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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jul 22, 2018 8:25:20 GMT -5
A piece on Daniel Audette and his need to show something more this season. I have never quite been sold on his NHL potential. Not sure it gets any easier either with some new guys coming to Laval with more upside and also the new draft picks that definitely drop Audette further down the depth chart. A big “show me” year for sure. www.habsworld.net/2018/07/daniel-audette-a-prospect-on-the-hot-seat/ |
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Post by seventeen on Jul 22, 2018 12:50:03 GMT -5
I think drafting him was a desire to pick someone from the Q. Also, is Don not a Hab scout? The 'connections' rear their ugly heads. I'm not sure he was ever a viable prospect, but that's ot a knock on him, since anyone picked around #150 is a shot in the dark. Not sure I've ever paid much attention to Audette and hopefully he can carve out something for himself. I just cant see it happening in the NHL.
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Post by PTH on Jul 22, 2018 14:16:59 GMT -5
I never expect much out of Audette, so unless he explodes this season, I don't expect to see him renewed next season.
I suspect he'll head to Europe in a year.
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Post by blny on Jul 23, 2018 5:49:29 GMT -5
I think drafting him was a desire to pick someone from the Q. Also, is Don not a Hab scout? The 'connections' rear their ugly heads. I'm not sure he was ever a viable prospect, but that's ot a knock on him, since anyone picked around #150 is a shot in the dark. Not sure I've ever paid much attention to Audette and hopefully he can carve out something for himself. I just cant see it happening in the NHL. His father is indeed a Quebec league scout. Looking at the 2014 draft, there were 2 guys taken after Daniel that have had more than a cup of coffee with their club team. The Sharks' Kevin Leblanc, rw, has played 132 games and has 60 points. The Ducks' Ondrej Kase, rw, has played 119 games and has 53 points. It's also worth noting that Montreal took Hawkey in the 6th round and Evans in the 7th. Evans, now finished his college career, is about to start his pro career. I suspect that will be in Laval, but as a C/RW you never know. Hawkey has another year of college to play. He has been passed by Primeau on the depth chart, but he's not without promise still. |
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Post by Dschens on Jul 23, 2018 16:53:50 GMT -5
... It's also worth noting that Montreal took Hawkey in the 6th round and Evans in the 7th. Evans, now finished his college career, is about to start his pro career. I suspect that will be in Laval, but as a C/RW you never know. Hawkey has another year of college to play. He has been passed by Primeau on the depth chart, but he's not without promise still. I didn't know that we're discussing prospects of other organisations here, outside of the Chicken Wings. (SCNR) Hayden Hawkey: 2018-Jun-23 Traded from Montreal Canadiens to Edmonton Oilers for round 5 pick in the 2019 draft |
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Post by blny on Jul 23, 2018 17:33:00 GMT -5
... It's also worth noting that Montreal took Hawkey in the 6th round and Evans in the 7th. Evans, now finished his college career, is about to start his pro career. I suspect that will be in Laval, but as a C/RW you never know. Hawkey has another year of college to play. He has been passed by Primeau on the depth chart, but he's not without promise still. I didn't know that we're discussing prospects of other organisations here, outside of the Chicken Wings. (SCNR) Hayden Hawkey: 2018-Jun-23 Traded from Montreal Canadiens to Edmonton Oilers for round 5 pick in the 2019 draft Apologies. Forgot about that trade. My overall point was about a couple of late round picks that I think have more promise than Audette. |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jul 24, 2018 9:48:37 GMT -5
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jul 24, 2018 10:04:29 GMT -5
I think drafting him was a desire to pick someone from the Q. Also, is Don not a Hab scout? The 'connections' rear their ugly heads. I'm not sure he was ever a viable prospect, but that's ot a knock on him, since anyone picked around #150 is a shot in the dark. Not sure I've ever paid much attention to Audette and hopefully he can carve out something for himself. I just cant see it happening in the NHL. I remember seeing a TT interview after that draft and he explicitly mentioned that they asked Donald to leave the room when they talked about Daniel in developing their prospect rankings and their final draft board. As Donald is a regional scout for the Q, he would have still seen the draft board and known where the team ranked his son, but he was not able to influence that ranking or his selection when that pick came up. He put up decent numbers in his draft year, but I just did not see NHL upside there. Too many question marks. They pretty well remain. |
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Post by Dschens on Jul 24, 2018 17:04:12 GMT -5
Apologies. Forgot about that trade. My overall point was about a couple of late round picks that I think have more promise than Audette. No need to apologize, blny. We are all human and nobody is perfect, beside the obvious ones.  It was meant as a heads-up for you that the guy you've mentioned specifically was traded a month ago. The 'SCNR' was related to a certain player from the Halifax Mooseheads. |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jul 26, 2018 9:51:39 GMT -5
For the advanced stats and data analytics folks amongst us...some data on McShane and Hillis, our two recent OHL draftees.
