Carey Price should be Théodore's successor

[M. Beaux-Eaux]

Carey Price should be Théodore's successor

François Lemenu
Canadian Press
Ottawa

Carey Price was fifth on the Canadiens list. "That's why we chose him. He was next on our list", commented GM Bob Gainey, who saw Sidney Crosby, Bobby Ryan, Jack Johnson and Benoît Pouliot disappear quickly.

"A goalie is very important", he added. "A goalie can win games by himself, he can carry his team to the playoffs and win a round. For us, a goalie always represents value."

Gainey believes he has chosen a promising goalie who will one day wear the Canadiens colors.

"Price is a young man who wants to play in the NHL. He has size and a good technique. He is also very competitive. Nothing seems to bother him. This year he played very well, even when his team had its share of difficulties."

Price represents the Canadiens future in net. In fact, he should be the successor to Théodore, taking into account where he was chosen. Let's remember that Théodore could become a free agent without compensation before the 2006-2007 season, if he doesn't sign a multi-year contract.

"We are thinking ahead", Gainey pointed out, while expressing the opinion that Price will be back in junior hockey this season.

- texte français original

[Habs_fan_in_LA]

The sooner the better.

[jkr]

Price himself seems quite mature in some of the interviews I read yesterday. He expects a year in junior and two years in the minors before he reaches the NHL. He also mentioned that he didn't want to rush it - an obvious reference to the Dan Blackburn fiasco in New York.

He seeems to have his head on straight and have strong character - traits that are very important to gainey et al.

[Deleted]

Mature for his age. It's rare to see anybody, let alone a hockey player, have the mentality of a mature adult.

[M. Beaux-Eaux]

Strong post by turnbuckle over at HF:

I always get a kick out of the post-draft hype - McGuire overreacts and posters follow suit.

I don't see people criticizing Atlanta for picking Lehtonen even higher; you can't go into the draft assuming all goalie prospects will flop or you'll never have any good ones in your system.

Fact is , goalies are the hardest to rate. Fleury was ranked number four going into the draft, he was picked first. Dipietro was ranked anywhere from third to 7th, he went first. Price was ranked 7th on most pre-draft charts, he went fifth.

What about Ottawa using the 9th pick on a player ranked by most to go in the mid to late teens or higher? Is that okay because McGuire said it is?

Another thing people seem to be ignoring is Price's development. He is still only 17 years old, but he has 100 WHL games under his belt, with an impressive GAA and SP. He participated in two under 18 championships last year and has a gold and silver medal from it. He'll be ready for NHL action sooner than later, I wouldn't be surprised to see him playing in the league at 21 years of age, just like Lehtonen and Dipietro. Blackburn was an NHL regular at 18-19, and save for injuries he'd already have about 200 NHL games under his belt at a young age, more than most power forwards at the same age.

Defencemen and power forwards can take as long or longer to crack the NHL than premiere young goalies, so I don't buy the argument that you don't take a goalie under the new CBA because they take longer to develop. Price is a long way along in his devlopment, much further along than Fleury was at 17, with the resume (including more games played) to back it up. Three years of junior (he played Junior B at 15), starting playoff goalie for his team in his rookie year at the tender age of 16, third in minutes played among WHL goalies as a 17-year-old.

I wouldn't be suprised to see Price signed and playing in the AHL next season, and after two years of apprenticing in the AHL, graduate to the Habs after just turning 21. Will Kopitar be playing in the NHL sooner? Perhaps. Will Jack Johnsoin or Pouliot be playing in the NHL before Price? Maybe.

How long would it have taken Brule to crack the Hab's deep center group? Brule's at least three years of development away from taking a center spot in Montreall IMO, Chippy will be a solid center in two-three year's time, don't forget Plekanec, Higgins is a natural center as well, then there's another small talented center in Locke. Throw in Bonk, Koivu, Begin and Ribeiro and I really don't see a Brule being a Hab regular for three or four seasons, no sooner than Price will crack the lineup.

Montreal's goalie depth was indeed lacking after the trade of Garon and uinfortunate knee injury to Huet. There's no guarantee that Huet will bounce back. Torn up knees are not good for 30-something goalies' careers as a rule.

Danis isn't a lock to be a starting goalie (I don't see him as a top-notch starter), and Theo, who has shown a preference in the past for money over the team concept, will be a UFA starting next season. He may be around for a year, two years, four years. Without Price, Montreal's hands are pretty much tied if Theo bombs in a couple of years after signing a new three-year deal. The Habs would have to keep Theo with no up and coming goalie in the system, or trade him for another goalie instead of the team's biggest need - quality defencemen. We all know what happened the last time Montreal made a panic trade involving goalie for goalie. Price's presence gives Gainey much more leverage not only in negotiations with Theo, but leverage in negotiations with other teams involving possible deals for Theo. Other teams will know that Gainey doesn't have to panic.

