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Post by ethan on Feb 18, 2004 18:51:51 GMT -5
Hossa-Koivu to the flames for Conroy and Gauthier
Hossa needs to get shipped out before his stock dips any further, Koivu I love to death, but at this point, the team is falling apart around him, and if he's not bringing leadership to the table, his value sinks quite a bit.
Cgy could use the offensive help, plus koivu plays hard and would appeal to sutter, conroy has worn out his welcome and gauthier is disposable at this point... both teams benefit.
Zednik-Hainsey to Edmonton for Ryan Smyth (and a pic, 2 or 3rd).
Zednik still has intriguing potential, but Smyth would be a better fit next to Ribs on the first line. Hainsey might seem like to much to add in, but it would get the deal done, and imo hainsey won't bloom into the player people on this site are hoping for... both winners.
Perrault, kilger and a 2nd pic to the Flyers for Gagne.
Clarke seems to have no problem shipping out young talented forwards for the reinforcements his team needs (Williams and Comrie in the last month). The Flyers need some help up the middle, Perraults face off ability makes him a nice candidate, kilger and the pic are throw in's... both win
Rivet and throw in (dykhus, bouillion, or a late pic) to Dallas for Arnott.
Rivet is in the need of a change of scenery, Dallas could use D help... Arnott may be worth more but Gainey's relationship squeezes the deal through... we win.
end result, next year opening day line up...
Smyth Ribeiro Ryder Markov Gauthier
Gagne Arnott Balej Souray Brisebois
Bulis Conroy Sundstrom Komisarek Quintal (FA)
Langdon Begin Ward
Now that's a decent playoff roster...and with higgins, perezhogin, plekanec, katsytsin and a 8th or 9th pic from this year waiting in the wings, things would look just rosy for the future.
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Post by Forum Ghost on Feb 18, 2004 21:17:10 GMT -5
I too would love to get Jason Arnott, but with the Stars entrenched in a playoff position, I would think that the they are no longer in a selling mood.
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Post by Skilly on Feb 18, 2004 21:32:02 GMT -5
Well I have to be honest also .....
Even though I think Koivu is too rich for Calgary's blood .... the first two trades you mentioned are the 2 most sensible I have seen on this site yet.
But after that you go on a Greed Tangent .... Last time I checked Hades was still hot ..... it is going to have to dip below the zero degree mark for the rest of your trades happen. Philly wouldn't touch Perreault with a ten foot pole ... plus Yanny has a no-trade clause. And any chance of Arnott coming north of the border left when Dallas moved into playoff seedings.
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Post by blny on Feb 18, 2004 22:24:33 GMT -5
Well I have to be honest also ..... Even though I think Koivu is too rich for Calgary's blood .... the first two trades you mentioned are the 2 most sensible I have seen on this site yet. What has Conroy ever done? Aside from one great year feeding Iginla, he's been an average player. At this point Craig is a checker IMO. He's a good player worthy of something akin to Rivet or Sundstrom. Gauthier is a strong hitter who still wanders from his position too much. I'd send Hossa and a pick for him. I see major imbalance in the proposal. It gives Calgary a premier playmaker to feed pucks to a premier finisher, and a solid prospect (still) in need of new surroundings. We get a checker who had one good year and a bruiser without the discipline to stay in position. Iginla would light it up for major numbers and our offense would take a major hit. Major. We'd score less goals than we do now. Bad move. Any trade of Saku requires a return of elite talent the other way. This trade doesn't do that remotely. ... plus Yanny has a no-trade clause. And any chance of Arnott coming north of the border left when Dallas moved into playoff seedings. Not this year, the last of his contract. Breezy, yes. But not Yanic (I'm pretty sure anyways). |
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Post by PTH on Feb 18, 2004 22:33:46 GMT -5
Not this year, the last of his contract. Breezy, yes. But not Yanic (I'm pretty sure anyways). I used to agree with you, but a few weeks ago I read an aerticle where YP explicitly said "I won't push aside my no-trade clause, I want to stay here", so maybe it's the original info about the no-trade clause being for the first 2 years that was false. (or Yanic doesn't know his own contract) |
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Post by Marvin on Feb 18, 2004 22:37:25 GMT -5
What has Conroy ever done? Aside from one great year feeding Iginla, he's been an average player. At this point Craig is a checker IMO. quote] I never thought much of Conroy until he was acquired by Cgy and put into a more offensively-responsible role. He's more gifted than I thought, and even this year having missed a ton of games, he's doing almost a point a game. Marvin |
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Post by blaise on Feb 19, 2004 11:14:25 GMT -5
Conroy would have little or no impact on the Habs' chances of making the playoffs this season or in the future. In addition, his playoff record is unimpressive: 3 goals, 5 assists in 36 games.
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Post by Skilly on Feb 19, 2004 14:09:11 GMT -5
Well I have to be honest also ..... Even though I think Koivu is too rich for Calgary's blood .... the first two trades you mentioned are the 2 most sensible I have seen on this site yet. When you factor in we are losing Koivu, Zednik and getting Smyth ..... well it may be rich ....but it is a step in the right direction. As for Perreault .... Gainey wants to trade him now (when he is worth something to someone not in the offseason when he is worth diddly-squat. |
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Post by Skilly on Feb 19, 2004 14:09:57 GMT -5
err getting Smyth and Conroy
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Post by blaise on Feb 19, 2004 14:44:27 GMT -5
Hossa-Koivu to the flames for Conroy and Gauthier Why would you want to screw the Habs with that uneven trade? |
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Post by Skilly on Feb 19, 2004 17:21:22 GMT -5
It only makes sense if we also get Smyth.
