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Post by seventeen on Jun 23, 2016 17:01:03 GMT -5
Way too much noise over PK right now. Benning says he and many other teams have called about Subban but the price is too high. Then Laraques, the moron says Habs are talking to Edmonton about the fourth pick and Draisaitl (I'm still not crazy about Draisaitl but it could be me). Now Ray Ferraro says there's a better than 50% chance PK changes teams and now Berg's presser has been moved back 45 minutes. Not good.
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Post by PTH on Jun 23, 2016 17:26:48 GMT -5
Way too much noise over PK right now. Benning says he and many other teams have called about Subban but the price is too high. Then Laraques, the moron says Habs are talking to Edmonton about the fourth pick and Draisaitl (I'm still not crazy about Draisaitl but it could be me). Now Ray Ferraro says there's a better than 50% chance PK changes teams and now Berg's presser has been moved back 45 minutes. Not good. Well, if we can get Dubois and Draisatl it's still quite the return... I suspect the deal would actually be bigger than that, and those 2 are just the parts that EDM is hesitating about and other parts are agreed upon. |
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Post by blny on Jun 23, 2016 18:04:49 GMT -5
All the noise is from the outside. Teams calling because pmd are at a premium. I can barely stomach the thought to entertain the notion, but if Edmonton were the other team they had best anti up. Draisaitl is a very good piece. Add the 4th overall AND Klefbom. Edmonton fans would cry at that price (as it's been suggested on hf and they have). Leon gives you a really good center prospect to put behind Galchenyuk. Klefbom is a very good young defenseman but I question whether or not he can put up points. 4th overall gives you a chip that you could take the pick with, or package with the 9th to try and move up.
IMO, if you're gonna do all that, you may as well trade the rest of the core. Say goodbye to Max and Price. You'd be set up with Galch, Leon, Gallagher, and the high pick, but then you're goalie shopping. Just doesn't make sense to me. Wouldn't be worth the resulting riots imo.
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Post by PTH on Jun 23, 2016 18:15:42 GMT -5
All the noise is from the outside. Teams calling because pmd are at a premium. I can barely stomach the thought to entertain the notion, but if Edmonton were the other team they had best anti up. Draisaitl is a very good piece. Add the 4th overall AND Klefbom. Edmonton fans would cry at that price (as it's been suggested on hf and they have). Leon gives you a really good center prospect to put behind Galchenyuk. Klefbom is a very good young defenseman but I question whether or not he can put up points. 4th overall gives you a chip that you could take the pick with, or package with the 9th to try and move up. IMO, if you're gonna do all that, you may as well trade the rest of the core. Say goodbye to Max and Price. You'd be set up with Galch, Leon, Gallagher, and the high pick, but then you're goalie shopping. Just doesn't make sense to me. Wouldn't be worth the resulting riots imo. Draisatl, 4th and another significant piece - whether Klefbom, Nurse, Eberle, etc., and I honestly couldn't say no. We'd have to be getting a D either as a UFA or through trade, but we'd suddenly have options, whereas right now the Habs are asset-poor - there's very little on the Habs that's worth trading for. Jeff Petry has to be worried though. He was out of his depth as a #1 in Edmonton, and now he has to wonder if he could be a #1 once again... |
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Post by franko on Jun 23, 2016 18:18:35 GMT -5
Everybody was out of his depth as any d-man in Edmonton.
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Post by blny on Jun 23, 2016 18:31:00 GMT -5
All the noise is from the outside. Teams calling because pmd are at a premium. I can barely stomach the thought to entertain the notion, but if Edmonton were the other team they had best anti up. Draisaitl is a very good piece. Add the 4th overall AND Klefbom. Edmonton fans would cry at that price (as it's been suggested on hf and they have). Leon gives you a really good center prospect to put behind Galchenyuk. Klefbom is a very good young defenseman but I question whether or not he can put up points. 4th overall gives you a chip that you could take the pick with, or package with the 9th to try and move up. IMO, if you're gonna do all that, you may as well trade the rest of the core. Say goodbye to Max and Price. You'd be set up with Galch, Leon, Gallagher, and the high pick, but then you're goalie shopping. Just doesn't make sense to me. Wouldn't be worth the resulting riots imo. Draisatl, 4th and another significant piece - whether Klefbom, Nurse, Eberle, etc., and I honestly couldn't say no. We'd have to be getting a D either as a UFA or through trade, but we'd suddenly have options, whereas right now the Habs are asset-poor - there's very little on the Habs that's worth trading for. Jeff Petry has to be worried though. He was out of his depth as a #1 in Edmonton, and now he has to wonder if he could be a #1 once again... Sure, it's tempting. But it also sends mixed messages. I think I'd prefer Nurse over Klefbom, but that's besides the point. Do we want Therrien molding that many kids? Pacioretty-Galchenyuk-Gallagher Tkachuk/Dubois-Draisaitl-? .... That is a very, very young line. Carr/Lehkonen-Eller-Andrighetto Markov-Petry Nurse/Klefbom-Pateryn Beaulieu-Barberio Keep the ninth and hope to draft one of the three defenders of note. We take a big hit on defense to upgrade the talent level up front. Those upgrades are very young. You end up with a bunch of kids who hit their peak at the same time and likely are unable to sign them all. |
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Post by folatre on Jun 23, 2016 18:31:45 GMT -5
Who trades an elite #1 d-man signed up long-term contractually in his prime?