What McShane's advanced stats don't say is he has great hockey sense but needs to improve his skating and consistency, which also influenced where he was picked.
And Hillis, who needs to get a stronger and shoot more, although his hockey IQ, playmaking, and work ethic are top notch.
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Post by Willie Dog on Jul 26, 2018 12:35:40 GMT -5
NW, thanks, those are cool videos. I wanted Zadina at #3 but I like Kotkaniemi. Hopefully he grows into his body and develops some explosion in the skating stride because the mechanics of his skating look fine to me. Me too, I really wanted Zadina, but if this kid can be our #1 for 10 years or more, I'll be a happy camper |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jul 26, 2018 13:30:42 GMT -5
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Post by Anardil1 on Jul 26, 2018 13:38:03 GMT -5
I believe rather strongly, that the Habs true #1 center will be obtained at the 2019 draft. Hughes definitely has a higher potential upside than any center prospect that currently belongs to the Habs. It is also debatable that any one of Dach, Turcotte, or Newhook have true #1 center potential. My point is that any one of the prospects that I've mentioned have a better possibility than any center prospect on the Habs to be a true #1. If the Habs obtain one of the aforementioned centers, then we will have true potential strength down the middle to compete against the likes of the Leafs, Lightning, etc. Imagining Hughes, Kotkaniemi, and Poehling down the middle makes me smile. It would be the best top 3 center depth that this team would have since Turgeon, Damphousse, and Koivu. How sad is that?
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jul 26, 2018 15:34:22 GMT -5
I believe rather strongly, that the Habs true #1 center will be obtained at the 2019 draft. Hughes definitely has a higher potential upside than any center prospect that currently belongs to the Habs. It is also debatable that any one of Dach, Turcotte, or Newhook have true #1 center potential. My point is that any one of the prospects that I've mentioned have a better possibility than any center prospect on the Habs to be a true #1. If the Habs obtain one of the aforementioned centers, then we will have true potential strength down the middle to compete against the likes of the Leafs, Lightning, etc. Imagining Hughes, Kotkaniemi, and Poehling down the middle makes me smile. It would be the best top 3 center depth that this team would have since Turgeon, Damphousse, and Koivu. How sad is that? ^ ^ ^ ^ Agree. 2019 is a very good draft for high potential centres. |
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Post by blny on Jul 26, 2018 16:11:31 GMT -5
I believe rather strongly, that the Habs true #1 center will be obtained at the 2019 draft. Hughes definitely has a higher potential upside than any center prospect that currently belongs to the Habs. It is also debatable that any one of Dach, Turcotte, or Newhook have true #1 center potential. My point is that any one of the prospects that I've mentioned have a better possibility than any center prospect on the Habs to be a true #1. If the Habs obtain one of the aforementioned centers, then we will have true potential strength down the middle to compete against the likes of the Leafs, Lightning, etc. Imagining Hughes, Kotkaniemi, and Poehling down the middle makes me smile. It would be the best top 3 center depth that this team would have since Turgeon, Damphousse, and Koivu. How sad is that? Ditto. It was a big reason for my push for Zadina. Get the center next year. I guess the Habs felt that the more top end centers in the system the better, and you never know where your number will fall next summer. |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jul 27, 2018 9:47:32 GMT -5
This just made the Kamloops Summer Showcase a lot less interesting from a Habs' prospect viewing perspective.
