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Draft '20
Apr 22, 2020 6:33:09 GMT -5
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Post by GNick99 on Apr 22, 2020 6:33:09 GMT -5
I would rather they waited. Many factors may affect it. Trades, Cap room, compliance buyouts. If held after July 1, I was wondering about trade and sign potential UFA? Usually get more, ie Pacioretty. |
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Post by seventeen on Apr 23, 2020 1:03:17 GMT -5
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Post by GNick99 on Apr 23, 2020 6:00:36 GMT -5
I couldn't open it up. I would subscribe but I don't have the time to put into the draft. |
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Post by BadCompany on Apr 23, 2020 7:59:13 GMT -5
I couldn't open it up. I would subscribe but I don't have the time to put into the draft. The basic upshot of the article was that there really wasn't any proof of one draft being "deeper" than any other draft, with 1999 and 2003 being the two exceptions that prove the rule. In general, only about 25 legitimate NHL players come out of every draft. As you would expect, most of the those players came from the top end of the draft, within the first 50 picks or so, with there being a very steep drop-off from the 1st overall down through the top 10. Here is the study that Pronman used to base a lot of his analysis on. There are a couple of interesting charts and tables in it: statsportsconsulting.com/2016/05/26/1658/ |
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Post by GNick99 on Apr 24, 2020 7:18:53 GMT -5
I couldn't open it up. I would subscribe but I don't have the time to put into the draft. The basic upshot of the article was that there really wasn't any proof of one draft being "deeper" than any other draft, with 1999 and 2003 being the two exceptions that prove the rule. In general, only about 25 legitimate NHL players come out of every draft. As you would expect, most of the those players came from the top end of the draft, within the first 50 picks or so, with there being a very steep drop-off from the 1st overall down through the top 10. Here is the study that Pronman used to base a lot of his analysis on. There are a couple of interesting charts and tables in it: statsportsconsulting.com/2016/05/26/1658/The '79 Draft should be in there also. It is widely considered the best draft |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Apr 24, 2020 7:56:38 GMT -5
It is still too early for the data to be available for the 2015 draft (five years of ice time data), but it will be one of the best in terms of top end talent depth.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Apr 24, 2020 18:35:10 GMT -5
Interesting perspective ... Ferraro: Too many complications if NHL holds
draft for season resumptionTSN.ca Staff TSN Hockey Analyst Ray Ferraro says there would be too many complications should the NHL try to hold the NHL Draft before resuming the season. Speaking on the latest episode of The Ray & Dregs Podcast, TSN Hockey Insider Darren Dreger posed the question to Ferraro about if the NHL’s idea of holding the Draft before the season were to resume is feasible. "There is the way the draft order would be. There’s the conditional draft picks. For example, Vancouver has a trade with Tampa Bay, a conditional first in the trade. How would you sort that out?" Ferraro asked. "Montreal has 14 draft picks. They didn’t get 14 picks to get 14 players. They want to package those picks to get an NHL-ready or a near NHL-ready player. You wouldn’t be able to do all of that." On Thursday’s edition of Insider Trading, the Insiders revealed the league’s idea of holding the draft in June, before a potential resumption of the regular season in the summer. According to TSN Hockey Insider Pierre LeBrun, a majority of the GMs that were polled opposed the idea. More. |
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Apr 24, 2020 18:55:55 GMT -5
Whenever I want to find out how many draft picks (by year) made it to the NHL I use hockeydb.com ... the stats are at the bottom of every draft page but they don't rate each draft class ... this article is a tad more in-depth than that ... a good read ... Cheers. |
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Post by GNick99 on Apr 25, 2020 6:11:59 GMT -5
Whenever I want to find out how many draft picks (by year) made it to the NHL I use hockeydb.com ... the stats are at the bottom of every draft page but they don't rate each draft class ... this article is a tad more in-depth than that ... a good read ... Cheers. Had a debate a couple of months with a friend about Habs better off trading their first round picks. Provided they get players with long term control. With 7 straight first round misses, he could have a point. He suggested trading the pick on the draft floor. Because draft picks are usually at their highest value. The return will vary from draft to draft. Dependent of position of the pick, depth of draft and if a team is up against the cap looking to move a big contract. Get 3 or so good years out of the player then retrade him at a future trade deadline. Acquiring a first pick back. Hence, picks are at their lowest value at trade deadline. As each season went by you would have a constant growing of assets. Be in a position then to trade the now 2 first picks for a very good established player. Habs recently had 7 straight first round misses. Those picks should have returned roughly 2 top line players, 2 more top six forwards, a #4 d-man and a #3 d-man. Add those players to the Habs around 2013-2015, would be hell of team. He pointed out Habs be getting instant help. A proven NHL caliber player, cut back on scouting and development and pool those resources in other areas. |
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Post by GNick99 on Apr 26, 2020 8:02:57 GMT -5
Not hard to figure out why Habs have struggled in last 25 years. They won't drop down to draft top stars. While other teams will, which gives them the stars. Combined that with Montreal not being a top destination for UFAs. Without these 2 ways to acquire talent, which other teams have, you can see why our results are what they are.
