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Post by Cranky on Dec 26, 2005 21:41:12 GMT -5
Gui who?
The only reason I watched the Juniors play was to see what Chips and Gui would do and here are my impressions....
I think Gui stole Dag's brain. All Gui did was put his head down, snort, kick some dirt and head to crash the nearest man to him. He did this on several occasions and while it looks good to the unwashed, it means nothing to the game. Sutter must not have been too thrilled with his play either because it look like he played him less then 8 minutes. He didn't even play some power plays which are his "specialty". I will try to find the actual stats.
But those Chips were good........
Chips played a strong grinding game. He is able to go to the boards and come out with the puck, his ice vision is very good and his skating is fairly good. He scored on a rebound.
From this game and ONLY this game, it looks like Chips is our third line defensive center and it looks like Gui needs new hooves.
Not too thrilled....... *sigh*
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Post by seventeen on Dec 27, 2005 3:27:57 GMT -5
Remember, it is only 1 game. The others I watched showed a Chips in bad need of a good dip to make him palatable. Bad hands. Today, he scores using good hands. Gui does have to pick it up, though. Ishe overweight?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2005 10:24:23 GMT -5
Remember, it is only 1 game. The others I watched showed a Chips in bad need of a good dip to make him palatable. Bad hands. Today, he scores using good hands. Gui does have to pick it up, though. Ishe overweight? No kidding. Too many of us either get over-excited or horribly panicky after just one game. |
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Post by habmeister on Dec 27, 2005 14:05:21 GMT -5
i'm not suprised to see a thread like this. Power Forwards usually don't turn into great players until 3-5 years in the nhl. Cam Neely, Todd Bertuzzi are two great examples. Please let's not over analyze lats for the next 5 years, let's look at his raw strength and power and he has a great shot and drives the net. World juniors isn't going to showcase his game because it's all about skating all over the ice and hitting everything in sight. Gui doesn't need to run halfway down the rink to paste a guy like most of this team does. He can take two steps and send a guy flying. I saw him smash two fins in the first period. Watch what he does without the puck, watch how the opposition move the puck quickly when they see his big frame closing in on him.
Did you see him take two players out i believe on the 2nd or 3rd goal and leave his linemante all alone to get the goal. It's easier in person, but try to watch what he does off the puck for now. He's a power forward and they're not always good with the puck as they are without it.
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Post by franko on Dec 27, 2005 14:35:02 GMT -5
i'm not suprised to see a thread like this. Panic is setting in and creeping into every area of Habs life. |
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Post by habmeister on Dec 27, 2005 15:11:06 GMT -5
i'm taking a vacation from this board. waaaaaaaaaaay too bi-polar for me. or is it manic? not sure, but you get my gyst.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 27, 2005 15:28:06 GMT -5
i'm taking a vacation from this board. waaaaaaaaaaay too bi-polar for me. or is it manic? not sure, but you get my gyst. I think I'll join you on this vacation. |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Dec 27, 2005 19:24:23 GMT -5
From TSN today, Gui received some special coaching from Sutter on what he needs to do better to stay in the lineup, and RDS was reporting that he was back practicing with his original line. He may have found a way out of the doghouse, but he has to learn to bring it hard every shift to stay out as Sutter is not all that forgiving. Honestly, a solid kick in the can isn't all that bad for an 18 year old.
Chip is that solid, safe and steady guy that should put smiles on all coach's with his nice efforts. Just like the Russian exhibition game, Chip found the net near the end of the game last night which was just reward for lots of hard work.
Emelin had two helpers in Russia's first game last night against the Swedes. I did not see the game, but it looks like his puck skills on the point have really improved from last year from the exhibition game that was televised. He seems to be the go-to guy on the Russian PP on the point, and he looked okay against Canada in that exhibition blowout where his team did not look that interested at all. He still gets lots of penalties due to his physical play with an edge.
Mikus gets his debut tonight against Latvia, as Juraj will be seen to contribute lots on offense for his Slovakian team.
