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Post by M. Beaux-Eaux on Jun 9, 2004 18:19:13 GMT -5
Wed, June 9, 2004 HAMILTON, ON - The Hamilton Bulldogs announced today their parent club, the Montreal Canadiens, have signed a one-year player loan agreement with the Dallas Stars. As part of the agreement, the Stars will provide players to the AHL’s Hamilton Bulldogs. The Stars are expected to place up to six players, including one goaltender, with Hamilton in 2004-05.The Bulldogs are entering their third season as the primary developmental affiliate of the Montreal Canadiens. Hamilton led the AHL’s North Division during the 2003-04 regular season with 96 points on a record 41 wins, 25 losses, 10 ties and 4 overtime losses. - www.canoe.ca/Bulldogs/News/2004/06/09/492320.html |
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Post by Skilly on Jun 9, 2004 18:24:53 GMT -5
I read somewhere they were in pretty good talks with Chicago. I wonder why that went south? But the thing that stands out now is the one goaltender that Dallas will provide (Maybe Chicago wanted a goalie included as well and that is the reason it went sour). So now Gainey will have to make a goalie decision or two or three regarding Danis/Fichaud/Michaud/Damphousse. The consensus was Hamilton did not want to have 3 goalies on the roster, so now only 1 of the four will be with Hamilton.
Who's it gonna be?
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Post by blaise on Jun 9, 2004 19:09:20 GMT -5
I regard this sharing as a financial move that will squeeze out a number of Habs prospects. It almost obliges Gainey to promote several prospects immediately. It will also dictate keeping some 2003 drafts in the CHL, college, or Europe so long as they are still eligible (and assuming there is an NHL season). There will also be a game of musical chairs as Gainey tries to lend excess players to other teams. As for the single Montréal goaltender on the Hamilton roster, I suspect it'll be Danis, with Damphousse, Fichaud, and Michaud left dangling or loaned to another AHL club. Why Danis? Because I think he has the most promise even though he's not as experienced as Damphousse or Fichaud.
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Post by M. Beaux-Eaux on Jun 9, 2004 22:31:29 GMT -5
Fichaud
Damphousse
Dallas goalie - Hamilton
Danis or Michaud - Hamilton, the other one to the ECHL
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Post by Bob on Jun 9, 2004 22:49:39 GMT -5
Fichaud
DamphousseDallas goalie - Hamilton Danis or Michaud - Hamilton, the other one to the ECHL I doubt very much that it will be Michaud in Hamilton. Gainey didn't pursue a free-agent like Danis for two years just to play him in the ECHL |
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Post by Bob on Jun 9, 2004 22:53:36 GMT -5
Wed, June 9, 2004 HAMILTON, ON - The Hamilton Bulldogs announced today their parent club, the Montreal Canadiens, have signed a one-year player loan agreement with the Dallas Stars. As part of the agreement, the Stars will provide players to the AHL’s Hamilton Bulldogs. The Stars are expected to place up to six players, including one goaltender, with Hamilton in 2004-05.I guess Montreal has to something to make ends meet in Hamilton. Attendance has been pathetic for the past two years despite having great teams and exciting young players. Hamilton doesn't deserve to have the team... which is unfortunate for the few die hard fans who support the team. |
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Post by M. Beaux-Eaux on Jun 10, 2004 5:18:09 GMT -5
I doubt very much that it will be Michaud in Hamilton. Gainey didn't pursue a free-agent like Danis for two years just to play him in the ECHL A little research shows that Michaud signed for 3 years on September 18, 2001. Perhaps he won't be offered a new contract. That would assure Danis of a spot in Hamilton. |
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Post by M. Beaux-Eaux on Jun 10, 2004 5:20:16 GMT -5
