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Post by franko on Nov 9, 2016 11:56:05 GMT -5
you can say many things about "the Donald" (and many people are) and you can call him many things (and many people are) but you cannot call him an idiot (even though many people are). he read the mood of the nation right and he tapped into great discontent.
now we'll see if he can build bridges or not.
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Post by Cranky on Nov 9, 2016 15:47:37 GMT -5
I could go on a long diatribe about how the elitist hubris of the Democratic Party made this possible – and indeed, I’ve tried to write it a couple of times already – but I just can’t. I just feel sick to my stomach. The last time I felt this bad… or anywhere close to this bad, because this is actually worse… was when Dubya invaded Iraq. I correctly predicted at the time the quagmire and long-lasting effects that decision would have, saying something like it would take at least three generations to fix and that it will get a lot worse before it even starts to get better. Called it the worst foreign policy decision since Chamberlin’s “peace in our time” deal with Hitler. I was right on that one. And I think this is going to be worse. Perhaps much worse. Republican hubris let Trumpy through the door and Democratic hubris made him president. Clinton was disliked and the Democrats knew it. Yet they arrogantly chose to foist Clinton on America. Unlike the Republicans, thier process gave them more control, yet, it was "Clintons turn". Americans character dosn't like elites, nor told what to do at the best of times, yet..... Then there were all those elitist mumblings like "you have to pass it to read it" and "those people cling to their guns and religion" struck raw nerves. Both implied that Joe average was too stupid compared to the special people in power. Obama skated by but it was not going to fly with another elitist insider foisted on them. Don't forget that it was far more people who voted AGAINST Clinton then voted for Trump. Some polls had as much as 60% voting against Clinton. Trust me, you may dislike it but it means much more to me. I have a lot at stake right now and it all based on accessing the US market. Clinton and the "same old same old" benefited my wallet far, far more then the satisfaction of the "fu" Americans gave to elitist and politicians. Well....here we are.... (BTW...we crossed swords back at the Iraq war. I supported it and it was from pure hatred from having my head busted and bullet fragment in my leg from rioting against the junta dictatorship. You were opposed and ultimatly were right that it became a quagmire.) |
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Post by Cranky on Nov 9, 2016 16:07:42 GMT -5
you can say many things about "the Donald" (and many people are) and you can call him many things (and many people are) but you cannot call him an idiot (even though many people are). he read the mood of the nation right and he tapped into great discontent. now we'll see if he can build bridges or not. Even now, after Trump won, the leftist media preffer to call Trump voters as "uneducated hicks voting for their own" then face the true reasons why. They are still in shock of why people didn't vote for...."our Hillary". I have a suggestion for them and all their talking head twaddle, they need to cling to real big rocks because not only have Republicans and the right won every rein of power, their Supreme court is going to go even further right. |
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Post by Cranky on Nov 9, 2016 16:55:41 GMT -5
Obama said today.....TODAY...after the election results...direct quote...."we try really hard to persuade people that WE'RE right, then people vote".
"WE are right", WE, not you. WE try to pursuade YOU that WE know better and what is good for you. WE, the self declared brilliant and special people. And then you go and vote.
Even after the baseball bat in the head message delivered, it still hasn't sunk in. And probably never will.
Oh well, Hello President Trump.....