Let's say Nashville becomes a strong playoff contender in two year's time, but Vokoun is gone in free agency in two years. The Habs deal Theo for Suter or Weber. A steep price for Nashville, but a hot Theo could take them far in the playoffs. Nashville has so many good young d-men (Klein, Parent, Hamhuis, Suter Weber), that they could afford to part with one if a player like Theo is the missing piece of the puzzle. If Price is ready to step in Montreal can make this sort of deal. Meanwhile, the Habs get an NHL ready defenceman that will play big minuites on their blueline for the next half dozen years at the minimum.

Suter
Komisarek
Souray
Markov
Rivet
Hainsey
O'Byrne

Price
Danis
Halak

That blueline looks a lot weaker without Suter or Weber.

Things could always work the other way as well. Let's say Theo plays great, the city and team loves him, he loves back and signs a long-term deal. Price develops as expected, and three years down the road he's backing up Theo and playing well.

Do you not think he'll be a valuable asset? I'm pretty sure Atlanta could get quite a bit for Lehtonen....what if Price develops as well as Lehtonen has.......he'd be worth a ton.

Worst case scenario is that he flops. It's happened before could happen again. That's a risk you take with every pick. For every Storr and Finley, there's a Chyzowski, Shannon, McBean, Warriner, Bonsignore, Kelly, Zyuzin, Volchkov, etc. In fact there's more first round forward flops than goalie flops through history, let alone defencemen.

[Forum Ghost]

Wow! What a great post.

I didn't think the pick was as bad as most people were making it out to be yesterday. I think that Pierre McGuire's instant criticism influenced people the wrong way.

As I mentioned in another thread, having Price in the system gives Gainey some much needed insurance between the pipes. Theo's future is uncertain, Garon was traded and Danis' potential as an NHL starter is questionable. According to HF Heino-Lindberg and Halak are our 12th and 14th best prospects respectively. Olivier Michaud isn't even in the Top 20. For goalies, we may have numbers, but we lack someone who has the potential to be a star. With Price, we have that.

Some of us are regretting not taking a forward with the top pick, but perhaps the other forwards who were available had too many question marks with their potential NHL game. For example, I was on the Brule bandwagon last week, and I still think that he'll be a great player, but I seriously wonder how healthy an NHL career he's going to have. His style and size are eerily similar to Koivu and look how bumpy an NHL career our captain has had.

[Forum Ghost]

During his one-on-one interview with James Duthie, here's what Gainey said about picking Price so high...


"Well there was a number of goaltenders in the top part of the draft, say the first couple of rounds. In our view he distinguished himself from the other players and from other players in other positions, that are going to be selected here and that's what our guys are paid to do. To make those decisions and to define what it is that we see in a player or a person and what it is that's going to make him a good player and a good part of our organization."


For those who question why the Habs didn't just take a goalie from a later round, it seems like Gainey and his staff thought that Price was absolutely head-and-shoulders above any other goalie in the draft and a better fit than any of the other players in the Top 10.

[jkr]

forumghost2 said:

Wow! What a great post.

I didn't think the pick was as bad as most people were making it out to be yesterday. I think that Pierre McGuire's instant criticism influenced people the wrong way.

Maybe we should start another thread for this but there are a lot of days McGuire rubs me the wrong way and this is an example. He seems to have a pro Ottawa bias and defending the pick of Brian Lee confirms it for me. When he lands a job as a GM and build a Cup winner I will take him seriously. Maybe after some reflection, like the rest of us, he may have softened his opinion.

I like his honesty but I think he spends too much time blowing his own horn. I saw him last week on TSN's draft lottery coverage actually talking about the time he was winning Cups with Lemieux. Give me a break!

However I did get a chuckle from him a couple of weeks ago when he described the leafs defence as "just awful". Got to take the good with the bad I guess.

[Forum Ghost]

jkr said:

Maybe we should start another thread for this but there are a lot of days McGuire rubs me the wrong way.

I like his honesty but I think he spends too much time blowing his own horn. I saw him last week on TSN's draft lottery coverage actually talking about the time he was winning Cups with Lemieux. Give me a break!

I completely agree. McGuire is full of himself. While I do think that he is fairly knowledgable about the game and the players, I think that he likes hearing himself talk too much and that he pats himself on the back too much as well. He should get credit for the Pens' Cup wins, but sometimes if you hear him talk you would think that he was the head coach instead of just the assistant.