Yes, the draft is a gamble but if you don't buy a ticket you can never hit the jackpot! Why somebody is hitting it every year. Even if we have a terrible year and lose the draft lottery, which is worst case scenario, we still draft 4th. Which although, not a star, is still usually a first line player. Odds of chance suggest we will not lose the lottery every single year. Can anybody be that unlucky? Say if a team drafts 4th this year, a Raymond or Rossi type player. Drafts a Raty or Wright in one of next 2 drafts. Year we don't win lottery draft a Clarke or Bolduc, 3-7th or so. That is a hell of a core. A young core like that, on entry level deals, opens up more incentive for top UFA to sign here.
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Draft '20
Apr 28, 2020 18:31:13 GMT -5
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Post by GNick99 on Apr 28, 2020 18:31:13 GMT -5
In last 30 years, only players to out score Rossi in their draft year are Lindros, McDavid and Kane. Pretty good company
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Draft '20
Apr 28, 2020 18:34:40 GMT -5
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Post by GNick99 on Apr 28, 2020 18:34:40 GMT -5
Jacob Dion certainly put up good numbers this year. Do you think he will be drafted?
Noticed his numbers studying Nickl.
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Post by folatre on May 1, 2020 22:04:49 GMT -5
Wow, we may still have a draft to be focusing on 4-5 weeks from now. Friedman was reporting this evening that Bettman/Daly are putting one last full court press on the clubs to attempt to get them to support (or at least accept) an early June draft.
I understand in general terms why the league office likes the idea of having a television event in June to boost the brand during these endless weeks of uncertainty. But I have to agree with Yzerman who basically bashed this idea publicly last week. I think the arguments for waiting are more compelling.
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Draft '20
May 1, 2020 23:39:16 GMT -5
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Post by BadCompany on May 1, 2020 23:39:16 GMT -5
Wow, we may still have a draft to be focusing on 4-5 weeks from now. Friedman was reporting this evening that Bettman/Daly are putting one last full court press on the clubs to attempt to get them to support (or at least accept) an early June draft. I understand in general terms why the league office likes the idea of having a television event in June to boost the brand during these endless weeks of uncertainty. But I have to agree with Yzerman who basically bashed this idea publicly last week. I think the arguments for waiting are more compelling. I think it's pretty much a done deal. Bettman is going to ram this down GM's throats whether they like it or not. No shot at Lafreniere.  |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on May 2, 2020 9:14:36 GMT -5
Wow, we may still have a draft to be focusing on 4-5 weeks from now. Friedman was reporting this evening that Bettman/Daly are putting one last full court press on the clubs to attempt to get them to support (or at least accept) an early June draft. I understand in general terms why the league office likes the idea of having a television event in June to boost the brand during these endless weeks of uncertainty. But I have to agree with Yzerman who basically bashed this idea publicly last week. I think the arguments for waiting are more compelling. I think it's pretty much a done deal. Bettman is going to ram this down GM's throats whether they like it or not. No shot at Lafreniere. Yeah, only one team able to move up and only to a max of four spots. What a load of rubbish. Hope they don’t do it, but I am sure they are drooling over the three day tv event that was the recent NFL draft that sports starved fans ate up. If they go with June 5th, they said they would have to make a decision next week. I am a draft junkie, but I don’t want it soon THAT bad. Smarten up NHL. |
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Post by folatre on May 2, 2020 10:42:42 GMT -5
One of the ironies is that Bettman's tinkering would make the draft lottery a much more boring TV event, since it literally has 1/3 the potential excitement that it is designed to have.