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Nov 9, 2016 18:34:17 GMT -5
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Post by blny on Nov 9, 2016 19:13:44 GMT -5
He also got the Black and Hispanic vote....what does that tell ya. They interviewed a black trump supporter at one of the rallies last night and he said "No Black man is going to vote for a white woman." Cubans have always had strong Republican ties. Anything remotely left triggers anti communist thoughts I guess. Puerto Ricans typically vote left. The amount he won Florida by was a back breaker. Clinton gets half the people that voted for Johnson, and she wins the state. That in itself doesn't make up the difference, but it might have swayed last minute voters in some states. The notion that this was about sweeping out the Washington elite is pretty spot on. It's a really big part of it. Trump clearly struck a chord with people by blaming their lot in life on the establishment in DC. Politicians, reporters, the lot; he pointed the finger and the ate it up. He's got as clear a road as he's going to get. Republicans won the senate and the house last night as well. While he's no friend to many GOPs, they're less likely to stop him. Of course, he doesn't take the oath of office for a bit. There's still the matters of his two pending trials. What happens if he's convicted in one of those? Impeachment, and a new election? |
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Post by Habs_fan_in_LA on Nov 9, 2016 19:21:48 GMT -5
He captured the white hill billy vote. The uneducated came out in droves. He got that white vote that guys like Romney never could get to come out. It's not just that though. He gained with white, college educated, women too. In a number of states, he gained significant percentage points. He captured those that think the Washington DC establishment need change - even though the GOP will win the house and the senate is 50/50. He made visits this week to Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania. He's ahead in Wisconsin and Michigan. His last minute trips had huge turnouts. I think the Democratic party underestimated how much people dislike Hillary and the Clinton family. There may be some who voted against her because she's a woman, but I don't believe that was the driving factor. I think it was about disliking her as a person. I saw a graphic on NBC, which made a point to discuss the percentage of people who voted for third parties. Johnson and Klein got twice as many votes as they did in 2012. In 2012, those third parties got a combined 4% of the total vote. Tonight, they got 9%. That was perhaps no more apparent than in Florida. Trump cleaned up in the rural areas, which would be expected. Enough of the urban vote was swayed away from Clinton that it cost her the state. At one point Trump had a lead in total votes of about 116,000. Johnson, at that point, had more than 240,000 votes cast for him in Florida. If Clinton gets just half of those votes, she eeks out Florida and its 29 EC votes. CBC was live in Cleveland tonight, early in the evening. The school they were that was a voting station was all but empty. It appeared the only people there were elections officials. That was a bad, and early, sign. Ohio rural areas typically lean red, while Cleveland, Cincy, and Columbus go blue. He won by almost 10 points there. That's a virtual landslide in a state that every President has won on election night over the last 100 plus years. You don't win the election if you don't win that state. Dow is now down 840 points. Almost 5%. He captured the white hill hilly vote is insensitive and offensive. I will not say that Hillary captured the black unemployed black vote. The people you called uneducated are the ones I call middle class plumbers and pipe fitters. The Dow is not down its up. He understands business. He fights hard to win. He will be good for America. I am more concerned about helping the homeless in the US than about the ones in Mexico or Syria. I am more concerned with the worlds overpopulation than a one degree rise in temperature by the year 2200. Over population is a bigger contributor to climate change than carbon emission from the closed rust belt factories. Terrorism is at an all time high in Europe, the Middle East and soon America. Obamacare is the biggest lie to theAmerican people, it's cost, keeping your own doctors, the disastrous rollout, the cost of premiums, copay and subsidies. Abandoning Iraq and Afghanistan was a disastrous blunder. The line in the sand with Syria was embarrassing. Obama spent our money like a drunken sailor and created debt our children will have to repay. Obama was the worst president in history. He was a racist who subsidized black students, black job seekers and black rioters and looters. Middle America is pissed and they showed up at the polls. Disrespect for law and order, disrespect for police, torching the cities in unacceptable. Hillary is despised, not by sexist men, but by everyone. She outspent and out lied Trump by a wide margin. The people didn't out vote him. Trump did it without help from Obama, the political machines, athletes, movie stars or the press. He relied on the people and the voters came through. Trump is a winner, a leader and the next four years will be successful. |
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Post by blny on Nov 9, 2016 19:27:31 GMT -5
Little more than 50% of eligible voters voted. I believe the break down was 25.6% Trump, 25.5% Clinton, and 1.7% Johnson. Florida had Trump ahead by about 116000 votes. Johnson got 248k in Florida alone. If Clinton were able to get half of those votes she wins Florida. I don't know how many of those Johnson votes might have been Sanders supporters. My gut says very few. Jill Stein is just a loon, so they didn't go that way. Sadly, I think some may have stayed away.
Trump made strategic visits to the rust belt the day before the election. Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylivania. He won all three. Clinton hadn't been to Wisconsin since the primaries. She thought she had done enough there. She thought the urban vote in Detroit would be enough, but the chart showed that even counties adjacent to Wayne County went red. Trump cleaned up in Ohio, winning by 9 points. That's a huge margin for that state.
Some have tried to say that this was a vote against women. I don't believe that. I believe that Hillary misjudged how much disdain there was for her and her last name. Trump rallied that disdain.