I guess Montreal has to something to make ends meet in Hamilton. Attendance has been pathetic for the past two years despite having great teams and exciting young players. Hamilton doesn't deserve to have the team... which is unfortunate for the few die hard fans who support the team. I wonder how a Toronto Maple Leafs farm club would do in Laval? |
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Post by PTH on Jun 10, 2004 6:44:47 GMT -5
Gainey didn't pursue a free-agent like Danis for two years just to play him in the ECHL Hard to imagine BG pursuing anyone for 2 years since he's hasn't been our GM for one year yet... |
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Post by Bob on Jun 10, 2004 8:39:44 GMT -5
Hard to imagine BG pursuing anyone for 2 years since he's hasn't been our GM for one year yet... Ouch... Well, I guess I should have said they tried to sign him after last season and again after this season. |
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Post by Bob on Jun 10, 2004 8:40:19 GMT -5
I wonder how a Toronto Maple Leafs farm club would do in Laval? My guess is a failure both on and off the ice ;D |
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Post by Habs_fan_in_LA on Jun 10, 2004 11:19:34 GMT -5
I guess Montreal has to something to make ends meet in Hamilton. Attendance has been pathetic for the past two years despite having great teams and exciting young players. Hamilton doesn't deserve to have the team... which is unfortunate for the few die hard fans who support the team. Move the team (again?) to either Los Angeles or Montreal. With proper marketing, Montreal fans would love to see Kastitsyn, Hainsey, Urquhart, Milroy, Higgins, and the other Habs of the future. Sitting three rows behind the glass beats paying twice as much to watch the Sr. Hab's with a bloody nose. As a bonus you get to boooo........... Traverse again. Get the beer down to blue collar prices and fill the seats with fans who will one day buy Hab's seasons tickets or at least get to a couple of games a year. That's how it used to work. If they come to LA I know three seasons tickets are automatically sold! Hamilton is nice enough as long as the wind isn't blowing the stench odor of Leafs from the East. |
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Post by M. Beaux-Eaux on Jun 11, 2004 12:05:20 GMT -5
? = no contract, or status otherwise uncertain or unknown.
GOALTENDERS (Certain = 1)
? Damphousse, Jean-Francois G 6'00" 180 07/21/79 S. Alex-Mts, QUE
Danis, Yann G 6'00" 190 06/21/81 Saint Jerome, QUE
? Fichaud, Eric G 5'11" 179 11/04/75 Anjou, QUE
? Michaud, Olivier G 5'11" 172 09/14/83 Beloeil, QUE
DEFENCE (Certain = 3)
Archer, Andrew D 6'04" 217 05/15/83 Calgary, ALB
Beauchemin, Francois D 6'00" 206 06/04/80 Sorel, QUE
? Cote, Jean-Philippe D 6'03" 207 04/22/82 Quebec, QUE
? Flood, Mark D 6'01" 180 09/29/84 Charlottetown, PEI
? Hainsey, Ron D 6'03" 200 03/21/81 Bolton, Connecticut
? Plante, Philippe D 6'00" 188 08/10/78 Green. Park, QUE
Shasby, Matt D 6'02" 200 07/02/80 Sioux Falls, South Dakota
? Traverse, Patrick D 6'04" 207 03/14/74 Montreal, QUE
? Vydareny, Rene D 6'01" 200 05/06/81 Bratislava, QUE
FORWARDS (Certain = 6)
? Carpentier, Benjamin LW 6'02" 205 06/13/78 Grand-mere, QUE
? Dwyer, Gordie LW 6'03" 215 03/03/78 Dalhousie, NB
Ferland, Jonathon RW 6'02" 209 02/09/83 Quebec, QUE
Gratton, Benoit C 5'11" 194 12/28/76 Montreal, QUE
Higgins, Chris C 5'11" 188 06/02/83 Smithtown, NY
? Hossa, Marcel LW 6'02" 212 10/12/81 Ilava, Slovakia
Larrivee, Christian LW 6'03" 200 07/25/82 Gaspe, Quebec
Milroy, Duncan RW 6'01" 198 02/08/83 Edmonton, ALB
Olvestad, Jimmie LW 6'01" 199 02/16/80 Stockholm, SWE
Perezhogin, Alexander RW 6'00" 185 08/10/83 U. Kamenog, USSR
Plekanec, Tomas C 5'10" 189 10/31/82 Kladno, CZECH
? Robinson, Brent F 6'01" 195 03/10/81 Pointe Claire, QUE
Somervuori, Eero RW 5'10" 167 02/07/79 Jarvenpaa, FIN
Thinel, Marc-Andre RW 6'00" 182 03/24/81 St. Jerome, QUE
Lambert, Michaël<br>
*
We be thin Jim.
