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Post by skunk on Dec 4, 2007 20:42:20 GMT -5
Four of the U20 defensemen were taken after David Fischer in the 2006 draft. Three others were taken after Ryan McDonagh in the 2007 draft.  |
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Post by Habs_fan_in_LA on Dec 5, 2007 0:24:37 GMT -5
Me neither.
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Post by seventeen on Dec 5, 2007 0:37:51 GMT -5
Four of the U20 defensemen were taken after David Fischer in the 2006 draft. Three others were taken after Ryan McDonagh in the 2007 draft. Do you have a link to the line-up, Skunk? |
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Post by Skilly on Dec 5, 2007 11:35:19 GMT -5
You took the words right out of my mouth |
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Post by BadCompany on Dec 5, 2007 12:26:52 GMT -5
Do you have a link to the line-up, Skunk? Pacioretty is on the team. Fischer I can understand, by all accounts his progression at the NCAA level has been slow... but McDonagh? Ouch. That one hurts. I know the US squad has made strange decisions in the past, but by most accounts McDonagh has been playing really well this year... Oh well. |
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Post by habmeister on Dec 5, 2007 13:17:19 GMT -5
none of milan lucic, david perron or devon setoguchi made the canada team last year, and all were in the nhl less than a year later. but i did expect mcdonagh to make it from all accounts and scouts saying he was so great. haven't seen mcd, fisch play at all, but maxp is on the team so thats something to look forward to. also jon blum, a giants player.
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Post by seventeen on Dec 5, 2007 16:07:56 GMT -5
It's nice for our prospects to be on those teams, but as H & C points out, some very good NHL players never get chosen for them. Sometimes they're perceived to have a skating problem, or an attitude problem, or the selection group thinks they have better players of that type. The non selection of McDonagh raises my eyebrows.
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Post by jkr on Dec 5, 2007 19:10:51 GMT -5
Do you have a link to the line-up, Skunk? Pacioretty is on the team. Fischer I can understand, by all accounts his progression at the NCAA level has been slow... but McDonagh? Ouch. That one hurts. I know the US squad has made strange decisions in the past, Oh well. I had heard on TSN that they used to have a built in prejudice towards non NCAA players. Just because Hockey USA didn't take a certain player isn't enough to cast aspersions on Timmins' abilities, especially this early in their development stage. Not referring to you here BC.  |
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Post by skunk on Dec 5, 2007 19:24:38 GMT -5
Fischer and McDonagh both play in the NCAA, so that reason doesn't wash. What may have held them back is the fact that both played all of their high school hockey in their home town. All the players selected to the team had at least a couple years of junior or USNDTP experience, except for Pacioretty who had just one season in the USHL. The kids with junior or NTDP backgrounds play a lot more games against older, stronger, players compared to the high school league prospects.
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Post by Anardil1 on Dec 5, 2007 20:59:30 GMT -5
Leaving McDonagh off the team might make Canada's road to the championship a little smoother.  |
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Post by skunk on Dec 7, 2007 3:24:08 GMT -5
I guess it shouldn't be that much of a surprise that Fischer wasn't named to the team. It seems that Montreal was one of the few teams that rated him as a first round pick. Central Scouting had him ranked as a mid second round pick, and about the 10th best defenseman available in 2006. Some teams disliked him to the point that they would not have drafted him at all. McDonagh, on the other hand seems to have been rated around where the Habs took him, both by Central Scouting and some other NHL teams. Don't blame Fischer for where he was drafted, it wasn't his choice.