Of note, I saw a map of the US today that showed voter trends for the 18-25 demographic. IIRC, Trump won less than 5 states for that demo. While it's not uncommon for youth to vote left, Clinton dominated even in the rural states. Trump got their parents' votes.
"#Michelle2020" was trending this morning. I have no idea if Michelle Obama intends to run. She's certainly savvy enough. She's a much better speaker than Hillary. I think she could win the nomination pretty easily if she went for it. The US will have a female President before long. I just never was the one to be first.
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Post by blny on Nov 9, 2016 19:30:36 GMT -5
]He captured the white hill hilly vote is insensitive and offensive. I will not say that Hillary captured the black unemployed black vote. The people you called uneducated are the ones I call middle class plumbers and pipe fitters. The Dow is not down its up. He understands business. He fights hard to win. He will be good for America. I am more concerned about helping the homeless in the US than about the ones in Mexico or Syria. I am more concerned with the worlds overpopulation than a one degree rise in temperature by the year 2200. Over population is a bigger contributor to climate change than carbon emission from the closed rust belt factories. Terrorism is at an all time high in Europe, the Middle East and soon America. Obamacare is the biggest lie to theAmerican people, it's cost, keeping your own doctors, the disastrous rollout, the cost of premiums, copay and subsidies. Abandoning Iraq and Afghanistan was a disastrous blunder. The line in the sand with Syria was embarrassing. Obama spent our money like a drunken sailor and created debt our children will have to repay. Obama was the worst president in history. He was a racist who subsidized black students, black job seekers and black rioters and looters. Middle America is pissed and they showed up at the polls. Disrespect for law and order, disrespect for police, torching the cities in unacceptable. Hillary is despised, not by sexist men, but by everyone. She outspent and out lied Trump by a wide margin. The people didn't out vote him. Trump did it without help from Obama, the political machines, athletes, movie stars or the press. He relied on the people and the voters came through. Trump is a winner, a leader and the next four years will be successful. Dow futures was down last night and this morning. I apologize for not putting 'future' in there. If you think hill billy and n***** are equal, we've nothing more to talk about. I stopped reading your post at that point. |
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Nov 9, 2016 19:53:48 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2016 20:51:13 GMT -5
]He captured the white hill hilly vote is insensitive and offensive. I will not say that Hillary captured the black unemployed black vote. The people you called uneducated are the ones I call middle class plumbers and pipe fitters. The Dow is not down its up. He understands business. He fights hard to win. He will be good for America. I am more concerned about helping the homeless in the US than about the ones in Mexico or Syria. I am more concerned with the worlds overpopulation than a one degree rise in temperature by the year 2200. Over population is a bigger contributor to climate change than carbon emission from the closed rust belt factories. Terrorism is at an all time high in Europe, the Middle East and soon America. Obamacare is the biggest lie to theAmerican people, it's cost, keeping your own doctors, the disastrous rollout, the cost of premiums, copay and subsidies. Abandoning Iraq and Afghanistan was a disastrous blunder. The line in the sand with Syria was embarrassing. Obama spent our money like a drunken sailor and created debt our children will have to repay. Obama was the worst president in history. He was a racist who subsidized black students, black job seekers and black rioters and looters. Middle America is pissed and they showed up at the polls. Disrespect for law and order, disrespect for police, torching the cities in unacceptable. Hillary is despised, not by sexist men, but by everyone. She outspent and out lied Trump by a wide margin. The people didn't out vote him. Trump did it without help from Obama, the political machines, athletes, movie stars or the press. He relied on the people and the voters came through. Trump is a winner, a leader and the next four years will be successful. Dow futures was down last night and this morning. I apologize for not putting 'future' in there. If you think hill billy and n***** are equal, we've nothing more to talk about. I stopped reading your post at that point. I made it all the way to Hilary out lied Trump, but couldn't get passed the "by a wide margin". #BlameObama |
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Post by PTH on Nov 9, 2016 21:12:45 GMT -5