No Smyth and I agree it isn't a good deal.
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Post by razor on Feb 20, 2004 9:30:36 GMT -5
I have to agree with bringing Arnott in. Too bad we didn't do it ~5 years ago when he went from Edmonton to Jersey.
Another person that could potentially help the team would be Georges Laraque. Being from Montreal he may even want to come, and he should be cheap with the off year he is having. I have seen some media reports that Edmonton would be willing to let him go.
Laraque wouldn't fill in on the top two lines, but would definately bring in the toughness we lack, and give us someone to put in front of the net that the other teams won't just knock on their a$$.
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Post by Douper on Feb 20, 2004 10:05:57 GMT -5
Laraque has said publicly that he would not want to play in Montreal...
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Post by Skilly on Feb 20, 2004 10:50:48 GMT -5
Not only thant ...he said he would never be a fighter in any other city.
I an not sure what he said verbatim ... but something to the effect of "If I am traded, the other team should know, that I will not be the same player, or play the same way, I do here in Edmonton"
Langer is good enough for me anyway .... he doesn't conditionalize (is that even a word) his play ... he just picks up for everybody.
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Post by razor on Feb 20, 2004 10:52:24 GMT -5
Aww nuts.  |
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Post by Strummerman on Feb 20, 2004 20:43:45 GMT -5
Come on Bob it is time to move. The players I would like being moved are Juneau Bouillon Dackell Ward Kilger. Yes Bouillon because at his height and his speed he is playing way over his head this year. This guy wont last much longer. The rest are underachievers and softies and slowpokes. What can we get? Dow e need a big alary grab like a Sergei Gonchar or a useful player like a Denis Gauthier or an intimidator like Matthew barnaby. Can you see Barnaby and Begin on the same line. What a pest patrol.
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Post by FormerLurker on Feb 21, 2004 10:39:46 GMT -5
Hossa-Koivu to the flames for Conroy and Gauthier That deal is unspeakably awful. We get 20 games plus playoffs from Conroy before he walks, and a decent youngish 4-5 defenseman. But we give up a 22 year old prospect who's finally starting to turn it around in the AHL and a fiercely competitive near point-per-game player in his prime. That deal is close, but I wouldn't do it. In the last four years, Zed's got 91 goals and 172 points, while Smyth's got 89 goals and 220 points. I don't think it's worth giving up Hainsey just to get 12 additional assists per year from our left winger. Kilger has passed through waivers and Perreault is a UFA at the end of the year. Gagne is a young, defensively responsible, offensively talented forward. What motivates Clarke to make this move? As other have said, I don't think that Arnott's available. But if he was, he'd surely cost more than Rivet plus junk. |
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Post by PTH on Feb 21, 2004 11:31:16 GMT -5
I an not sure what he said verbatim ... but something to the effect of "If I am traded, the other team should know, that I will not be the same player, or play the same way, I do here in Edmonton" That's pretty much it, I read it in French on RDS and it amounted to "If I'm traded, I won't fight anymore." He took a lot of user-feedback flak, but held his ground on his next column. |
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Post by ethan on Feb 21, 2004 17:57:53 GMT -5
That deal is unspeakably awful. We get 20 games plus playoffs from Conroy before he walks, and a decent youngish 4-5 defenseman. But we give up a 22 year old prospect who's finally starting to turn it around in the AHL and a fiercely competitive near point-per-game player in his prime. That deal is close, but I wouldn't do it. In the last four years, Zed's got 91 goals and 172 points, while Smyth's got 89 goals and 220 points. I don't think it's worth giving up Hainsey just to get 12 additional assists per year from our left winger. . I have to disagree about your assesment of the first proposeal... Bottom line is that Koivu is a fragile player so despite his point/per game level of skill, at 30 years old and with his history of injuries, he isn't the ideal candidate for #1 centre. Ribs has showed that he has the talent to play that spot (if not the grit). Conroy would give us a mature, solid two way player who is good at face-offs and a good locker room presence and, more importantly, a clear #1-#2 centre situation. Hossa is a question mark, and personally I'm not convinced that he's anything more than a one dimensional, very average player who gets by on his brothers name. Gauthier is a hard nose (at times dirty) stay at home D-man, the kind who will have a long NHL career as a #4 D-man (think bryan marchement, gary suter-post cgy, colin white)... and he has playoff hockey written all over him. Makes for a pretty even deal in my eyes. While Zed's and Smyth's numbers are similar, (though, i had 235pts in 291 games for Smyth, and 173 pts in 305 games for Zed... really not all that close, 62 points more in 14 fewer games is a substantial difference over only 4 seasons) Smyth brings so much more to the table as an athlete... intensity, leadership, grit... invaluable tangents that make him a much more valuable player than Zednik, that's why Gretzky had him on the olympic team ahead of a lot of more talented players. I'll admit that thel last two deals (with philly and the stars) are more wishful thinking than anything else... but hey, stranger things have happened (Chelios for Savard... Turgeon and Conroy for Corson, Leclair and Desjardins for Zubrus... patrick roy and mike keane for T-bo and Rosy... Just once, I'd like to see us on the positive side of a brutal trade!) |
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