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Post by blny on Jun 23, 2016 18:36:29 GMT -5
Who trades an elite #1 d-man signed up long-term contractually in his prime? Not me. I get a little sick to my stomach thinking about it. |
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Post by PTH on Jun 23, 2016 18:43:33 GMT -5
Our defense would be ugly, moreso when Markov retires.
But as a guy on RDS just noted, we have something like twice the money locked up on D that the reigning Stanley Cup champions had.... I'd add that if you have a solid goalie and a lot of firepower up front, you can get away with mediocre D.
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Post by folatre on Jun 23, 2016 18:49:17 GMT -5
I understand your point about having too much cap space on the d-corps. But the elite #1 guy is not the problem in that money equation. The club paid Tom Gilbert 2.8 million this season and Emilin 4.1 million. That was the most expensive third pairing in the league by wide margin.
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Post by jkr on Jun 23, 2016 18:50:55 GMT -5
Who trades an elite #1 d-man signed up long-term contractually in his prime? Not me. I get a little sick to my stomach thinking about it. I posted my response in the thread in the main board. It was long (not BC long  ) so I won't put it here. IMO to consider it is plain wrong. As you said you might as well start again because you traded your best skater for some pieces. EDM win this deal because no matter what, they end up with the best player. What does it say to the rest of the team? How do you re sign Price when the time comes? Why would he stay. Bergevin has failed miserably to find top forwards skin this is his solution? |
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Post by jkr on Jun 23, 2016 18:55:04 GMT -5
Our defense would be ugly, moreso when Markov retires. But as a guy on RDS just noted, we have something like twice the money locked up on D that the reigning Stanley Cup champions had.... I'd add that if you have a solid goalie and a lot of firepower up front, you can get away with mediocre D. What firepower are you talking about? Beyond 27 & 67 I don't see much. Is this what it has come to? Creating a huge hole on D because the GM can't find decent forwards. As folatre says the cap problem isn't Subban. It's the stiffs like Emelin & company that are way overpaid. |
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Post by blny on Jun 23, 2016 18:57:08 GMT -5
I think this should be merged with the thread on the main board ...
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Post by PTH on Jun 23, 2016 19:15:45 GMT -5
Our defense would be ugly, moreso when Markov retires. But as a guy on RDS just noted, we have something like twice the money locked up on D that the reigning Stanley Cup champions had.... I'd add that if you have a solid goalie and a lot of firepower up front, you can get away with mediocre D. What firepower are you talking about? Beyond 27 & 67 I don't see much. Is this what it has come to? Creating a huge hole on D because the GM can't find decent forwards. As folatre says the cap problem isn't Subban. It's the stiffs like Emelin & company that are way overpaid. Well, add Dubois, Eberle and Draisatl, and yes we would have firepower. And while we all know which guys are overpaid, no team doesn't have a few clunker contracts, or contracts that are sure to cause problems later on. |
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Post by Skilly on Jun 23, 2016 20:38:17 GMT -5
I'm not against trading Subban, but it has to be for Taylor Hall, the #4 pick, and a defenseman that can play now (Klefbom/Nurse)
Yep. We lose 50 points on D. We gain 100 points on O.
The whole game plan is to ride Price, and that didn't work even with Subban. But it sure would be nice to be scoring 3-4 goals a night and trying out how Price does,
I personally think Beaulieu would be the #1, and the PP QB. He may not score very much on the PP, but I think he'd control the play better on the PP.
