Time to retire sweaters

[Strummerman]

I know we have discussed this ad infinitum but I think Red Fisher is right about this one. After watching Cam Neely's number 8 retired, a heck of a player but no Stanley Cups, why are the following numbers not retired with the Habs.

Bob Gainey time to move on this one before it's too late.

1) Number 12- Dickie Moore, Yvan Cournoyer- 16 Stanley Cups between them- Dickie Moore held the record for most points in the regular season until Bobby Hull broke it. Yvan 10 Stanley Cups case closed. Retire the damn numbers before a Serge Boisvert clone gets a hold of it.

2) Number 29- Ken Dryden- 6 Stanley Cups in 8 years- Conn Smythe Calder Vezinas by the bushel- are you kidding me? And the tarnish that number has received Gaston Gingras Gino Odjick sickening.

3) Number 19- Larry Robinson- 6 Stanley Cups played 20 years made the playoffs 20 years, tied with bobby orr for the best +- ever, Norris Conn Smythe- are you kidding me- and when they retire it bring back Terry Harper who had that number before Larry and won 5 Cups as a hab

4) Number 5-18- Guy Lapointe Serge Savard- The other troika of the Big 3- they all deserve to have their numbers retired-

5) Number 23- Bob Gainey- a big maybe- created a defensive forward mold like Orr created an offensive defenceman

Patrick Roy wait in line

[CentreHice]

Glad to hear the name Terry Harper in there, even though #19 belongs to Robinson.

Bobby Hull said, "I could never get by that Harper in Montreal." One of the steadiest d-men ever.

By the way, let's not forget (way down the waiting list though they may be) J.C. Tremblay and Jacques Laperriere...#1 and #2 in the 60's. My fondest memory of Tremblay: second period of Game 7 vs. Boston in the 71 quarter-finals. He put the Habs up 3-1.....then Lemaire stole the puck from Bobby Orr early in the third, and he and the Big M went in alone on Cheevers....4-1 and rookie Dryden did the rest. BTW, why isn't Tremblay in the Hall of Fame alongside Laperriere?

And what about oak tree Ted Harris? We've had some awesome d-men over the years.

From goaltending, to defense, to forwards, the dynasties of the 50's, 60's, and 70's were things of beauty.

Sorry for the long post, but I have to share this story.
When I was an elementary school teacher in 1988, I played ball hockey with a very competitive group of teachers...one of them was Tom Cassidy, a 2nd round draft pick (#22 overall) of the Seals in 1972. His NHL career was made up of only 26 games with the Pittsburgh Penguins in 1977-78 (the year the Habs lost only 10 games..also the year Lanny McDonald's OT winner over the Isles put the Leafs in the final 4. One of the greatest Leaf moments...only to be dashed by the Habs in 4 straight).

Back to Tom Cassidy....he said playing the Habs left your head spinning. He told me he carried the puck into the Montreal zone, was poke-checked by Robinson, and by the time he had made the turn to start backchecking, Larry had already headmanned the puck, and Lafleur, Shutt, and Lemaire were in the Pens zone and had scored before Tom reached the centre line. He said, "How can you defend against that?"

[Strummerman]

CentreHice said:

Glad to hear the name Terry Harper in there, even though #19 belongs to Robinson.

Bobby Hull said, "I could never get by that Harper in Montreal." One of the steadiest d-men ever.

By the way, let's not forget (way down the waiting list though they may be) J.C. Tremblay and Jacques Laperriere...#1 and #2 in the 60's. My fondest memory of Tremblay: second period of Game 7 vs. Boston in the 71 quarter-finals. He put the Habs up 3-1.....then Lemaire stole the puck from Bobby Orr early in the third, and he and the Big M went in alone on Cheevers....4-1 and rookie Dryden did the rest. BTW, why isn't Tremblay in the Hall of Fame alongside Laperriere?

And what about oak tree Ted Harris? We've had some awesome d-men over the years.

From goaltending, to defense, to forwards, the dynasties of the 50's, 60's, and 70's were things of beauty.

Sorry for the long post, but I have to share this story.
When I was an elementary school teacher in 1988, I played ball hockey with a very competitive group of teachers...one of them was Tom Cassidy, a 2nd round draft pick (#22 overall) of the Seals in 1972. His NHL career was made up of only 26 games with the Pittsburgh Penguins in 1977-78 (the year the Habs lost only 10 games..also the year Lanny McDonald's OT winner over the Isles put the Leafs in the final 4. One of the greatest Leaf moments...only to be dashed by the Habs in 4 straight).

Back to Tom Cassidy....he said playing the Habs left your head spinning. He told me he carried the puck into the Montreal zone, was poke-checked by Robinson, and by the time he had made the turn to start backchecking, Larry had already headmanned the puck, and Lafleur, Shutt, and Lemaire were in the Pens zone and had scored before Tom reached the centre line. He said, "How can you defend against that?"