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Post by montreal on Jun 11, 2004 13:42:44 GMT -5
There's also Locke and Urquhart, who could be signed this summer, as I can't see Locke going back as an overager, and Urquhart would be an overager as well. I would guess that Locke is a lock to be signed (bad pun, I know). Urquhart I would think he's signed, guess we'll see. There's also Ryan Glenn, who's has no team to play for, although I would expect if signed, he'd take the Matt Shasby route and play in the ECHL. There there's a long list of FA CHLers/NCAAers. (this is why I hate the Dallas deal, as I was hoping we'd sign a guy like Rene Bourque or Karl Gagne or Daoust or Hornby or Hennigar or Benoit etc..)
As for next years lineup. We could be looking at Lambert, Locke, Urquhart as rookies, Shasby hopefully makes the team, and Flood I would be surprised if he was sent back as an overager as well, although not playing in any games during his ATO contract makes me wonder what they will do.
Plante has a team option, I hope they sign Cote, Carpentier should be back as he doesn't play much, but is a decent enforcer. Robinson I'd like to see back, but we'll have to see what they do. Dwyer I think will be resigned to a two way, as Jarvis seems to like him a lot.
With Higgins, Hossa, Plekanec, Hainsey, Beauchemin, I'd say all of them will get time with the Habs, but I can't see all of them starting the season with the big boys. Hainsey, Beauchemin and Hossa all need to clear waivers, it will be interesting what they do with them.
Thinel and Marois are RFA's this summer as well. I'd resign both, but we'll see what Gainey does.
The depth could look like before any stars players,
LW- Higgins, Lambert, Larrivee, Marois, Carpentier
RW- Milroy, Ferland, Thinel, Robinson
C- Plekanec, Locke, Urquhart, Dwyer
D- Beauchemin, Archer, Plante, Shasby, Flood, Cote?
G- Danis, ?? Fichaud/Damphousse
With Michaud if the ECHL, Glenn as well. Plus any FA's. Higgins and Plekanec should see time with the Habs if there's a season, which would hurt the team big time.
Then add whatever Dallas sends, seems like a goalie, one or two depth defensemen, and a few forwards. Hopefully Lessard is one of them if he isnt on the stars.
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Post by HabbaDasher on Jun 11, 2004 16:00:06 GMT -5
Thinel and Marois are RFA's this summer as well. I'd resign both, but we'll see what Gainey does. The depth could look like before any stars players, LW- Higgins, Lambert, Larrivee, Marois, Carpentier RW- Milroy, Ferland, Thinel, Robinson C- Plekanec, Locke, Urquhart, Dwyer D- Beauchemin, Archer, Plante, Shasby, Flood, Cote? G- Danis, ?? Fichaud/Damphousse With Michaud if the ECHL, Glenn as well. Plus any FA's. Higgins and Plekanec should see time with the Habs if there's a season, which would hurt the team big time. Then add whatever Dallas sends, seems like a goalie, one or two depth defensemen, and a few forwards. Hopefully Lessard is one of them if he isnt on the stars. What about Lapierre? Is Thinel really any good? Why do you have Dwyer at center? |
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Post by montreal on Jun 11, 2004 23:29:54 GMT -5
What about Lapierre? Is Thinel really any good? Why do you have Dwyer at center? Laierre can not play in Hamilton next year, he's only 19, won't be 20 in time. Urquhart will. Thinel was very good in Victorville with Vermette, but had a tough time in the AHL as a rookie, and it didn't get much better in Utah, although he was ok at times (saw him once at Utah) and he did well in Lexington (ECHL for Utah). This year he didn't do much in Hamilton early was sent to Columbus, was one of their top players all season (listened to a few games) and got recalled to Hamilton played well enough to make the playoff roster, seems to have played well in the playoffs. Might be resigned for good AHL depth, as he does have decent hands and works hard. Dwyer played center this year in Hamilton, and Jarvis used him a good bit in the games I was at and saw on tv. |
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Post by M. Beaux-Eaux on Jun 11, 2004 23:43:35 GMT -5
Thinel was very good in Victorville with Vermette, but had a tough time in the AHL as a rookie, and it didn't get much better in Utah, although he was ok at times (saw him once at Utah) and he did well in Lexington (ECHL for Utah). This year he didn't do much in Hamilton early was sent to Columbus, was one of their top players all season (listened to a few games) and got recalled to Hamilton played well enough to make the playoff roster, seems to have played well in the playoffs. Might be resigned for good AHL depth, as he does have decent hands and works hard. The keyword for Thinel is thin. He makes Ribeiro look like Schwarznegger. He will be erased for either a Dallas or a better Habs prospect, IMO; same for Marois. So Jarvis thinks Dwyer is a better choice at center than either Higgins and Hossa, both of whom have center as their natural position? Interesting. Well, Dougie was a center himself so he should know, though I find that scenario cockamamie. |