Also, I predict the ratings in the States would be very pedestrian aside from a few localized hockey hot spots. From what I understand from colleagues and neighbors, it is not only that American football is top dog in the sports pyramid in the U.S., the draft's massive appeal relates to the fact that college football is second only to the NFL in viewership and thus all of those millions of eyeballs tuning in to the NFL draft have opinions about all of those 21-22 year old players who will actually be playing five months later in the NFL.
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Draft '20
May 2, 2020 17:24:16 GMT -5
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Post by Tankdriver on May 2, 2020 17:24:16 GMT -5
Well if they are altering the draft, then everyone should be allowed in the playoffs except the team that wins the draft. Because let's face it, overall record for this season means nothing.
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Post by GNick99 on May 3, 2020 8:12:42 GMT -5
I think it's pretty much a done deal. Bettman is going to ram this down GM's throats whether they like it or not. No shot at Lafreniere. Yeah, only one team able to move up and only to a max of four spots. What a load of rubbish. Hope they don’t do it, but I am sure they are drooling over the three day tv event that was the recent NFL draft that sports starved fans ate up. If they go with June 5th, they said they would have to make a decision next week. I am a draft junkie, but I don’t want it soon THAT bad. Smarten up NHL. How is he able to get such a last second change in rules like so? Many teams be voting against rule change for obvious reasons. A team is slated to draft between 4 to 16, they going to vote against a chance at 1st overall? Or get in top 3? |
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Draft '20
May 3, 2020 9:26:09 GMT -5
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Post by Tankdriver on May 3, 2020 9:26:09 GMT -5
Sounds like a lot of make it up as you go along stuff.
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Post by seventeen on May 3, 2020 12:30:10 GMT -5
Sounds very political to me too, which is hardly surprising. I doubt 'fairness' had any weighting in their reasoning. Ottawa and Detroit end up with insurmountable odds for the first pick. One franchise is unhealthy, the other is an original six which is unhealthy performance wise. (Kind of like the Habs, but we don't get any benefit, John Scott or not)
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Post by PTH on May 3, 2020 12:53:53 GMT -5
Sounds like a lot of make it up as you go along stuff. Yup. I think it's a times like this that we're reminded that pro sports is a lot of veneer over a money-making (ie, pure marketing) core, along with, when they think about, some actual sports. I'm sure the NHL has way more people working on the marketing of hockey than any other function, including just general management such as ensuring fairness to franchises. If you can buy one off so they sign off on something, it counts as fair. IE: Montreal will be told that if they play along, the draft gets rescheduled here in 3 years. So they keep quiet and go along. Other teams have other pressure points. |
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Draft '20
May 3, 2020 19:14:05 GMT -5
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Post by Tankdriver on May 3, 2020 19:14:05 GMT -5
I want a chance at Laf. Even if it is slim atleast lightning can strike. Moving up a max of 4 sports mean no chance at all.
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Post by GNick99 on May 4, 2020 8:15:41 GMT -5
Did a little search on line. Found hockeyprospects had rankings much different than most. They have Askarov 5th, Sanderson 22nd. Not sure if they are legit or not? I know some drafts have a surprise in top few picks. Hayton in '18, Hickey one year, etc... If Askarov goes in top 5 going to throw the draft for different loop. Also if Sanderson starts to slide, does it open up potential we trade up?