I don't like Trump the conceited arrogant person but I do like his policies and leadership. Which policies ? He changes his mind repeatedly and lies about having changed his mind. Which version of the truth is the right one ? Actually, he just subconcontracts his brand; most Trump-named buildings aren't actually run by him in any way, shape or form. Well, he'd be richer if he'd just invested in the S&P500, so he's a below average businessman, so he's got low returns and given his multiple bankrupcies, he's clearly high-risk as well. You'd rather a guy accused of sexual abuse by a dozen women as well as child rape to the wife of someone not being charged ? Only it's not hockey, it's governance, and if they can recognize that their own party's leadership is bad for the country, voting the other way is the right thing to do. Letting people off the hook for bad things they allow to happen because "I was just doing my job" is a great way to get to Auschwitz. The context is completely different, here we're getting the most vetted, most inspected refugees from the middle east. Europe is getting the rest and they're the ones with the raw deal. We will always have someone, somewhere that could use help. But is it better to help that last homeless guy, or help 1000 children who will die otherwise ? Because that's what it comes down to. |
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Post by Cranky on Nov 9, 2016 22:21:48 GMT -5
Tomorrow is another day...and another meeting with city officials and politicians. Pretty soon I'm going to swap my jeans and Carhartt for a blue suit and red tie.....  Do you want to know where tax dollars are going? Tag along and listen to their glowing rhetoric about "green initiatives", code words for subsidizing un-economically viable projects. The upside is that they ALL know that their are not viable and need tax or rate payer dollars, the downside is they don't care. This is about 30 politicians that I've met this year. Not because I care to meet them but because it just happened based on business issues/needs/projects. What almost all established Western politicians had in common was their belief that they are the carriers of truth and whatever they did, it was based on the "greater good for the community". Not once did any of them talk seriously about manufacturing jobs unless it was in context of fantasy "green jobs" or about them spending more taxes. Their common denominator was that there is always tax money to be had and spending it was Gods work. In some cases, Green Gods work. On the other hand, the ex-Soviet block politicians cared about was....manufacturing JOBS. Maybe this changes now.......but probably not. |
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Post by Cranky on Nov 9, 2016 22:37:17 GMT -5
He also got the Black and Hispanic vote....what does that tell ya. They interviewed a black trump supporter at one of the rallies last night and he said "No Black man is going to vote for a white woman." Cubans have always had strong Republican ties. Anything remotely left triggers anti communist thoughts I guess. Puerto Ricans typically vote left. The amount he won Florida by was a back breaker. Clinton gets half the people that voted for Johnson, and she wins the state. That in itself doesn't make up the difference, but it might have swayed last minute voters in some states. The notion that this was about sweeping out the Washington elite is pretty spot on. It's a really big part of it. Trump clearly struck a chord with people by blaming their lot in life on the establishment in DC. Politicians, reporters, the lot; he pointed the finger and the ate it up. He's got as clear a road as he's going to get. Republicans won the senate and the house last night as well. While he's no friend to many GOPs, they're less likely to stop him. Of course, he doesn't take the oath of office for a bit. There's still the matters of his two pending trials. What happens if he's convicted in one of those? Impeachment, and a new election? Republicans control Congress, so impeachment is out of the question. New election is out of the question too. On the other hand, Clinton was going to spend the next four years fighting impeachment on High Crimes and Misdemeanors based on her mishandling top secret content of those e-mails. Regardless, she is probably going to face charges that is going to occupy news headlines for a while. The Democrats lost more then the Presidential election, they lost all power to do pretty much anything but shout. They also lost the Supreme Court for a generation or two. |
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Nov 10, 2016 8:34:22 GMT -5
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Post by frozone on Nov 10, 2016 9:55:34 GMT -5
He captured the white hill billy vote. The uneducated came out in droves. He got that white vote that guys like Romney never could get to come out. It's not just that though. He gained with white, college educated, women too. In a number of states, he gained significant percentage points. He captured those that think the Washington DC establishment need change - even though the GOP will win the house and the senate is 50/50. He made visits this week to Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania. He's ahead in Wisconsin and Michigan. His last minute trips had huge turnouts. I think the Democratic party underestimated how much people dislike Hillary and the Clinton family. There may be some who voted against her because she's a woman, but I don't believe that was the driving factor. I think it was about disliking her as a person. I saw a graphic on NBC, which made a point to discuss the percentage of people who voted for third parties. Johnson and Klein got twice as many votes as they did in 2012. In 2012, those third parties got a combined 4% of the total vote. Tonight, they got 