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Post by Cranky on Dec 27, 2005 21:17:53 GMT -5
From TSN today, Gui received some special coaching from Sutter on what he needs to do better to stay in the lineup, and RDS was reporting that he was back practicing with his original line. He may have found a way out of the doghouse, but he has to learn to bring it hard every shift to stay out as Sutter is not all that forgiving. Honestly, a solid kick in the can isn't all that bad for an 18 year old. Sutter does not fool around with second and third and fourth chances. You either work or you are benched. It not unusual for an 18 year old to fall in love with his own press clippings. Look at Crosby, he's got an A on his sweater and he thinks it stands for Assistent coach.  i'm not suprised to see a thread like this. Power Forwards usually don't turn into great players until 3-5 years in the nhl. Cam Neely, Todd Bertuzzi are two great examples. Please let's not over analyze lats for the next 5 years, let's look at his raw strength and power and he has a great shot and drives the net. World juniors isn't going to showcase his game because it's all about skating all over the ice and hitting everything in sight. Gui doesn't need to run halfway down the rink to paste a guy like most of this team does. He can take two steps and send a guy flying. I saw him smash two fins in the first period. Watch what he does without the puck, watch how the opposition move the puck quickly when they see his big frame closing in on him. Did you see him take two players out i believe on the 2nd or 3rd goal and leave his linemante all alone to get the goal. It's easier in person, but try to watch what he does off the puck for now. He's a power forward and they're not always good with the puck as they are without it. Yes, he was a physical presence, no doubt about that, and like you say, he is not as good without it. This probably stems from playing a "power forward" crunching game throughout his career and defense play taking the back burner. Unfortunatly, traveling 50 feet to crunch sobebody deep into their own zone is not what the WJC require. The WJC require a solid defensive game from it's forwards THEN a hard nosed aggressive forecheck. Chips is perfect for this kind of enviroment. A good skater with a veteran level of hockey sense and good size. On the other hand.............. An NHL team can afford to specialize. A perfect NHL line is an aggressive checker/grinder, a two way center and a sniper. One of the GREATEST "three element" lines ever assembled was Cashman-Esposito-Bucyk. Cashman was a terrific grinder and Bucyk-Esposito were the snippers/playmakers. I would be thrilled if he became Bertuzzi/Cashman/Neely power forward with a touch of Gaineny'esque defensive dandruf. Anywho....... Like I said in my opening post, this is ONE game. The previous game I saw Gui, he was a star and he played a much better all around game. Sutter will get what he wants out of Gui and in the end, this will make him a better player. In fact, Sutter would be a perfect AHL coach/task master. |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Dec 27, 2005 22:50:22 GMT -5
Anywho....... Like I said in my opening post, this is ONE game. The previous game I saw Gui, he was a star and he played a much better all around game. Sutter will get what he wants out of Gui and in the end, this will make him a better player. In fact, Sutter would be a perfect AHL coach/task master. I tend to agree with your prediction. Gui likely gets another chance with Comeau and Boyd, so you don't want to pass up playing with two 19 year olds who currently are Sutter's faves. Gui could get lots of ice time if he keeps working out there, or he could end up with one of the best seats in the house if not. I would love to see Sutter in Hamilton, but those lads really like Alberta. |
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Post by Cranky on Dec 28, 2005 23:45:33 GMT -5
Game 2.
Gui is working his way out of the dog house. Broke some bodies but also made some mistakes. Sutter is a task master from the old school and Gui is learning that pretty fast.
I like Chips skating and hockey sense. At this point, he seems to be 3rd line defensive center but he may have an offensive game that I am not aware off. Actually, since Boink is not doing anything these days, Chips could slide right in. He certainly has the size (6'3'/205 lb) for a third line checking center.
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Dec 29, 2005 0:02:20 GMT -5
Yeah, saw Gui crash some bodies, go to the net, and cycle along the boards. Baby steps with Sutter behind the bench, as even slick little Cogliano was in that dog house for some sloppy play on the PP. Tough lessons for Gui, but they will help him get better.
Chip did look good again, he is a force on the PK and along the boards. A big, smart player out there every shift.
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Post by MC Habber on Dec 29, 2005 0:24:59 GMT -5
From watching the games so far, Gui's abilities are obvious but he really hasn't been much of a factor. From all the hype, I would have expected him to be one of the best players on the team, but he hasn't been. He's given me no reason to think that he should be in the NHL this year.... or next.
Chips is very good, but doesn't look like he will be a big upgrade over anyone we've got now (no suprise there), and we could really use a big upgrade. We've got plenty of good players, but not enough great ones, and I was hoping that Latendresse would be great. He may well become great, but it's looking like we might have to wait a long time for that to happen if it does. At this point, I'm very glad he isn't playing for the Habs this year, both for the team's sake and for his own.