Would we miss Subban? Most definitely. But I don't think it would be as bad as people think. And if it is? Well we suck, get a #1 selection maybe, Price will want to leave some say; let him, we'd get a kings ransom for Price.
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Post by jkr on Jun 23, 2016 21:05:24 GMT -5
I'm not against trading Subban, but it has to be for Taylor Hall, the #4 pick, and a defenseman that can play now (Klefbom/Nurse) Yep. We lose 50 points on D. We gain 100 points on O. The whole game plan is to ride Price, and that didn't work even with Subban. But it sure would be nice to be scoring 3-4 goals a night and trying out how Price does, I personally think Beaulieu would be the #1, and the PP QB. He may not score very much on the PP, but I think he'd control the play better on the PP. Would we miss Subban? Most definitely. But I don't think it would be as bad as people think. And if it is? Well we suck, get a #1 selection maybe, Price will want to leave some say; let him, we'd get a kings ransom for Price. Aren't you fired of the mediocrity Skilly? Never being quite good enough, trading your stars, starting over. It wouldn't be the Montreal Canadiens, it would be the Montreal Expos. |
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Post by folatre on Jun 23, 2016 21:41:05 GMT -5
There are probably only 10-12 legitimate #1 d-men in league. Subban is in elite top 5-6 of that exclusive club. Chiarrelli openly says he covets a #1 d-man for the influence this piece has on hoisting silverware. Therefore, Chiarelli is implicitly saying Klefbom and Nurse are not #1 material.
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Post by seventeen on Jun 23, 2016 23:36:47 GMT -5
Our defense would be ugly, moreso when Markov retires. But as a guy on RDS just noted, we have something like twice the money locked up on D that the reigning Stanley Cup champions had.... I'd add that if you have a solid goalie and a lot of firepower up front, you can get away with mediocre D. Yeah, but one of those d-men on the Stanley Cup champs played half the game, like PK does for us. You don't win the Cup without an elite D-man and Letang is one of them. We wouldn't have one if we traded PK. I wouldn't accept anything less than Hall, Nurse, and a swap of Picks for PK. Nurse would become that elite dman in a couple of years. Klefbom isn't in his class. That offer of Draisaitl, Klefbom and the 4th just doesn't do it for me. Too much uncertainty. |
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Post by GNick99 on Jun 24, 2016 5:12:27 GMT -5
Way too much noise over PK right now. Benning says he and many other teams have called about Subban but the price is too high. Then Laraques, the moron says Habs are talking to Edmonton about the fourth pick and Draisaitl (I'm still not crazy about Draisaitl but it could be me). Now Ray Ferraro says there's a better than 50% chance PK changes teams and now Berg's presser has been moved back 45 minutes. Not good. Has to be huge to trade Subban. I doubt both the 4th and Draistal go in trade as Oilers need to move salary back. Likely Hall instead. |
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jun 24, 2016 6:32:58 GMT -5
Darren Dreger said on TSN that the media will continue to speculate on this, which is another way of saying they're going to milk it ... Marc Bergevin tried putting those rumours to rest but as it is now, the media is getting the attention they've generated ...
Cheers.