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Post by montreal on Jun 12, 2004 17:47:09 GMT -5
The keyword for Thinel is thin. He makes Ribeiro look like Schwarznegger. He will be erased for either a Dallas or a better Habs prospect, IMO; same for Marois. So Jarvis thinks Dwyer is a better choice at center than either Higgins and Hossa, both of whom have center as their natural position? Interesting. Well, Dougie was a center himself so he should know, though I find that scenario cockamamie. Well Thinel is actually around Ribeiro's size. He's around 176-178, Ribs I don't think is over 180, just that he's taller then Marc-Andre by 2-3 inches. I think he has a better shot of being resigned then Marois, but I have completely given up on Marios after last year, when he was sent down from the ECHL to the CHL (a step below the ECHL, New Mexico it might have been I forget) but he seems to have had a good year out west with the Ice Dogs. Don't know what Gainey plans on doing with either of them. Thinel is small with good hands, Marois is big without good hands. Savard is the GM of the Dogs, so I'd guess he has a say in keeping Hossa on the wing. Higgins did play center at times, but he was always on the top 2 lines, so Gratton and Plekanec when both in the lineup makes no reason for Higgins to play center. Dwyer played center on the 3rd line, a bit with Olavstad/Sumo, or Ferland. One think I noticed in the 10 or games I've seen this year, Jarvis mixes up the lines often. |
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Post by Skilly on Jun 22, 2004 20:03:13 GMT -5
I guess Montreal has to something to make ends meet in Hamilton. Attendance has been pathetic for the past two years despite having great teams and exciting young players. Hamilton doesn't deserve to have the team... which is unfortunate for the few die hard fans who support the team. The latest scuttlebutt from here, is that the city of St. John's is actively pursuing the possibility of getting the Bulldogs to move here. When they come to town the stadium is packed, and they would draw as many or more than in Hamilton. We approached Toronto about the possibility of swapping franchises for the 2005-06 season, but that however looks like it is going to be nixed. The Roadrunners can not make their lease payment and that nullifies the 49 yr lease. Rumour from here is thatthe Baby Leafs are going to look into buying that lease out, releasing Edmonton/Roadrunner's from any debt and use Ricco Stadium as the home for their farm team. Edmonton will never come East again, and I don't think Montreal will be too happy about being so close to the Leafs. God I hope we can convince then to move here. Here is an article in the paper a couple of days ago written by the sport's editor. Saturday, June 19, 2004
The writing was on the wall for Leafs
ROBIN SHORT
Funny how these things shake down, but the only hope St. John’s had at keeping the American Hockey League at Mile One Stadium beyond next season when the Maple Leafs leave town rested with the Canadiens.
Because be assured, the Leafs are history.
And the actuality of Montreal’s farm club becoming the latest tenant on New Gower Street — a scenario that might have been gaining momentum of late — hit the skids this week when the company that ran the Toronto Roadrunners’ AHL team saw its arena lease terminated after failing to meet payments.
A glimpse into the Leafs’ future came about back in October when, following the NBA debacle between the Toronto Raptors and Cleveland Cavaliers, Maple Leafs Sports and Entertainment president and CEO Richard Peddie immediately fingered the St. John’s people for screwing up Mile One’s thermostat leading to condensation on the basketball floor and eventual postponement of the preseason friendly (later recanted by Maple Leafs Sports and Entertainment).
Months later, Peddie announced in the Toronto media his concern that St. John’s was too far away from Toronto for his liking and as for the ongoing negotiations to keep the AHL Leafs in St. John’s beyond ’05, “they (city officials) came back to us with the worst deal in history.”<br>
So much for any cozy relationship St. John’s once enjoyed with Toronto.