9%. That was perhaps no more apparent than in Florida. Trump cleaned up in the rural areas, which would be expected. Enough of the urban vote was swayed away from Clinton that it cost her the state. At one point Trump had a lead in total votes of about 116,000. Johnson, at that point, had more than 240,000 votes cast for him in Florida. If Clinton gets just half of those votes, she eeks out Florida and its 29 EC votes. CBC was live in Cleveland tonight, early in the evening. The school they were that was a voting station was all but empty. It appeared the only people there were elections officials. That was a bad, and early, sign. Ohio rural areas typically lean red, while Cleveland, Cincy, and Columbus go blue. He won by almost 10 points there. That's a virtual landslide in a state that every President has won on election night over the last 100 plus years. You don't win the election if you don't win that state. Dow is now down 840 points. Almost 5%. He captured the white hill hilly vote is insensitive and offensive. I will not say that Hillary captured the black unemployed black vote. The people you called uneducated are the ones I call middle class plumbers and pipe fitters. The Dow is not down its up. He understands business. He fights hard to win. He will be good for America. I am more concerned about helping the homeless in the US than about the ones in Mexico or Syria. I am more concerned with the worlds overpopulation than a one degree rise in temperature by the year 2200. Over population is a bigger contributor to climate change than carbon emission from the closed rust belt factories. Terrorism is at an all time high in Europe, the Middle East and soon America. Obamacare is the biggest lie to theAmerican people, it's cost, keeping your own doctors, the disastrous rollout, the cost of premiums, copay and subsidies. Abandoning Iraq and Afghanistan was a disastrous blunder. The line in the sand with Syria was embarrassing. Obama spent our money like a drunken sailor and created debt our children will have to repay. Obama was the worst president in history. He was a racist who subsidized black students, black job seekers and black rioters and looters. Middle America is pissed and they showed up at the polls. Disrespect for law and order, disrespect for police, torching the cities in unacceptable.Hillary is despised, not by sexist men, but by everyone. She outspent and out lied Trump by a wide margin. The people didn't out vote him. Trump did it without help from Obama, the political machines, athletes, movie stars or the press. He relied on the people and the voters came through. Trump is a winner, a leader and the next four years will be successful. You're entitled to your opinion, but much of what you wrote sounds as though you believe it to be fact. So I need to ask, where do you get this information? Where does one learn all this and come to believe so strongly in it? But more importantly... If you find the "hill billy vote" comment to be offensive, do you not see anything offensive about your post? Minorities frequent these boards too and I can tell you for sure that many would take exception to your post. |
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Post by Willie Dog on Nov 10, 2016 11:10:18 GMT -5
The issue I have with this article is the guy is a hypocrite... He makes generalizations about people who voted for Trump... the same way Trump made generalizations about Muslims, Immigrants etc. He berates people who voted for Trump as uneducated... Yet when I was in Lake Placid, I was speaking with a guy who was driving a new Ferrari 458 spyder and he had a Trump license plate surround on his car... He was not uneducated. Now this is a one off since I never spoke with any other Trump supports but what I did see when I was there, and in Pennsylvania a month before, was plenty of Trump/Pence signs... I only saw 1 Hillary sign. Unfortunately the media is no longer interested in the absolute truth... The media of the Vietnam war is long gone and it is controlled by special interest and by sensationalism. I take what they write with a grain of salt and try to get information from as many sources as possible. I personally like BBC news. |
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Post by franko on Nov 10, 2016 11:28:52 GMT -5
But more importantly... If you find the "hill billy vote" comment to be offensive, do you not see anything offensive about your post? Minorities frequent these boards too and I can tell you for sure that many would take exception to your post. I'm hoping that the rhetoric from both sides dies down quickly. if you voted Trump you haven't a brain in your head and if you voted Hillary you're one of the elites? grates on me. no every Trumpite is a misogynist and not every Clintonite is a dastardly socialist. I know it's going to take time for the bridges to be started but the sooner the better. |
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Nov 10, 2016 12:03:24 GMT -5
