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Post by habsorbed on Nov 2, 2022 23:24:48 GMT -5
We're getting close to decision day for Slafs. I say send him down. He will get more and better TOI and the development staff is much better than under MB. He will also get acclimatized to the smaller rink and gain confidence - he seems to be getting bumped around a bit and sometimes injured. And perhaps most importantly, we won't eat up a year of his entry level contract.
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Post by Willie Dog on Nov 3, 2022 5:06:12 GMT -5
We're getting close to decision day for Slafs. I say send him down. He will get more and better TOI and the development staff is much better than under MB. He will also get acclimatized to the smaller rink and gain confidence - he seems to be getting bumped around a bit and sometimes injured. And perhaps most importantly, we won't eat up a year of his entry level contract. To the OHL or AHL because he will get bumped around in the AHL, there are men playing there and I'm sure some of them would like to make a name for themselves going after a 1st overall... I said stay with the big club, but only if he gets top 2 line time... 10 minutes a game isnt enough... If the habs are serious about a tank then send him down and when Matheson and edmunson return send wifi and Harris down and then we can really start to suck... |
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Post by frozone on Nov 3, 2022 12:17:51 GMT -5
I voted to keep him up. Laval doesn't seem to be a great place for development these days. Hopefully it's just a short term hiccup, but something is off down there in the AHL right now.
Right now, JS is averaging 11:26 and I expect that will grow to a certain degree, maybe to the 13-14 range. Yes, more icetime would be ideal, but total minutes over the season is the most important thing imo. So as long as he gets to suit up for most of the season, I'm good with keeping him up.
We'll really need him to get more shots on net, though. If he can average 2 shots on net per game, then he officially belongs in the NHL imo.
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Post by Cranky on Nov 3, 2022 12:22:37 GMT -5
Foged steel is stronger then poured steel.
Forge him in the NHL
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Post by Tankdriver on Nov 3, 2022 12:24:10 GMT -5
Yes. But play him on the top 2 lines.
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Post by folatre on Nov 3, 2022 15:40:58 GMT -5
The more important number is 40 games because that is where he accrues an NHL season towards arbitration and unrestricted free agency. At this point I would keep him in Montreal. But I agree with the sentiment that Slavkofsky would show more if he was not on the fourth line and if the coaches use him regularly on the power play.
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Post by Bobs_HABit on Nov 3, 2022 19:07:45 GMT -5
I said, stay with the big Club but with a condition.
As other's have mentioned, 10 games isn't the concern here. I would keep him around for 25-30 games and hopefully expand his role. If he's struggling, hitting a wall, etc, send him to the A and go from there
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Post by habsorbed on Nov 7, 2022 1:28:38 GMT -5
OK! I have a great deal of contempt for the talking heads/bloggers. But this has to be the most absurd article I have seen in a long while. To suggest the Habs will keep Slafs with the big club because Anderson has now been suspended for 2 games is downright moronic. There are a lot of reasons to keep Slafs with Le Club, and apparently not many to send him down. But one that will not ever be a factor in HuGo's assessment is that they need Slafs to replace Josh for 2 games in a season that is going nowhere and they have ample forwards to fill in for the irreplaceable Josh for 2 games. www.habseyesontheprize.com/latest-news/2022/11/6/23443507/josh-anderson-suspended-for-boarding-alex-pietrangelo-habs-lineup-news |
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Post by folatre on Nov 7, 2022 14:56:30 GMT -5
The problem with having to create daily content while having no access to the hockey club is that a lot of silly takes get authored.
If the plan for Slafkovsky was to only give him a 9 game cup of coffee, management would not change it because Anderson is suspended for two games. But everyone could have seen well before the Vegas game that the plan for the kid has nothing to do with preventing year 1 of his ELC from being used up.
Now, of course, the plan going forward from here may or may not be contingency based. Could Slafkovsky be denied participation in the World Juniors because he is playing so well for the Habs for because management thinks he needs to urgently work on aspects of his game in Laval? I hope not. I think he should go lead a competitive Slovakia team try to win a medal. If Slafkovsky goes to the WJC, upon his return will Gorton and Hughes manage his appearances in the Habs lineup so as to ensure that he does not reach the 40 game mark? I do not know about that.
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Post by frozone on Nov 16, 2022 10:58:28 GMT -5
Slaf was excellent last night. He was noticeable and responsible. He had 4 shots in 12:24 of ice time, and at least a couple more shots that missed the net. And man, he can really hammer the puck.
When we compare his current game to what it was in Game 1 of training camp or even the season opener, it's hard to dispute that the kid is on a good development path. I even think that he'll score a respectable number of goals if he can continue to put up shots like he has been for the past handful of games. He's getting quality looks despite the low ice time.
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Post by habsorbed on Nov 16, 2022 11:20:04 GMT -5
Slaf was excellent last night. He was noticeable and responsible. He had 4 shots in 12:24 of ice time, and at least a couple more shots that missed the net. And man, he can really hammer the puck. When we compare his current game to what it was in Game 1 of training camp or even the season opener, it's hard to dispute that the kid is on a good development path. I even think that he'll score a respectable number of goals if he can continue to put up shots like he has been for the past handful of games. He's getting quality looks despite the low ice time. "Despite the low ice time" and the slugs on his line. With Drouin out, Hoff going back into his shell for another month, hopefully Slafs can get Monahan as his centre, and really develop. He certainly shows he's got all the tools including a head for the game. |
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Post by habsask on Nov 16, 2022 17:43:34 GMT -5
"Despite the low ice time" and the slugs on his line. With Drouin out, Hoff going back into his shell for another month, hopefully Slafs can get Monahan as his centre, and really develop. He certainly shows he's got all the tools including a head for the game.[/quote]
Just curious since I don't see the games is Evans now regarded as a "slug"?