No Brook (injury), Ikonen (injury), nor Kotkaniemi/Ylonen (not making the trip - you have to feel their spots on the WJC are locked up, so why attend the summer tourney I guess).
Poehling, Primeau and Olofsson will still be there.
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jul 27, 2018 9:52:36 GMT -5
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Post by Anardil1 on Jul 27, 2018 12:16:14 GMT -5
I believe rather strongly, that the Habs true #1 center will be obtained at the 2019 draft. Hughes definitely has a higher potential upside than any center prospect that currently belongs to the Habs. It is also debatable that any one of Dach, Turcotte, or Newhook have true #1 center potential. My point is that any one of the prospects that I've mentioned have a better possibility than any center prospect on the Habs to be a true #1. If the Habs obtain one of the aforementioned centers, then we will have true potential strength down the middle to compete against the likes of the Leafs, Lightning, etc. Imagining Hughes, Kotkaniemi, and Poehling down the middle makes me smile. It would be the best top 3 center depth that this team would have since Turgeon, Damphousse, and Koivu. How sad is that? Ditto. It was a big reason for my push for Zadina. Get the center next year. I guess the Habs felt that the more top end centers in the system the better, and you never know where your number will fall next summer. I can understand that, however, the good thing with centers is that many can successfully convert to the wing if necessary. Kotkaniemi has already shown that he can produce on the wing. |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jul 27, 2018 12:49:51 GMT -5
A piece about two newbies that will be joining the Rocket, and both are fast! Bitten and Verbeek.
Some good analysis in the article.
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Post by blny on Jul 27, 2018 17:06:21 GMT -5
Ditto. It was a big reason for my push for Zadina. Get the center next year. I guess the Habs felt that the more top end centers in the system the better, and you never know where your number will fall next summer. I can understand that, however, the good thing with centers is that many can successfully convert to the wing if necessary. Kotkaniemi has already shown that he can produce on the wing. Certainly. And, if we end up with a high pick next Spring and get a guy that enters the fold with Poehling and Kotkaniemi you have the potential for a very solid trifecta. |
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Post by folatre on Jul 27, 2018 20:22:25 GMT -5
NW, thanks for the updates. Regarding Finland, it seems perfectly reasonable why they plan to evaluate other players.
With respect to the quality of kids available at the top of the 2019 draft, no matter how bad the Habs are this season the odds of picking Hughes are not good. But as you guys point out, there are other high end centres with promising ceiling. Newhook looks like the real deal and I like Turcotte a lot too. Dache is a big kid that is intriguing if and when he figures out how to use that advantage to drive play more. And there are a bunch of kids up front who are not (or probably not) centres like Kakko, Cozzens, Lavoie, and Krebs.
October through April is going to be un calvario. But a high end talent is almost assured come June.
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jul 28, 2018 23:31:07 GMT -5
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jul 28, 2018 23:36:04 GMT -5
NW, thanks for the updates. Regarding Finland, it seems perfectly reasonable why they plan to evaluate other players. . The Finnish coach mentioned they are keeping guys back who will be at NHL camps to save them another long trip over. He specifically mentioned that he hopes Kotkaniemi is available for them in December. The second half of the article is about Kotkaniemi. www.nhl.com/news/adam-boqvist-blackhawks-decide-ohl-best-fit/c-299614750Ylonen likely gets a pass as a 19 year old who has been part of their U18 team already. They are bringing a lot of 2019 draft eligible kids over, so getting a look at them although the final WJC team will most likely have mainly 19 and 18 year olds. |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jul 31, 2018 9:48:37 GMT -5
At least Primeau and Olofsson played yesterday. I hope that Poehling does play by the end of the week when the games are televised!!
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jul 31, 2018 17:02:12 GMT -5
This is a very subjective list of my Top 25 prospects as of right now. I have no hard and firm cut-off criteria in terms of age. I will generally exclude a player as graduated if they are playing full time with the Habs (I have excluded Scherbak as he should be a full time graduate this season since he needs to clear waivers. Ditto with DLR). I did not include Lindgren, although a good argument can be made to either include or exclude him. It is actually interesting to see the players that did not make this list. I do not see them having as good upside as the following, but one or some could surprise.
Read away. Agree or disagree to your heart's content.