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Post by Habs_fan_in_LA on Dec 29, 2005 0:36:33 GMT -5
From TSN today, Gui received some special coaching from Sutter on what he needs to do better to stay in the lineup, and RDS was reporting that he was back practicing with his original line. He may have found a way out of the doghouse, but he has to learn to bring it hard every shift to stay out as Sutter is not all that forgiving. Honestly, a solid kick in the can isn't all that bad for an 18 year old. Sutter does not fool around with second and third and fourth chances. You either work or you are benched. It not unusual for an 18 year old to fall in love with his own press clippings. Look at Crosby, he's got an A on his sweater and he thinks it stands for Assistent coach. i'm not suprised to see a thread like this. Power Forwards usually don't turn into great players until 3-5 years in the nhl. Cam Neely, Todd Bertuzzi are two great examples. Please let's not over analyze lats for the next 5 years, let's look at his raw strength and power and he has a great shot and drives the net. World juniors isn't going to showcase his game because it's all about skating all over the ice and hitting everything in sight. Gui doesn't need to run halfway down the rink to paste a guy like most of this team does. He can take two steps and send a guy flying. I saw him smash two fins in the first period. Watch what he does without the puck, watch how the opposition move the puck quickly when they see his big frame closing in on him. Did you see him take two players out i believe on the 2nd or 3rd goal and leave his linemante all alone to get the goal. It's easier in person, but try to watch what he does off the puck for now. He's a power forward and they're not always good with the puck as they are without it. Yes, he was a physical presence, no doubt about that, and like you say, he is not as good without it. This probably stems from playing a "power forward" crunching game throughout his career and defense play taking the back burner. Unfortunatly, traveling 50 feet to crunch sobebody deep into their own zone is not what the WJC require. The WJC require a solid defensive game from it's forwards THEN a hard nosed aggressive forecheck. Chips is perfect for this kind of enviroment. A good skater with a veteran level of hockey sense and good size. On the other hand.............. An NHL team can afford to specialize. A perfect NHL line is an aggressive checker/grinder, a two way center and a sniper. One of the GREATEST "three element" lines ever assembled was Cashman-Esposito-Bucyk. Cashman was a terrific grinder and Bucyk-Esposito were the snippers/playmakers. I would be thrilled if he became Bertuzzi/Cashman/Neely power forward with a touch of Gaineny'esque defensive dandruf. Anywho....... Like I said in my opening post, this is ONE game. The previous game I saw Gui, he was a star and he played a much better all around game. Sutter will get what he wants out of Gui and in the end, this will make him a better player. In fact, Sutter would be a perfect AHL coach/task master. I remember Johnny Bucyk well. he toiled for the Bruins for a long time. As a trio, I remember Esposito, Cashman and Hodge as the thorn in the Hab's side more than Bucyk, but my memory isn't what it used to be. |
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Post by Cranky on Dec 29, 2005 1:03:14 GMT -5
I remember Johnny Bucyk well. he toiled for the Bruins for a long time. As a trio, I remember Esposito, Cashman and Hodge as the thorn in the Hab's side more than Bucyk, but my memory isn't what it used to be. Yup, it was Hodge. Sheesh...fading memory... Do you realize that we are talking about something that is older then most posters on this board? |
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Post by seventeen on Dec 29, 2005 2:07:29 GMT -5
Stanfield, Bucyk and (Pie) McKenzie, a pretty good second line, which we always nullified. Bucyk never really hurt us much and he wasn't a great playoff performer. Westfall and Sanderson irked me more. But this is a Gui thread, so.....yes, he's playing himself back. He's still a step behind the play, which brings up the concern from the scouts about his speed. Then again, Downie has no better acceleration and he's playing pretty well. It's all about confidence with Gui. He needs a goal.
Chips is playing ok. He still seems weak in his hands to me. A couple of times tonight, he tried to clear his zone and didn't get enough ooomph on the puck. Both times he got the puck back and then cleared it, but in the big league, you often don't get a second chance. I prescribe the rubber ball exercise. Squeeze it till your biceps hurt. If a rubber ball is not available, but a young vixen is......then get lessons from HA as to what to do.
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Post by Cranky on Dec 31, 2005 14:05:40 GMT -5
Game 3.....
Gui pkayed a little more in this game but it seems that Comrade Sutter's gulag has sealed doors. I could see a hundred othe "mistakes" that other players are making and still getting a regular shift. Right now, Gui is a power forward in a very defensive system. Only the most versatile player can play in that kind ogf system. However......if Comrade Sutter needs goals, and soon he will, then he needs to let the rhinos lose. \
In tonights game, look for Gui to start road killing dem American squirrels and batch* slapping defenseman around.
And as for Chips.....
