, but instead he waved me through.
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Post by jkr on Mar 25, 2008 17:29:05 GMT -5
I'm sure this happens more often than we might think. There is no way to make our borders impenetratable. There aren't. I think it's laughable that increased security at ports will actually deter people who want to get in. Canada has the longest unprotected inland border in the world, and one of the longest (pretty much) unprotected coastal borders. Throwing money to feign security isn't a solution to anything except "Ways to spend money with little-to-no return on investment" I drove through customs last night without showing any identification. The border agent's only comment was "sucks that Duty Free is closed, eh?" Perhaps if I'd replied in Arabic he might have piqued interest, but instead he waved me through. Red, was that the Canadian border guard?
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Post by franko on Mar 25, 2008 18:05:21 GMT -5
Hey, the US has been able to keep all illegal drugs out of the country from Columbia, and illegal immigrants from Mexico, so of course they'll be able to guard their borders from "bad guys coming from the north".
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Post by CrocRob on Mar 25, 2008 18:08:56 GMT -5
There aren't. I think it's laughable that increased security at ports will actually deter people who want to get in. Canada has the longest unprotected inland border in the world, and one of the longest (pretty much) unprotected coastal borders. Throwing money to feign security isn't a solution to anything except "Ways to spend money with little-to-no return on investment" I drove through customs last night without showing any identification. The border agent's only comment was "sucks that Duty Free is closed, eh?" Perhaps if I'd replied in Arabic he might have piqued interest, but instead he waved me through. Red, was that the Canadian border guard? lol Of course, though I don't seem to have much difficulty with American border security, either.
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Post by Skilly on Mar 26, 2008 6:31:37 GMT -5
Canada has the longest unprotected inland border in the world, Also the longest unprotected border where the other nation wants it protected. There is strong sentiment in the USA to build a fence across the 49th parallel. The Great Wall of China America. You mean the coastal border that the Americans, Russians, AND Danish all claim we don't own? Our sovereign claim on the northern coastal border will be challenged due to our lack of security measures. The Americans have been claiming the Northwest Passage is international waters for decades. Saw a program on TV not long ago where the Russians (or was it Danes) are claiming an island in the north and questioning Canada northern borders. Isn't our money ... and hey, if they want to protect their border, and by doing so protecting ours ... let them. Just goes to show how lax our security measures are ... I'd rather tightened them up and suffer the delays then have some "Canadian sympathizer" knocking down the CN Tower - when and if that happens, well it's too late for action. Why not be proactive, instead of reactive. And when we go crying to Brother America about an attack on our soil you know what response we will get? "Told you so!" Perhaps. But his refusal to do his job correctly isn't sitting well with me. Perhaps he needs a reminder.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Mar 26, 2008 7:06:52 GMT -5
Canada has the longest unprotected inland border in the world, Also the longest unprotected border where the other nation wants it protected. There is strong sentiment in the USA to build a fence across the 49th parallel. The Great Wall of China America. If people want to get through, they'll get through. Isn't in an international court now? Not sure though. It's called Hans Island. The Danes apparently dispatched a warship so as to plant a flag on the tiny piece of earth that disappears when the winter sets in. The question is, what is underneath it? Oil? This is a point I tried to make in another thread. We can't take the fight on a global scale, granted, I mean what country can? But, if a lot of countries contribute just a little it would make such a huge difference. Unfortunately, a lot of countries will do exactly what you've cited; sit back and let it happen rather than being proactive. Granted, secret services are doing a great job. I'm glad there are agencies out there that are paid to be paranoid when I'm not. But, the can't do it alone. Cheers. Perhaps. But his refusal to do his job correctly isn't sitting well with me. Perhaps he needs a reminder.[/quote] Mrs Dis went down to the States last month. She and her friends were waived through.
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