1. Jesperi Kotkaniemi, C, Assat – Berg’s wunderkid. He has a good frame, but is young and can and will gain some strength to that frame. He has great hockey IQ, playmaking, and a solid arsenal of shots. His skating has improved and can still get better in terms of first step and separation speed. This can come with added strength and some tweaks to his skating technique. He should be the a critical player with the Finnish WJC team this season and hopefully will earn the move to centre with his Liiga club team once he wraps up camp with the Habs.
2. Ryan Poehling, C, St Cloud State – Another likely consensus pick, although there are those who still wonder about his offensive upside. Ryan really improved his offensive game this past season, his second full season in the NCAA. This comes with maturity and added strength, both which he displayed. A responsible two-way centre, it just remains to see where his offensive ceiling lies.
3. Noah Juulsen, RD, Laval/Montreal – He looked so comfortable with the Habs at the end of the season it is easy to forget last year was his first year of pro hockey and he started off injured. He plays a very solid defensive game and has good mobility. He also puts up very good analytics for such a young player (for those who like advanced analytics). He is just more well rounded that Mete for me, so I put him ahead of Mete for this reason.
4. Victor Mete, LD, Montreal – He was a surprise starter with the Habs as a 19 year old, but Julien clearly started to reduce his ice time and exposure as the season progressed. It is hard to argue about his skating ability. That is his greatest strength. He still needs to get stronger to be more effective a defender and also to get a more effective shot, as his is very weak. Despite his great mobility, I just don’t see him as a big offensive catalyst at the NHL level. This does reduce his upside for me a fair bit as there is a place for smaller offensive defenders in the top two pairings these days, less so for small guys without a lot of offense.
5. Jesse Ylonen, RW, Pelicans Lahti – This slight-framed Finnish winger definitely can fly and make great plays at pace. He had a very solid U18 last spring for Finland, but was not on the team this year due to a late 1999 birthday. That kept him off some scouting radars. One of our few true wingers with good offensive skills and hockey IQ.
6. Cayden Primeau, G, Northeastern – The biggest riser in the rankings from last year, after he went from a rather underwhelming USHL goalie to an NCAA starter and all-star in a season. He is now a very good bet to be on the US WJC team over the holidays. He is a solid technical goalie and suddenly his NHL upside looks a lot better after a great first season in college.
7. Josh Brook, RD, Moose Jaw – He unfortunately missed a good chunk of the early season with injury. He did quickly fit in as a key defender with Moose Jaw until they traded for Kale Clague at the deadline, and then reduced the roles that Brook was getting prior to the trade. He is a solid mobile defender with decent two-way skills. He can effectively move the puck with both a good pass and his skating ability. He is also not scared to join in the rush. He has a solid shot at a spot on Canada’s WJC team.
8. Cale Fleury, RD, Regina (?) – Maybe he plays in the WHL, but I would expect he more likely plays in Laval due to his late birthday. He really improved this year, and that was even before he moved from lowly Kootenay to Memorial Cup host Regina. He is likely the most physical of our defender prospects as he uses physical play to break up plays and stop rushes. He can also skate and pass to join the play up ice as well.
9. Joni Ikonen, C, KalPa – He is often forgotten, but he was a late second last year’s draft for a reason. He was a big part of Finland’s offense at the U18s last year. He really struggled moving to men’s league this past season, especially early on. He did get better as the season progressed as he learnt how to separate himself from checkers more despite his smaller size and average speed. He is still very highly skilled player who should build on his late season improvements in the Liiga.
10. Jacob Olofsson, C, Timra – Jacob was a big part of the reason why Timra is moving up to the SHL this season. Unfortunately, his international play was a lot more underwhelming. He is already seen a solid two-way centre, but the question is what is his offensive upside. He does show offensive awareness and skill and put up decent numbers as a 17 year old in a men’s league. His coach mentioned that he is committed to help him work on this part or his game.
11. Cam Hillis, C, Guelph – There are a whole bunch of prospects in this next tier who could all easily be moved up or down. A smaller hard-working centre with great hockey IQ and passing skills. One knock other than his size is that he does need to shoot more. This was his first season in the OHL and he was a big contributor with the lowly Storm, and he should do more of the same this season. He also was part of Canada’s U18 team with fellow prospects McShane and Fonstad in April.