Ok some comments.I only mentioned Harper cause I felt he should be recognized for his years of service with the Habs whenever Robsinson's number is retired. Five cups is no slouch. Terry Harper and Ted Harris were steady D men but I think only the very great players should have their sweaters retired. Harris and Harper were not in that league. As for JC Tremblay his skills were very underrated when he was with the Habs. But Tremblay was sometimes benched and sometimes the habs 5th DMan. Certainly not a candidate for sweater retirement. Tremblay was able to display his offensive skills more with the Nordiques in the WHA. His number probably should have been retired by the Nords. Laperierre came close to a great DMAn but his lack of offensive skills sort of make him a one dimensional defensive Dman. Robinson Lapointe Savard were offensive and defensive standouts.

You make a great point as to how great Lafleur Shutt Lemaire or Peter M were. Time tends to let memories fade and we forget how incredible these guys really were. The Habs record of the late seventies stands on its own. There is nothing tougher than keeoping a dynasty going in the modern era but the 70's Habs were that good.

[Skilly]

I am against retiring jersey numbers .... but I will admit to one thing. If Cam Neely, and that first fool in Edmonton ... Al Hamilton get their jerseys retired then there are alot of Habs that should too.

Being a Hab fan it kills me to say this but this is the one thing the Leafs got right. They don't retire numbers they honour them. They only have #5 and #6 retired .... then post 1960 they started to honour them. That's why #27 (Sittler) can still be worn.

If the Habs start to retire everyone that deserves to be retired ....well someone will have to wear pi on their backs because their aren't that many numbers to go around.

# 1 Jacques Plante
# 2 Doug Harvey
# 4 Aurele Joliat
# 4 Jean Beliveau
# 7 Howie Morenz
# 9 Maurice Richard
#10 Guy Lafleur
#16 Elmer Lach
#16 Henri Richard
#99

All these are currently retired in Montreal.

Now you want to retire #12, #18,#19, #23, #29
#33 is obviously going to go ...... what about Carbo #21? Shutt #22?

So out of 99 numbers the Habs wouldn't be able to wear 16 of them. I mean if Theo becomes as good as we hope then the high numbers will start to go too.

If we go by Cups alone ..... we'd get down to the Mario Tremblay's. I say stop retire the numbers and honour them.

[Strummerman]

Skilly said:

I am against retiring jersey numbers .... but I will admit to one thing. If Cam Neely, and that first fool in Edmonton ... Al Hamilton get their jerseys retired then there are alot of Habs that should too.

Being a Hab fan it kills me to say this but this is the one thing the Leafs got right. They don't retire numbers they honour them. They only have #5 and #6 retired .... then post 1960 they started to honour them. That's why #27 (Sittler) can still be worn.

If the Habs start to retire everyone that deserves to be retired ....well someone will have to wear pi on their backs because their aren't that many numbers to go around.

# 1 Jacques Plante
# 2 Doug Harvey
# 4 Aurele Joliat
# 4 Jean Beliveau
# 7 Howie Morenz
# 9 Maurice Richard
#10 Guy Lafleur
#16 Elmer Lach
#16 Henri Richard
#99

All these are currently retired in Montreal.

Now you want to retire #12, #18,#19, #23, #29
#33 is obviously going to go ...... what about Carbo #21? Shutt #22?

So out of 99 numbers the Habs wouldn't be able to wear 16 of them. I mean if Theo becomes as good as we hope then the high numbers will start to go too.

If we go by Cups alone ..... we'd get down to the Mario Tremblay's. I say stop retire the numbers and honour them.

umm the way things are going not many more numbers will be retired in a while. I dont agree with what you said about the Leafs. I think greatness should be rewarded. I think Al Hamilton and Yvon Labre are the exception. I hope your not comparing these 2 to any of the Habs I have mentioned. I think 27 should have been retired more for Frank Mahovlich for the Leafs who won 4 Stanley Cups then Darryl Sittler. But frankly 27 should not be worn by another Leaf. It is insulting. Sweater retirement is a sign of respect and a reward for greatness. Steve Shutt is a tough call as is Bob Gainey. Carbo was an exceptional hockey player but not in the elite group that was Larry Robinson etc. Carbo did not have the Cups or was an innovator as most of the players I have mentioned. Anyways remember 22 was worn by John Ferguson before Shutt so the Left wingers maybe should have their night. As for running out of numbers that is laughable- Beliveau once said he wanted his number used. I would say this if anyone has his number retired and then asks for it to be put back in circulation, then the team should acquiesce. I doubt Dryden would have agreed to let Gaston Gingras or Gino Odjick wear his number.

* footnote if Number 5 is retired should be for Boom Boom Geoffrion and Guy lapointe