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Post by jkr on Dec 9, 2007 8:12:30 GMT -5
I guess it shouldn't be that much of a surprise that Fischer wasn't named to the team. It seems that Montreal was one of the few teams that rated him as a first round pick. Central Scouting had him ranked as a mid second round pick, and about the 10th best defenseman available in 2006. Some teams disliked him to the point that they would not have drafted him at all. McDonagh, on the other hand seems to have been rated around where the Habs took him, both by Central Scouting and some other NHL teams. Don't blame Fischer for where he was drafted, it wasn't his choice. I watched that draft. Bob McKenzie does a good job of staying neutral but expressed real surprise when the Habs did not take Bob Sanguinetti. It was an unusual reaction for him. The Rangers took Sanguinetti with the very next pick. One of the reasons I mention this is that Sanguinetti was traded in the off season to Brampton, the OHL team I follow. He's averaging well over a PPG right now. |
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Post by Habs_fan_in_LA on Dec 9, 2007 18:21:16 GMT -5
I guess it shouldn't be that much of a surprise that Fischer wasn't named to the team. It seems that Montreal was one of the few teams that rated him as a first round pick. Central Scouting had him ranked as a mid second round pick, and about the 10th best defenseman available in 2006. Some teams disliked him to the point that they would not have drafted him at all. McDonagh, on the other hand seems to have been rated around where the Habs took him, both by Central Scouting and some other NHL teams. Don't blame Fischer for where he was drafted, it wasn't his choice. I don't think we are blaming Fisher for the Canadiens selection.  |
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Post by IamCanadiens on Dec 9, 2007 20:05:56 GMT -5
none of milan lucic, david perron or devon setoguchi made the canada team last year, and all were in the nhl less than a year later. Its easy for me to see why Setoguchi wasn't chosen. I live in PG and saw him play all the time last year. He spent most of his time in front of the opposition goalie when the puck was in the Cougars end. He would wait for a turnover and then leave the zone gaining speed, straddle the blueline and wait for the homerun pass. His skill with the puck is amazing but his defensive ability and work ethic suck. With his lethal shot and amazing hands he'll survive riding shotgun for one of the best set up men in the league but I can't see it lasting unless he changes. And you're right, lots of guys who aren't suited for the international style or simply aren't chosen do v. well in the NHL |
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Post by seventeen on Dec 10, 2007 1:06:29 GMT -5
Thanks, Iam. I only saw Setoguchi play in one game and he was very good in that one, but it was a prospects game, or all-star game, where defense is not emphasized. He won't last long in the NHL without some defensive ability, unless he's such a good scorer it doesn't matter (like Brett Hull).
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Post by skunk on Dec 10, 2007 2:43:20 GMT -5
Players with pure skill, regardless of the rest of their game seem to be at a premium in the NHL these days. I guess it has to do with the tight checking, combined with more power plays, 4 on 4 overtime situations, and shootouts. A few years ago there was no way that Patrick Kane would go #1 overall.
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Post by Habfaith on Dec 17, 2007 19:05:49 GMT -5
Interesting to note as well is that Team Canada apparently agreed with Timmins and cut Esposito from the Canadian squad...
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Post by franko on Dec 17, 2007 22:11:04 GMT -5
3rd time wasn't the charm.
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Post by habmeister on Dec 18, 2007 2:48:04 GMT -5
i only saw him live at the first team canada camp, after hearing he was slated to go #1 overall less than 18 months later in the draft i watched him closely and came away very unimpressed. when a junior doesn't improve on stat totals from age 16-18 you have to really wonder if he's peaked mentally and/or physically. like i said post draft, huge bust potential. maxpac looks like a stud compared to angelo right now.
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Post by Gogie on Jan 5, 2008 20:14:45 GMT -5
...The non selection of McDonagh raises my eyebrows. Leaving McDonagh off the team might make Canada's road to the championship a little smoother. Don't know if anyone else noticed, but late in the Canada-US game yesterday the TSN crew (I believe it was McKenzie) commented that the US was probably regretting leaving McDonagh off the team . |
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Post by habmeister on Jan 5, 2008 20:20:12 GMT -5
...The non selection of McDonagh raises my eyebrows. Leaving McDonagh off the team might make Canada's road to the championship a little smoother. Don't know if anyone else noticed, but late in the Canada-US game yesterday the TSN crew (I believe it was McKenzie) commented that the US was probably regretting leaving McDonagh off the team . it was gord miller, not sure how much gord knows about mcdonagh, but for a 12th overall pick that can skate and has high skill you have to wonder. blum was chosen too, which was surprising since they usually discriminate against the americans that choose major junior. grain of salt, lucic, setoguchi, perron were all left off the team and all are in the nhl less than a year later. |
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Post by seventeen on Jan 6, 2008 2:43:54 GMT -5
I listened to a juniour hockey program on the radio while in Kamloops before the WJC. The guy being interviewed (a reporter, I think) said that one of the big surprises of guys not being picked was this OHL goalie who was #1 in the OHL (I can't recall the name). Instead, the US picks Jeremy Smith who could have been voted Sieve of the Tournament. The US really should be doing better, but I seriously think the people they have choosing the team, could be overhauled. I saw Smith at the Mem cup last year playing for Plymouth and he was resoundingly unimpressive. Not the kind of guy to instill confidence. He proved it in the WJC.
Leaving McDonagh off the team as well, confirmed my opinion of the people choosing the lineup.
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