12. Lukas Vejdemo, C, Laval – After playing in the SHL, he has committed to playing in North America this season even if he does not make the Habs out of camp (the most likely scenario). He has decent size and skating, and had a bit of a tale of two seasons. He put up good numbers in the first half, and then offense dropped off as he played more of a defensive centre role in the second half. It will be interesting to see how he adapts to the smaller rink.
13. Jake Evans, C, Laval – He signed his entry-level deal after an impressive four year NCAA career. He was leading the NCAA in scoring in early December, and then faded a fair bit afterwards. However, he was the offensive driver for Notre Dame and they pushed for a national title only to fall short in the final game. He will need to get stronger and quicker though, but his faceoffs and hockey IQ are very solid.
14. Allan McShane, C, Oshawa – He is definitely a skilled player with good playmaking skills and a good shot; however, he suffers from two big issues: his skating needs to improve as does his consistency. If he even gets one of those sorted out, I think he can move up our rankings on skills alone.
15. Alexander Romanov, LD, CSKA – Alex is a really hard guy to rank, since he is so below the radar. I might have had him lower but I give him some bonus points since TT and the scouts were so over-the-top with his selection. Yup, he was picked miles ahead of every draft list I saw, so that is why he still sits at a more conservative spot for me. He is a good skater and can play an effective physical game with decent gap control. He also put up decent offense at the World Junior A Challenge. He played at the U18s as well, but on his off-side, so it was difficult to properly assess his play in those games I saw (it was either one or two).
16. Cole Fonstad, C, Prince Albert – I really struggled on where to rank him. He could be higher, but who knows. He still is small and needs to get a quicker step in his skating, but he was a big part of PA’s offense last year and did get some U18 play in April. Another good playmaking centre, although he did play a lot of wing in the Dub last year.
17. Will Bitten, C, Laval – He drops a bit because his offense did seem to plateau a bit on a very strong Hamilton team. He is a very fast skater and plays a physical game for an undersized guy. He has no problems going to the dirty areas of the ice.
18. Michael McNiven, G, Laval – He definitely dropped this past season after a great run in the OHL. This was mainly due to his inconsistent play in the AHL in his first pro season. I expect with a more stable defense and team in front of him this year, he should show marked improvement as he likely is the #2 again for Laval.
19. Michael Moravcik, LD, Laval (?) – He is the oldest of the players on my list at 24, but he still is a rookie to NA hockey. I really liked what I read of his play in the Czech league this past season and what little I saw of his scrimmages in July at the Development Camp. A big defender with good mobility.
20. Jarret Tyszka, LD, Seattle – Tyszka is a prospect who was trending upwards last season, so he may even be considered a bit low at this spot. Some of his skating and defensive concerns improved over the last year. He is a guy to watch to see if he keeps on his positive development curve as he has size and skill and mobility.
21. Michael McCarron, RW, MOntreal/Laval – His game seems to have not only not developed, but actually regressed over the last two seasons. This is a make or break season for sure, as he will need to show he can carve out some permanent role on a NHL roster. New coaches may be what he needs, but time is running, running, running out with this team. He needs to get a quicker first step, big time.
22. Rinat Valiev, LD, Laval – He is a big question mark for me. I really did not see enough of him to properly rank him, but Bobby Mac was very complementary when he was part of the Plekanec trade this past year. I think he should get a good long look at camp as the brass will be curious to see what they have with him too. There were rumours of him thinking about heading back to Russia, but he did sign a one year extension with the Habs. He will still be a RFA at the end of it too.
23. Jordan Harris, LD, Northeastern – It is always so hard to rank players coming out of high school hockey, but there were positive reports out of Development Camp. He is that new age defender, as he is all about his skating and ability to move the puck up on the fly. He will be making a big jump up to NCAA hockey, but he will have a pretty good starting goalie behind him as the last line of defense!!
24. Brett Lernout, RD, Laval – A decent sized defender with reasonable mobility and a hard shot. He also plays a solid physical game. My biggest worry is more recent picks are passing him on the depth chart as the others are showing better upside. His call-ups last season were not enough to carve out a roster spot for him by any means.