The issue I have with this article is the guy is a hypocrite... He makes generalizations about people who voted for Trump... the same way Trump made generalizations about Muslims, Immigrants etc. He berates people who voted for Trump as uneducated... Yet when I was in Lake Placid, I was speaking with a guy who was driving a new Ferrari 458 spyder and he had a Trump license plate surround on his car... He was not uneducated. Now this is a one off since I never spoke with any other Trump supports but what I did see when I was there, and in Pennsylvania a month before, was plenty of Trump/Pence signs... I only saw 1 Hillary sign. Unfortunately the media is no longer interested in the absolute truth... The media of the Vietnam war is long gone and it is controlled by special interest and by sensationalism. I take what they write with a grain of salt and try to get information from as many sources as possible. I personally like BBC news. Good post, buds ... it's important to understand that the media rarely pursues the truth ... they pursue the story ... and sometimes they manufacture the story for you ... Cheers. |
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Post by clear observer on Nov 10, 2016 13:27:38 GMT -5
I could go on a long diatribe about how the elitist hubris of the Democratic Party made this possible – and indeed, I’ve tried to write it a couple of times already – but I just can’t. I just feel sick to my stomach. The last time I felt this bad… or anywhere close to this bad, because this is actually worse… was when Dubya invaded Iraq. I correctly predicted at the time the quagmire and long-lasting effects that decision would have, saying something like it would take at least three generations to fix and that it will get a lot worse before it even starts to get better. Called it the worst foreign policy decision since Chamberlin’s “peace in our time” deal with Hitler. I was right on that one. And I think this is going to be worse. Perhaps much worse. This. I'm THOROUGHLY disgusted. Ironically enough, as Trump tweeted, The Electoral College (system) is a disaster for a democracy. THOROUGHLY disgusted. |
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Post by clear observer on Nov 10, 2016 13:34:06 GMT -5
Don't forget that it was far more people who voted AGAINST Clinton then voted for Trump. Let's also not forget who got the MOST votes. Period. |
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Post by Willie Dog on Nov 10, 2016 16:07:18 GMT -5
Heard on the radio that a greater number of educated white males voted for Trump than previously thought. Also in the last few weeks of the election the Democratic bigwigs... Obama, Biden, Bill Clinton etc were repeating over and over that people need to get out and vote.... Hillary lost because not enough Democrats came out to vote as opposed to a surge for Donald. Less blacks voted in this election than in 2012 so the Democrats did not get their message across.
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Post by seventeen on Nov 10, 2016 17:27:38 GMT -5
(BTW...we crossed swords back at the Iraq war. I supported it and it was from pure hatred from having my head busted and bullet fragment in my leg from rioting against the junta dictatorship. You were opposed and ultimatly were right that it became a quagmire.) Now that sounds like an interesting story over scotch and beer. |
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Post by seventeen on Nov 10, 2016 17:58:55 GMT -5
The Dow is not down its up. Yes it is. But the overall market barely moved today. The big winners? Drug and pharmaceutical companies. Why? Because a lot of money will be going from your pocket to theirs when Trump eliminates Obamacare. Hey, I own a health fund so I'm not annoyed and I live in Canada so it won't affect me much, but I understand the mechanics of drug stocks going up. I am more concerned about helping the homeless in the US than about the ones in Mexico or Syria. Obviously mutually exclusive goals. I am more concerned with the worlds overpopulation than a one degree rise in temperature by the year 2200. Over population is a bigger contributor to climate change than carbon emission from the closed rust belt factories. Have no fear. The rise in temperature (projected to be much more than one degree btw) and carbon emission will look after the population explosion. It might be indiscriminate as to who is eliminated though. Better move to higher ground. Terrorism is at an all time high in Europe, the Middle East and soon America. Is it? Haven't seen any actual data to that effect. Perhaps you're counting those guys with AK47's in the US running around shooting kids and others. I'd say it's more likely the terrorists have got you exactly where they want you...terrorized. [ Obamacare is the biggest lie to theAmerican people, it's cost, keeping your own doctors, the disastrous rollout, the cost of premiums, copay and subsidies. See Dow and drug companies above. I think Insurance companies stock have gone up a whole bunch in the last two days too. Wonder why that is? Money out of your pocket into theirs. That's the bottom line. Obama spent our money like a drunken sailor and created debt our children will have to repay. This is why poor decisions are made. Acting on incorrect information. Obama took over January 2009. Ever hear of Dubbya? How about Goldman Sachs? The financial crisis of that time rests on their shoulders. Maybe not Dubbya so much. It was a government policy of both Dems and Republicans that everyone should own a home, so they made it easier to do so and the vultures in the Investment Banking business took advantage of it. Saw a tweet earlier today. Eight years after, the actual state of the economy is hugely superior to when he took over. Here are the facts: Trump is a winner, a leader and the next four years will be successful. So he keeps telling us. He's so smart right? In one of the few tax returns that became public, he lost $1B in one year. That's an amazing achievement. It's really hard to do, but Donnie managed it. I'd love to see a list of his assets and his liabilities. Then I can do the math myself. He's a con man HFLA, and it looks like he's pulled off the greatest con in history. And as an outside observer, I'll predict that in 20 years, Obama will be looked upon as one of the 5 greatest presidents ever. Thats dependent of course, on the US not being a dictatorship. The real loser in this sordid election is democracy. |