Toronto general manager John Ferguson Jr., like Peddie, wants the farm team closer to home, a fact unique in itself given that Ferguson once ran St. Louis’ farm team as the Blues’ vice-president and director of hockey operations. The last time I checked, the Centrum Centre in Worcester, Mass., isn’t exactly down the road from the Savvis Centre in St. Louis, Mo.
Anyway, Ferguson appears to be on the way to getting his wish as the Roadrunners are close to being AHL road kill.
Most AHL insiders believe the Edmonton Oilers’ farm club, which plays out of Ricoh Coliseum handy to the Air Canada Centre, will likely be done next season, just in time for the Leafs who have one more year to honour on their contract with St. John’s.
For the record, Toronto maintains it’s exploring other possibilities. In reality, it’s one possibility — the refurbished Ricoh, which seats 9,500.
Coliseum Renovation Corp. sub-leases Ricoh from Borealis, a municipal employees pension fund which provides investment on infrastructure on anything from hockey rinks to skyscrapers.
Anything it believes in which it can make money.
Borealis and the City of Toronto invested $9 million each into renovation of the city-owned Ricoh arena. The city then guaranteed a $20 million loan to Coliseum Renovation Corp.
Because CRC has its lease terminated, it’s believed Borealis is now on the hook for the $20 million and has a hockey team on its hands it doesn’t want.
Enter the Toronto Maple Leafs.
Like a shrewd commodities broker, it’s not inconceivable to think the Leafs will wait for the right moment — i.e. the end of the 2005 season — to swoop in and scoop up whatever is left of the $38 million owed in return for Borealis’s 49-year lease on Ricoh.
The Leafs could then swing a deal with the Oilers to get rid of the Roadrunners opening up a spot for the freshly-departed St. John’s Maple Leafs.
Any howls of protest from the Hamilton Bulldogs for the Leafs infringing on their territorial rights would be met with a shrug of the shoulders — those rights were waived when the Roadrunners set up shop.
So what, you may be asking, do the Canadiens have to do with all this?
Until the Ricoh scenario developed, Toronto felt its best bet was Hamilton’s Copps Coliseum, where the St. John’s Maple Leafs consistently draw well. Up until Tuesday, it’s believed the Leafs were willing to facilitate talks with the blessing of the American Hockey League whereby Toronto would move into Hamilton and the Canadiens, whose farm team calls Copps home, would come to St. John’s.
Now that’s all out the window.
And don’t expect the Oilers to look at St. John’s if they take Toronto’s bucks and leave Ricoh. I’m told the Oilers have no interest in coming this far east again.
So this leaves us with Plan B, although many members of the St. John’s Sports and Entertainment board prefer it as the first option.
But there’s no guarantee the Quebec Major Junior Hockey League would come to Newfoundland. Other than securing rights to Newfoundlanders — 15 played in the league last season — there’s no other real benefit to coming this far east.
Certainly, it would add to a regional rivalry, but so what?
Of the 16 QMJHL teams, six are located outside the province of Quebec. And the league, more than ever before, is cognizant of maintaining its Quebec roots which might explain why Saint John, N.B., was turned down for an expansion franchise.
Keith Coombs’ comments in Friday’s Toronto Star didn’t help St. John’s bargaining position when he told the paper, “I think Toronto would agree with me, that the past three or four years have been painful to watch. And after talking to them recently, I don’t know if it’s going to get much better any time soon. I’m not saying that what Toronto is doing is wrong, but it seems other teams can develop young players and still have three or four veterans who provide entertaining hockey and still help the team get into the playoffs.”<br>
Coombs may be right in what he’s saying, but he’s the chairman of St. John’s Sports and Entertainment and his comments will almost assuredly raise the collective blood pressure in the Leafs’ head office.
Any renewed deal between St. John’s and Toronto — remote as it is — might now be off the table and the QMJHL, if its watching, has gained a negotiating trump card.
If not the Quebec junior league, where does St. John’s turn? The city’s hand has been shown.
While the QMJHL would obviously fill a hockey void, it should not be considered a saving grace. This is a league that’s seen failed franchises in Laval, Verdun, Longueuil, St. Jean, Granby, Sherbrooke, St-Hyacinthe, Sorel, Beauport and Trois-Rivieres of late.