I think that he went completely overboard with his assessment of the Habs picking Price. He kept mentioning that Price doesn't "fit" with the Habs since they already have Theodore, Huet and Danis. This makes absolutely no sense. Theodore might leave after a year, Huet is a career backup and Danis, while solid, is no star-in-the-making. And besides, you draft for the best player available. Who cares how well he fits into the team for the upcoming season? Gainey and his staff are looking down the road with their pick of Price. How dire will the situation look in a couple of years with no Theo and no top notch goaltending prospect in the system?

If McGuire thinks that Price is a "bad fit" in Montreal, then why didn't he comment on Lee being a bad fit in Ottawa? After all, they have Phillips, Redden and Chara. Why would they draft a defenceman, when he doesn't fit into this year's plans?? According to McGuire, Lee was a great pick and is a fit in Ottawa, but Price is not a fit in Montreal.

Makes no sense to me at all.

[roke]

forumghost2 said:

completely agree. McGuire is full of himself. While I do think that he is fairly knowledgable about the game and the players, I think that he likes hearing himself talk too much and that he pats himself on the back too much as well. He should get credit for the Pens' Cup wins, but sometimes if you hear him talk you would think that he was the head coach instead of just the assistant.

McGuire wasn't the head coach? Boy am I out to lunch.

[mic]

mrbozo said:

Strong post by turnbuckle over at HF: [...]

Great post indeed. However, turnbuckle says something about Price playing in the minors this season. Does the new CBA allow that ?

[CentreHice]

turnbuckle's post was excellent...I admit that McGuire's instant slam got me. But there was a split-second before he began his tirade that I also thought, "What?" That's why I was so quick to agree with him. Then my thoughts moved directly to the Theo angle.

My bad....a whole year of hockey withdrawal coming to the surface...wanting the Habs to pick a
Clark Kent to sit in the phone booth and answer the call this year.

Much calmer now,
CH

[clear observer]

mrbozo said:

Strong post by turnbuckle over at HF:

In fact there's more first round forward flops than goalie flops through history, let alone defencemen.

[/i][/quote]

Well, uh, yes....of course...that's cuz of the obvious...there are 15 - 20 times more forwards and d-men chosen (ever wonder why that is?).

CO

[M. Beaux-Eaux]

admin said:

mrbozo said:

Strong post by turnbuckle over at HF:

In fact there's more first round forward flops than goalie flops through history, let alone defencemen.

[/i][/quote]

Well, uh, yes....of course...that's cuz of the obvious...there are 15 - 20 times more forwards and d-men chosen (ever wonder why that is?).

CO[/quote]
Let's see what percentage of goalies, forwards, and defensemen selected in the first round have lived up to the hype, or not.

Yo! HabbaDasher, got a few minutes?

[CentreHice]

Nice article in the Toronto Star. Price was a Habs fan growing up.....probably around the time they won the Cup in 93.......then switched to Vancouver when they made the finals the next season......hmmm...kids....

full article

CH

[Montrealer]

On reflection, my initial reaction was over-wrought - this looks like it might be a good decision down the line. I was so set on Brule that my shock made me angry; I'm glad to see I wasn't the only one (thanks CO and Yeti!)

As for McGuire, remember that he considers himself a Montrealer, and might have been secretly thrilled about the Habs getting a power forward, and like some of us overreacted to Price (I remember saying on the phone to my Bruins loving brother: "What the ****? What the ****? What the ****?" over and over and over again)

So, let's not jump all over McGuire. I remember listening to him on CJAD broadcasts while working the evening shift and I've always liked/respected him - and he's on TV/radio, do you think he's going to be boring and agree with everything and everyone? Say what you will about his persona, it's gotten him onto national TV when a lot of guys can't get past CFCF12.

[M. Beaux-Eaux]

mic said:

mrbozo said:

Strong post by turnbuckle over at HF: [...]

Great post indeed. However, turnbuckle says something about Price playing in the minors this season. Does the new CBA allow that ?

Actually, he syas maybe next seaon. "montreal" could likely shed some light on Price's eligibility to play in the AHL. I wonder if the fact that he started so young in the CHL gives him a leg up in terms of playing in the AHL before most of his colleagues?

[mic]

mrbozo said:

mic said:

Great post indeed. However, turnbuckle says something about Price playing in the minors this season. Does the new CBA allow that ?

Actually, he syas maybe next seaon. "montreal" could likely shed some light on Price's eligibility to play in the AHL. I wonder if the fact that he started so young in the CHL gives him a leg up in terms of playing in the AHL before most of his colleagues?