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Post by GNick99 on May 5, 2020 7:30:11 GMT -5
I couldn't open it up. I would subscribe but I don't have the time to put into the draft. The basic upshot of the article was that there really wasn't any proof of one draft being "deeper" than any other draft, with 1999 and 2003 being the two exceptions that prove the rule. In general, only about 25 legitimate NHL players come out of every draft. As you would expect, most of the those players came from the top end of the draft, within the first 50 picks or so, with there being a very steep drop-off from the 1st overall down through the top 10. Here is the study that Pronman used to base a lot of his analysis on. There are a couple of interesting charts and tables in it: statsportsconsulting.com/2016/05/26/1658/Late round picks are a shot in the dark, but when you hit a Gallagher type it is quite the find to the team. Maybe could be enhanced? I would try and put more emphasis on drafting in later rounds. By late round picks I mean after 2nd round. By hiring more scouts and having a veteran scout who has found gems in the past be in charge of late rounds. Provided it don't interfere with other aspects of our draft. Of course, the 1st and 2nd round still being the prime aspect of our draft. About 1 in 10 every late pick will be an average or fringe NHLer. A Norlinder, Harris, Mete, Evans, Fleury type. With about 1 in 50 being a solid to good NHLer. A Gallaher, Plekanec, Markov, Darcy Tucker type. But if we could spend more time scouting these picks, and acquire few extra late picks. They are easily acquirable. I think there is potential of finding another Point or Marchand type. At minimal costs. |
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Post by BadCompany on May 5, 2020 8:48:13 GMT -5
Sounds very political to me too, which is hardly surprising. I doubt 'fairness' had any weighting in their reasoning. Ottawa and Detroit end up with insurmountable odds for the first pick. One franchise is unhealthy, the other is an original six which is unhealthy performance wise. (Kind of like the Habs, but we don't get any benefit, John Scott or not) Well, we did move from 4th to 3rd that year.  |
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Post by seventeen on May 5, 2020 12:49:46 GMT -5
Sounds very political to me too, which is hardly surprising. I doubt 'fairness' had any weighting in their reasoning. Ottawa and Detroit end up with insurmountable odds for the first pick. One franchise is unhealthy, the other is an original six which is unhealthy performance wise. (Kind of like the Habs, but we don't get any benefit, John Scott or not) Well, we did move from 4th to 3rd that year. In hindsight, Ottawa probably would have taken Tkachuk anyway and we would have taken Kotkaniemi, so no real gain for moving up, huh? |
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Post by folatre on May 6, 2020 14:47:38 GMT -5
Can you guys imagine how pissed Habs Nation will be if the Montreal win the BS revised lottery that Bettman and Daly are pushing, instead of grabbing Lafreniere, management will be stuck taking someone not named Lafreniere, Byfield, or Stutzle.
The pain would not wear off but duty would call and a decision would have to be made, so who would you guys select if the Habs win the phony lottery and pick fourth?
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Post by seventeen on May 6, 2020 17:35:05 GMT -5
There are some pretty good players after those guys, including Drysdale, Rossi, Perfetti and Raymond. It' still beneficial if we get lucky, but yes, losing out on a French Canadian star would sting.
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Post by Andrew on May 6, 2020 18:07:05 GMT -5
It will sting big time, and I hope that the Habs are pushing back hard with the league on this proposal. The first french canadian star forward projected to go first overall since Lecavalier (22 years ago!), and the league wants to change up the lottery rules so that the Habs have zero chance of landing him? Watch him end up in LA.
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Post by Habs_fan_in_LA on May 6, 2020 20:44:45 GMT -5
It will sting big time, and I hope that the Habs are pushing back hard with the league on this proposal. The first french canadian star forward projected to go first overall since Lecavalier (22 years ago!), and the league wants to change up the lottery rules so that the Habs have zero chance of landing him? Watch him end up in LA. Agree. Two issues: 1. Pay the leagues poor teams but don’t improve yourself. No cup in Canada since 1993. 2. If you get into the playoffs anything can happen BS! They cant win the cup and they cant get #1 overall. We need to replace Molson and Bergevin. |
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