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Post by jkr on Jun 24, 2016 6:45:52 GMT -5
Way too much noise over PK right now. Benning says he and many other teams have called about Subban but the price is too high. Then Laraques, the moron says Habs are talking to Edmonton about the fourth pick and Draisaitl (I'm still not crazy about Draisaitl but it could be me). Now Ray Ferraro says there's a better than 50% chance PK changes teams and now Berg's presser has been moved back 45 minutes. Not good. What's with Benning? This isn't European soccer where teams openly covet players on other clubs & movement is talked about in the press. This is the NHL where things are kept behind closed doors. He should have kept his mouth shut. Maybe Bergevin should tell the press he called Vancouver about the Sedins & then let that dumba$$ deal with the fallout. |
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Post by jkr on Jun 24, 2016 6:49:34 GMT -5
What firepower are you talking about? Beyond 27 & 67 I don't see much. Is this what it has come to? Creating a huge hole on D because the GM can't find decent forwards. As folatre says the cap problem isn't Subban. It's the stiffs like Emelin & company that are way overpaid. Well, add Dubois, Eberle and Draisatl, and yes we would have firepower. And while we all know which guys are overpaid, no team doesn't have a few clunker contracts, or contracts that are sure to cause problems later on. Draisaitl is 20 years old with one 19 goal season. Dubois hasn't played a minute of pro hockey. There's no guarantees of any firepower there & if you're trading Subban you can't do it with your fingers crossed & hope the guys you get turn into something. You have to know. |
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Post by jkr on Jun 24, 2016 6:50:51 GMT -5
Darren Dreger said on TSN that the media will continue to speculate on this, which is another way of saying they're going to milk it ... Marc Bergevin tried putting those rumours to rest but as it is now, the media is getting the attention they've generated ... Cheers. Dreger is right in there with the rest of them fueling it. |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jun 24, 2016 13:25:57 GMT -5
Darren Dreger said on TSN that the media will continue to speculate on this, which is another way of saying they're going to milk it ... Marc Bergevin tried putting those rumours to rest but as it is now, the media is getting the attention they've generated ... Cheers. Dreger is right in there with the rest of them fueling it. Subban's name in a tweet gets loads of hits/follows. Heck, Global Edmonton led off its sports last night and this morning with the Subban story. Amazing. |
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Post by The Habitual Fan on Jun 24, 2016 13:47:24 GMT -5
But you have to admit it is more fun then listening to every talking head tell you how Matthews is going to save the city of Toronto
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Post by seventeen on Jun 24, 2016 14:18:45 GMT -5
But you have to admit it is more fun then listening to every talking head tell you how Matthews is going to save the city of Toronto Both fun and frightening! |
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Post by BadCompany on Jun 24, 2016 14:43:37 GMT -5
Total media hype if you ask me. How many times does Bergevin have to say he's not interested in trading Subban? I'd be stunned if it happened.
But who is going to watch a draft with no drama? This is why every year they try to make it seem like there is uncertainty over who will be the first pick. Even last year they were trying to push Eichel over McDavid. They even tried this year with Laine allegedly catching Matthews in some scouts eyes. Right. Since that is so obviously not true they're pushing a major trade so people will tune in and watch.
Click bait and media hype for a TV spectacle that is otherwise pretty dull to watch.
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jun 24, 2016 14:51:56 GMT -5
Total media hype if you ask me. How many times does Bergevin have to say he's not interested in trading Subban? I'd be stunned if it happened. But who is going to watch a draft with no drama? This is why every year they try to make it seem like there is uncertainty over who will be the first pick. Even last year they were trying to push Eichel over McDavid. They even tried this year with Laine allegedly catching Matthews in some scouts eyes. Right. Since that is so obviously not true they're pushing a major trade so people will tune in and watch. Click bait and media hype for a TV spectacle that is otherwise pretty dull to watch. Round One of the draft is very slow TV. 30 picks over 3 hours of televised talking heads waxing poetic. Almost as slow and full of filler as the Trade Deadline Day which has slowly morphed into the most ridiculously paced hockey show. |
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Post by jkr on Jun 25, 2016 14:21:58 GMT -5
Way too much noise over PK right now. Benning says he and many other teams have called about Subban but the price is too high. Then Laraques, the moron says Habs are talking to Edmonton about the fourth pick and Draisaitl (I'm still not crazy about Draisaitl but it could be me). Now Ray Ferraro says there's a better than 50% chance PK changes teams and now Berg's presser has been moved back 45 minutes. Not good. I knew Benning should have kept his mouth shut. Facing tampering charges now: www.tsn.ca/canucks-benning-facing-tampering-charge-1.515432 |
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Post by seventeen on Jun 25, 2016 18:38:17 GMT -5
Total media hype if you ask me. How many times does Bergevin have to say he's not interested in trading Subban? I'd be stunned if it happened. But who is going to watch a draft with no drama? This is why every year they try to make it seem like there is uncertainty over who will be the first pick. Even last year they were trying to push Eichel over McDavid. They even tried this year with Laine allegedly catching Matthews in some scouts eyes. Right. Since that is so obviously not true they're pushing a major trade so people will tune in and watch. Click bait and media hype for a TV spectacle that is otherwise pretty dull to watch. I wouldn't be stunned. Rutherford came out and replied to a similar question re Malkin with, "We aren't trading Malkin". Why is it so hard to say "We're not trading PK"? Yet Bergevin refuses to make that simple statement. I still think he'll be moved. I suspect there' a lot of dislike for Subban because Therrien hasn't been able to remake him. Way too much smoke. |
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) so I won't put it here. 