He made a mistake* or ten in Comrade Sutter's uber defense system but so did a lot of other YOUNG PLAYERS. If Comrade Sutter is expecting the juniors to be the 1970's Russian Team, well, he is one Siberian gulag and three decades short of getting his wish.
*Please note: Mistake in Comrade Sutter's system refers anything less then the perfect play.
*Please Note 2: "Batch" slapping is not a misprint for female dog in heat. Batch slapping is coming out and putting two or more defenseman in lala land.
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Post by Bob on Dec 31, 2005 15:40:58 GMT -5
Everyone is raving about Pouliot but I don't see where he is playing any better than Latendresse. The announcers have called him the best pure goal scorer on the team. Pardon me  Pouilot is scoring at an average of .75 goals per game in his league and his highest yearly total is 29 goals. Latendresse is scoring at an average of .85 goals per game which is the same pace as Dustin Boyd. Dave Bolland is averaging almost 1 goal per game. So what makes Pouliot the "natural" and keeps Latendresse off the PP. Maybe it's all those great "checks" that Pouliot throws and that put him in the penalty box. Sometimes I think Sutter likes to show the players who is the boss, even if it comes at the expense of the team. Enough ranting. Hope Gui gets to show his stuff over the next couple of games. |
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Post by JeffR on Dec 31, 2005 20:47:26 GMT -5
41:46 minutes into the game against the USA and Gui has not seen the ice yet. Obviously not endearing himself to Sutter.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2005 21:25:39 GMT -5
Chipchura scores winner vs. US.
Hmm.
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Post by seventeen on Dec 31, 2005 21:29:39 GMT -5
I think Sutter has cast him as the spare part. Pouliot took an extremely stupid penalty and played immediately after, regardless. Lats has replaced Bertrand as the spare forward, so unless someone gets hurt, he's unlikely to see any ice time. I think he's earned that place to some extent, though I think he tends to look like he's not trying even if he is, like a lot of smoother, big guys. A few grimaces on his face and some huffs and puffs would have helped his cause. That's not to say Sutter is right at this point. If the rest of the guys were playing great, I'd agree, but some of them, like Pouliot above, aren't scoring and are taking dumb penalties. I'd replace Pouliot with Latendresse and see what happens.
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Post by duster on Jan 1, 2006 0:11:50 GMT -5
I was surprised to see Pouliot back on the ice. I was sure he was going to get benched for such a stupid penalty. The look on Sutter's face was eloquent. What does that say about Latendresse? The job of waterboy and benchwarmer is his to lose.
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Post by jkr on Jan 1, 2006 9:03:11 GMT -5
So what makes Pouliot the "natural" and keeps Latendresse off the PP. Maybe it's all those great "checks" that Pouliot throws and that put him in the penalty box. It's Pierre McGuire and his great gift for exaggeration. He's latched on to this guy so that's what we have to listen to. On the 1st Canada goal I saw Pouliot make a pass & skate across the front of the net. Then McGuire starts going on about what a great play Pouliot made. I still don't get it. |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jan 1, 2006 12:08:01 GMT -5
Pouliot does not look like a top four pick to me yet. With some of those bone headed plays and not coming close to living up to his billing, how is he not sitting more?
Too bad Gui's only ice time was in the warmup and when they sang O Canada. Hopefully he will enjoy next year's tourney more.
Nice to see Chip's GWG!! Another lunch pail effort by our Captain Canada.