I forgot about this possibility. Didn't Spezza do something like that, allowing him to play in the minors for Ottawa while being 19 or so years old ?

[Deleted]

McGuire is an outspoken loudmouth to whom I would recommend actually thinking before speaking if he had that kind of mental capacity.

Price makes no sense at first, but when you think deep down about it, it works. Price doesn't fit with the Habs' immediate plans, and it's not like that's all we've picked. We managed to pick up a potential power forward as well. Not a bad draft for us.

[M. Beaux-Eaux]

mic said:

mrbozo said:

Actually, he syas maybe next seaon. "montreal" could likely shed some light on Price's eligibility to play in the AHL. I wonder if the fact that he started so young in the CHL gives him a leg up in terms of playing in the AHL before most of his colleagues?

I forgot about this possibility. Didn't Spezza do something like that, allowing him to play in the minors for Ottawa while being 19 or so years old ?

I believe so. How nice it is to have a prodigy in the fold.

[Habs_fan_in_LA]

Right now I'm wondering if Danis isn't ready to be Theo's successor. If some team is in bad need of a goaltender with a bonifiedNHL rep, and they are willing to part with a big D-man to get one, I'm not averse to seeing Theo go, baggage and all.
Theo's market value is more likely to decline than rise at this point and the number of teams with room under their caps for his demands is limited.
Perhaps we wait until some teams goaltender is injured during the season (sounds like an old Hackett thread).

[Forum Ghost]

admin said:

Well, uh, yes....of course...that's cuz of the obvious...there are 15 - 20 times more forwards and d-men chosen (ever wonder why that is?).

I would guess because there are 18 positions for regular forwards and defenceman and only one for goaltenders.

If there are 18 times more spots available for forwards and d-men then it only makes sense that they are drafted 15-20 times more often than goalies.

[M. Beaux-Eaux]

forumghost2 said:

admin said:

Well, uh, yes....of course...that's cuz of the obvious...there are 15 - 20 times more forwards and d-men chosen (ever wonder why that is?).

I would guess because there are 18 positions for regular forwards and defenceman and only one for goaltenders.

If there are 18 times more spots available for forwards and d-men then it only makes sense that they are drafted 15-20 times more often than goalies.

You trying to cause trouble?

[Forum Ghost]

mrbozo said:

You trying to cause trouble?

Not at all officer.

Just trying to make sense of things, that's all.

[M. Beaux-Eaux]

forumghost2 said:

mrbozo said:

You trying to cause trouble?

Not at all officer.

Just trying to make sense of things, that's all.

Well then, stop making sense.

[Doc Holliday]

montrealer said:

So, let's not jump all over McGuire. I remember listening to him on CJAD broadcasts while working the evening shift and I've always liked/respected him - and he's on TV/radio, do you think he's going to be boring and agree with everything and everyone? Say what you will about his persona, it's gotten him onto national TV when a lot of guys can't get past CFCF12.

Burke once called him the worst journalist in the industry, a guy that knows nothing and make stuff up... That was after he rumored that Burke had made a better offer to Savard for Linden than the deal he got with Washington.

When McGuire doesn't talk about the HABS, I have no problem with him. But whenever he opens his mouth to say something about our team it is to criticize this and that decision from management... always. I see him as a guy that's highly frustrated that no team, especialy Montreal, ever tried to get him back into their management team.

His general hockey opinions are interesting though and I like him way more than complete jokes like Healy, Strachan and Brooks.

[seventeen]

Good post by Turnbuckle covering lots of reasons, except the one that BC and CO have proposed...that the odds of getting a superstar goalie in the 1st round are low, low, low. Brodeur is the 1st that comes to mind and he was drafted 16th or so, no? Other than that, I can't recall a high first rounder who has yet turned into that superstar goalie. Luongo may get there in the next few years. So while the Habs may have had many very good reasons for making their pick, they're going against the odds, big time.

[Forum Ghost]

seventeen said:

Good post by Turnbuckle covering lots of reasons, except the one that BC and CO have proposed...that the odds of getting a superstar goalie in the 1st round are low, low, low. Brodeur is the 1st that comes to mind and he was drafted 16th or so, no? Other than that, I can't recall a high first rounder who has yet turned into that superstar goalie. Luongo may get there in the next few years. So while the Habs may have had many very good reasons for making their pick, they're going against the odds, big time.

The responsibility of fighting the odds are on the shoulders of Carey Price, Roberto Luongo, Marc-Andre Fleury and Kari Lehtonen.

I wish them luck.