Drummondville and Victoriaville, long-time QMJHL entries, were at the bottom of the league’s average attendance. And the owner of the Rouyn-Noranda franchise is apparently eager to sell, possibly to Saint John.
Twists and turns, fact and speculation.
Nothing is as clear as it seems — other than the fact St. John’s Maple Leafs hockey is drawing to a close after its 14th season. |
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Post by Skilly on Jun 22, 2004 20:09:50 GMT -5
Another local article regarding the city's wish to find another hockey team.
Leafs may fall after 2005
By ROBIN SHORT, Telegram Sports Editor
In what could be interpreted as the first tangible sign a divorce between St. John’s and the Toronto Maple Leafs is imminent, the chairman of St. John’s Sports and Entertainment Ltd. confirmed Wednesday night the city is looking into pursuing another American Hockey League franchise or a Quebec Major Junior Hockey League team.
While Keith Coombs stopped short of saying a deal is no longer possible between the city and Toronto, keeping the St. John’s Maple Leafs in Newfoundland beyond 2005 when the current five-year lease expires, he admitted the NHL Leafs are also investigating other options for their top minor league farm team.
Coombs and a delegation from the city twice travelled to Toronto for face-to-face talks with Toronto management — the last trip coming in March — and still no deal is near.
“We have made it clear where we want to be and they have come back to where they want to be,” said Coombs, a St. John’s city councillor. “The gap is significant. We have to have the franchise fee at about $1 million (per year). We’re off by $300,000 or $400,000.
“We have come to the conclusion it’s probably too expensive an option.”<br>
St. John’s pays about $1.7 million a year in total to lease the team. That includes a franchise fee, management fee to run Mile One Stadium and the AHL Leafs and an attendance incentive program which puts more money in Toronto’s coffers with increased attendance at St. John’s home games.
Coombs admits he has heard rumours of the Montreal Canadiens farm team relocating to St. John’s if a deal can be worked out getting the Leafs into the Canadiens’ current AHL home in Hamilton, Ont. He also said the board which oversees Mile One Stadium and the Leafs would entertain the possibility of a flip-flop of franchises with the Bulldogs coming to St. John’s and the Leafs heading to Hamilton — a prospect first reported by The Telegram March 6 — only if the price was right.
“Through the league (AHL), we’ll be checking out Montreal,” Coombs said. “But given the average cost (of an AHL franchise), it’s going to be tough getting under $1.3 million-$1.4 million.
“The likelihood of AHL teams coming in lower (in terms of price) than where we’re at is pretty small.”<br>
Which leads us to major junior hockey, the preferred favourite of many members of St. John’s Sports and Entertainment and certainly the least expensive option.
Quebec would like to move into St. John’s for a couple of reasons, not the least of which it would have territorial rights over young Newfoundland hockey players who now have the choice of playing in either Ontario or Quebec.
Bonavista’s Daniel Ryder, a certain NHL draft pick next year, toils for the Peterborough Petes for example. And five Newfoundlanders were selected in the Ontario Hockey League draft in May, compared to the three who went in the QMJHL draft earlier this month.
St. John’s would add to a natural regional rivalry with Halifax, Cape Breton, P.E.I., Moncton and Acadie-Bathurst, not seen in the AHL since 1995-96 when St. John’s, Saint John, P.E.I., Fredericton and Cape Breton comprised the Atlantic Division.
But Quebec’s move to Newfoundland is no sure thing. The league turned down Saint John for an expansion franchise, although there is word a QMJHL franchise owner is interested in moving in Harbour Station.
“We won’t know until August what the (QMJHL) owners are intended to do,” Coombs said. “But we understand they may be prepared to expand their league.
“If that’s not there, there is interest from some franchises who wish to move.”<br>
But first there’s one more year of the AHL at Mile One. Whether it’s a lame duck one is the big question, although Coombs cautions, perhaps reluctantly, there still may be a deal in the works between St. John’s and Toronto.
“Let’s assume the worst,” he says, “and Toronto and St. John’s come back with nothing after investigating other options. Maybe we can work something out.
“But they had better be prepared to come down (on the price tag).”
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Post by montreal on Jun 22, 2004 23:29:19 GMT -5
I'd be surprised to see the Dogs move to St. Johns. The attendence there is poor, which is a shame for one of the top teams in the AHL for 2 years. Maybe moving the team would be better financially.
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