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Post by Cranky on Jan 1, 2006 13:45:29 GMT -5
Too bad Gui's only ice time was in the warmup and when they sang O Canada. Hopefully he will enjoy next year's tourney more. . I think Sutter has cast him as the spare part. Pouliot took an extremely stupid penalty and played immediately after, regardless. Lats has replaced Bertrand as the spare forward, so unless someone gets hurt, he's unlikely to see any ice time. I think he's earned that place to some extent, though I think he tends to look like he's not trying even if he is, like a lot of smoother, big guys. A few grimaces on his face and some huffs and puffs would have helped his cause. That's not to say Sutter is right at this point. If the rest of the guys were playing great, I'd agree, but some of them, like Pouliot above, aren't scoring and are taking dumb penalties. I'd replace Pouliot with Latendresse and see what happens. Me thinks that Comrade Sutter should remove his head from his butt................and Lats from the gulag. His system of reward and punishment ONLY works when everyone thinks it's fair and equal. It doesn't work when a player royally screws up and is rewarded by more ice time meanwhile someone else is getting punished forever. I didn't mind the first game, clearly Lat's was ice grazing and didn't know how to contribute beyond a rhino charge, but from then on, he barely got a chance to do anything. In fact, it's now FOUR games AGO and he got NO CHANCE to do anything but warm the bench. Meanwhile, others around him are screwing up and doing stupid things amd the STILL play. THAT'S NOT FAIR. THE COACH IS PLAYING FAVORITES. Unfortunatly, no one will question Comrade as long as he is winning, but the minute he stops winning, they will turn on him. You know what, if I was Lats, I would walk up to the coach and ask why he is not playing me, if I didn't like the answer, I would call Gainey and tell him that I am upset about the unfair treatement and I am considering walking out. Depending on what he said, I would board the next plane. It's not a "team" thing to do? To bad, the coach decided that I am NOT part of the team. There is pride and honour at stake here and Lat's has nothing to lose. |
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Post by Cranky on Jan 1, 2006 13:50:37 GMT -5
So what makes Pouliot the "natural" and keeps Latendresse off the PP. Maybe it's all those great "checks" that Pouliot throws and that put him in the penalty box. It's Pierre McGuire and his great gift for exaggeration. He's latched on to this guy so that's what we have to listen to. On the 1st Canada goal I saw Pouliot make a pass & skate across the front of the net. Then McGuire starts going on about what a great play Pouliot made. I still don't get it. Because McGuire thinks that everybody who is watching the games is an idiot. I hate to tell him but there are thousands of people who know the game just as well as he does and are NOT impressed by the obvious or the mundane. Maybe he thinks we are all Laff fans who just hatched from scrambled eggs...... |
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Post by jkr on Jan 1, 2006 13:55:39 GMT -5
Too bad Gui's only ice time was in the warmup and when they sang O Canada. Hopefully he will enjoy next year's tourney more. . I think Sutter has cast him as the spare part. Pouliot took an extremely stupid penalty and played immediately after, regardless. Lats has replaced Bertrand as the spare forward, so unless someone gets hurt, he's unlikely to see any ice time. I think he's earned that place to some extent, though I think he tends to look like he's not trying even if he is, like a lot of smoother, big guys. A few grimaces on his face and some huffs and puffs would have helped his cause. That's not to say Sutter is right at this point. If the rest of the guys were playing great, I'd agree, but some of them, like Pouliot above, aren't scoring and are taking dumb penalties. I'd replace Pouliot with Latendresse and see what happens. You know what, if I was Lats, I would walk up to the coach and ask why he is not playing me, if I didn't like the answer, I would call Gainey and tell him that I am upset about the unfair treatement and I am considering walking out. Depending on what he said, I would board the next plane. It's not a "team" thing to do? To bad, the coach decided that I am NOT part of the team. There is pride and honour at stake here and Lat's has nothing to lose. I hope Latendresse is not watching Habs games right now. He would see Julien giving rookies the same kind of treatment. |
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Post by Cranky on Jan 1, 2006 13:58:03 GMT -5
Nice to see Chip's GWG!! Another lunch pail effort by our Captain Canada. I am not impressed by his skating. It's adequate but certainly not quick. He can work on that fairly easily. I'm trying to picture him as a second line NHL center. The picture is not clear yet but it's not like he has to jump over a pile of spare Ribs or the Pleks mountain to do it. All he needs is just a little more quickness, a little more sand in his jockstrap and the job is his. |
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Post by Cranky on Jan 1, 2006 14:06:21 GMT -5
I hope Latendresse is not watching Habs games right now. He would see Julien giving rookies the same kind of treatment. That's the sad part of coaching. You know what the problem is? A lot of these coaches have learned to talk from both sides of their mouths. After all, coaching Juniors and AHL is not like the real world. They can spit bullSaperlipopette and nobody holds them accountable for it. If a player starts to complain, the coach usually gets the benefit of the doubt and most certainly the GM will side with the coach. That's why a lot of them become miseravble failures when they reach the elite level. When they reach the elite level and still havn't learned how NOT to bullSaperlipopette their way and talk from both sides of their mouth, they have player tuning them out. Other then Vigneault, it seems to me that the Hab's have a succesion of rookie coaches who had/have trouble grwing up from the Juniors/AHL. |
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Post by MC Habber on Jan 1, 2006 17:35:54 GMT -5
I thought Latendresse played reasonably well in the previous game, with the limited ice time that he got, and I would have liked to see him get more. But I wasn't expecting him to get a shift yesterday. Is it too late for Sutter to try and incorporate him into the team? He could be a valuable assett. If I were Sutter I would give him a big role against Sweden/Finland and use the game to decide whether he plays much in the final.
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