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Post by Cranky on Nov 10, 2016 18:10:46 GMT -5
if you voted Trump you haven't a brain in your head and if you voted Hillary you're one of the elites? grates on me. Elite thing? I disagree. The comment that Obama made just a few days ago about how "we're right and we try to persuade them but then they go out to vote" is arrogant and elitist. Period. I saw this on the news, CBC to be exact and actually had to replay it a few times just to make sure i didn't miss the sheer arrogance of it. Here is another disconnect. The CBC put that on as a "poor Obama tried BUT those hicks let him down", but to those who don't by into the meme, it grates big time. Which of course speaks to the CBC bias. There is no excuse for Trumps blurtings. His comments ferments outraged for specific groups but then, were was that outrage when those they suppport denigrated people on colour and religion? On one of the American channels a black person brought it up, the commentator asked about the outrage from the other side, then the black person acknowledged that this is a problem. Of course it is. But until Trump brought this to another level, it was all too acceptable to target other for the blame game. Trump has exasperated what was a growing political devide. One can pin the big donkey tail on him for that, but he didn't start it. He simply exploited what was there and growing. I wish he and Hillary never existed politically. Romney (and some equivalent Democrat) was and is much more suitable as president. This political devide must be crushed as it's now starting to percolate into a hard edge social devide. Not good for the US....or Canada. |
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Post by Cranky on Nov 10, 2016 18:32:51 GMT -5
And as an outside observer, I'll predict that in 20 years, Obama will be looked upon as one of the 5 greatest presidents ever. Thats dependent of course, on the US not being a dictatorship. The real loser in this sordid election is democracy. Disagree. You like his policies and buy into his meme. Others don't. In fact, half of Americans don't think much of him to the point that they voted for Mr Dispicable then have someone who would continue his policies. If Americans had a Harper type Republican, it would have been an epic landslide for the right. With Mr Dispicable and a Harper like potential landslide, it speaks volumes about Obama and what Americans think of him. Canadians don't count. |
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Post by franko on Nov 10, 2016 18:39:10 GMT -5
What is that saying about lies and statistics, 17? I've seen that meme and I've seen ones that use many of these same numbers to somehow claim the opposite, that the economy is worse now with Obama's spending. Since I don't sit in a bankers chair I don't pretend to have a clue about it all.
Sort of like the conservatives left a positive balance no a big deficit.
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Post by PTH on Nov 10, 2016 19:58:54 GMT -5
Democracy isn't winning, because Hillary won the popular vote in both the Senate and for the presidential race. For the Senate, all the gerrymandering over the Bush years appears to be paying off for the Republicans.
I think Obama's legacy will be a bit like Eisenhower's: not that many striking moments or key decisions, but 8 solid years of good, drama-free, sound government.
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Post by Cranky on Nov 10, 2016 21:06:19 GMT -5
Claiming that Clinton won the popular vote as if it means anything in a Electoral College system is not much of an argument.
1....the election is based and fought on said Electoral College system. They both went around the country to concentrate and sway swing states, not popular votes. If it was based on popular vote, then both of them would go around to garner it.
2....if polls are to believed, from the 60 million who voted for Trump, 60% of those voted AGAINST Clinton then for Trump. That's 36,000,000 people who rather see Mr Despicable in office then Clinton. Then add that half or her 60,000,000 voted to keep Trump out then for her.
If it was several million spread, then one can lay sound claim of "failed democracy" and that the system is flawed, but a few hundred thousand votes mean nothing in electoral system, the overall context and particularly in perspective of the negative voting.
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Post by Cranky on Nov 11, 2016 0:09:36 GMT -5
I've argued all the following points so it was interesting to see an article from MSNBC, a left media bastion, was very much in agreement.
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