25. David Sklenicka, LD, Laval (?) – Like his Czech buddy, he has a EU escape clause if he does not secure an NHL spot. He is only 21 and is more of the newer style of mobile defenders in the NHL. He will likely need some seasoning in the AHL before the team really knows what they have with him, but he already has three years of men’s play under his belt and a spot at the recent men’s Worlds.
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Post by seventeen on Jul 31, 2018 17:46:11 GMT -5
I thought of submitting a list to Habs Eye on the Prize, but knew that after I got to around #10, I wouldn't care much about the guys after that as the odds of them making it drop.
So, at the risk of being considered lazy (which is an accurate description) if you'll allow me to piggy back on your rankings, because mine are very similar. Definitely Kotkaniemi, Poehling, Juulsen and Mete. I might have Primeau ahead of Ylonen as Primeau has proven himself in a Draft +1 year while Ylonen has yet to play that D + 1 season, but those two are very close. Primeau's position can have more impact than Ylonen, so that was another consideration I might have McShane up wth Hills and Olofsson, just because I'm a bit of riverboat gambler. McShane has skating issues, but is an elite passer and creator of offense via the pass. If he can improve his skating a bit (a not unreasonable assumption), his IQ and other facets of his game are way up there. Afer that, it's a crap shoot. I'm not as high on Romanov as Timmins is. I think we wasted a pick and he could have been had later, but we shall see. Of the later names, I'm hopeful of McNiven and Tyszka. McNiven had a poor season, but he didn't suddenly become a bad prospect. Tyszka seems to me to be one of those guys who got a lot better than we expected in one season, so I'm hopeful that he continues that rapid improvement trend. Maybe not, but I can hope.
Good work NWT. You obviously have more energy than I do
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Post by folatre on Jul 31, 2018 18:01:32 GMT -5
I appreciate the ranking, NW. My top ten would look almost identical.
The rest of it seems trickier because there are grown men (age wise and physically) like Moravcik, McCarron and Valiev and then there are true kids.
I see that you are not too excited about 2017 third rounder Scott Walford. It is positive that Tyszka is progressing nicely considering where he was drafted. I have no clue at all about the guys coming over from Rep. Checa. I sure hope that at least one of Romanov or Harris turns out to be a NHLer because right now it does not feel like the Habs are in good shape on the left side of the defense for the next three or four seasons.
I know quite a few Habs fans who are a lot more excited about guys like Evans and Bitten than I am, but I see those two as likelier to carve out some sort of career in the NHL than Fonstad and McShane.
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jul 31, 2018 20:47:39 GMT -5
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Aug 1, 2018 7:31:22 GMT -5
Appreciate the effort that went into that list, NWTHF ... not sure I have the knowledge on these guys to evaluate them, but I'll try to respond to a few later ...
Cheers.
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Post by BadCompany on Aug 1, 2018 8:44:58 GMT -5
Nice quote from Sweden's World Junior coach, on Jacob Olofsson. From Corey Pronman, in the Athletic. For the record, the rest of the article talks about some other Swedish prospects, and it isn't all sunshine-up-your-skirt quotes. He seems to really like Olofsson.
CP: The other one is Jacob Olofsson (MTL), who was the top junior player in the Allsvenskan. He had an interesting season, somewhat up and down.
Monten: He was very good every time I had him in November and in the pre-tournament games in December. I still don’t know if I made the right call not to put him on the final team. My feeling is he should have maybe been on that team. I know he was up and down. He had an injury at the Under-18s. I know a lot of scouts had issues with him before the draft. His club team went up a division, he scored I think eight game-winning goals. It was a surprise for me he didn’t get picked earlier.
CP: What stands out the most to you about him?
Monten: His hockey IQ. He’s so smart, he’s big, strong, he always ends up on the right side of the puck. I think a lot of NHL teams are going to feel down the road we made a bad call.
CP: I know Montreal is very excited about him.
Monten: They’re going to have a great player.
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It was meant as a heads-up for you that the guy you've mentioned specifically was traded a month ago. The 'SCNR' was related to a certain player from the Halifax Mooseheads.
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