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Post by Skilly on Nov 16, 2022 19:53:16 GMT -5
"Despite the low ice time" and the slugs on his line. With Drouin out, Hoff going back into his shell for another month, hopefully Slafs can get Monahan as his centre, and really develop. He certainly shows he's got all the tools including a head for the game. Just curious since I don't see the games is Evans now regarded as a "slug"? [/quote] Evans is not going to bring out Slafkovsky’s offensive potential. So , IMO, yes he is |
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Post by habsorbed on Nov 16, 2022 22:16:15 GMT -5
"Despite the low ice time" and the slugs on his line. With Drouin out, Hoff going back into his shell for another month, hopefully Slafs can get Monahan as his centre, and really develop. He certainly shows he's got all the tools including a head for the game. Just curious since I don't see the games is Evans now regarded as a "slug"? Evans is not going to bring out Slafkovsky’s offensive potential. So , IMO, yes he is[/quote] Evans is a decent 4th line centre. Slafs, a first overall pick, needs to be a 1st line winger and to get there he needs to develop with offensive type centres and get more than 10 minutes a game. |
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Post by habsorbed on Nov 26, 2022 2:01:11 GMT -5
I know I'm the only one who thought Slafs should be sent down. But after he took the big hit yesterday in the Hawks game and went to the locker room, I started wondering if maybe he ain't ready for the quick pace and/or the smaller ice. That's 2 shots to Slafs' head and he hasn't played 20 games yet. Are we risking serious injury, concussions, by playing him in The Show too soon? BTW, I see Wright was sent down and is lighting it up  |
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Post by habsorbed on Nov 26, 2022 3:40:39 GMT -5
Boy, Toews and Kane are shadows of their former selves. Hawks will be lucky to get a 2nd rounder for each of them.
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Post by Willie Dog on Nov 26, 2022 9:28:46 GMT -5
Boy, Toews and Kane are shadows of their former selves. Hawks will be lucky to get a 2nd rounder for each of them. I was thinking that while watching the game... everyone knows the Hawks want to unload them so they will get lowballed... unless some scared for his job GM does something stupid |
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Post by Boston_Habs on Nov 27, 2022 15:14:34 GMT -5
I’d send him to Kitchener in the OHL and let him score as many goals as possible. Laval and the AHL generally would be the worst place to send a guy to work on his offensive game.
Slaf really doesn’t have a large body of work as a scorer, which is what he’s supposed to be.
Send him to junior and let him light it up with his buddy Mesar.
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Post by folatre on Nov 27, 2022 18:14:43 GMT -5
Does Kitchener have Slafkovsky's junior rights? I never even really considered the OHL as a possibility. I figured if Montreal did not want him to go back to the top flight in Finland, then the pathway was basically all Habs or some mixture of Habs/World Juniors/Laval.
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Post by jkr on Nov 27, 2022 19:05:11 GMT -5
Boy, Toews and Kane are shadows of their former selves. Hawks will be lucky to get a 2nd rounder for each of them. I was thinking that while watching the game... everyone knows the Hawks want to unload them so they will get lowballed... unless some scared for his job GM does something stupid What GM did you have in mind? Would his initials be KD by any chance? Or maybe McCrimmon - he seems to get dazzled by the next shiny object. |
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Post by Willie Dog on Nov 27, 2022 19:50:28 GMT -5
I was thinking that while watching the game... everyone knows the Hawks want to unload them so they will get lowballed... unless some scared for his job GM does something stupid What GM did you have in mind? Would his initials be KD by any chance? Or maybe McCrimmon - he seems to get dazzled by the next shiny object. Dubas does not fear losing his job now... Im thinking Edmonton, st Louis, New Jersey, Florida, vegas |
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Post by folatre on Nov 27, 2022 21:29:24 GMT -5
Toews, even when he was a 1C and in his playoff God years, was never the quickest cat on the ice. And he is light years away from his best version. So maybe he is only worth a second (but honestly it could be a bit more).
However, if Kane is waiving the NMC for more than just one or two teams, the return for Chicago will be hefty. Kane's pace has not diminished much and his skill (hands, vision, pass, shot) has not really diminished at all. Whoever (Rangers, Leafs, Colorado, Vegas, etc.) wants him is giving up a first rounder and a grade A prospect because none of those type of suitors can make it work cap-wise without Chicago retaining. So, in essence, the winner of the Kanes's sweepstakes will be paying not only for the greatness of the player but also the willingness of the Blackhawks to ease the cap constraints of the contending club.
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Post by Boston_Habs on Nov 28, 2022 10:46:50 GMT -5
Does Kitchener have Slafkovsky's junior rights? I never even really considered the OHL as a possibility. I figured if Montreal did not want him to go back to the top flight in Finland, then the pathway was basically all Habs or some mixture of Habs/World Juniors/Laval. I don't know if management made any promises to Slaf, but Kitchener owns his junior rights. I'd honestly prefer he spend a year tearing up junior than plugging away in the AHL. At a minimum, I don't think he loses much by foregoing 10 minutes a night in the NHL and not seeing the puck go in the net very often. I look at Slaf's hockeydb page and the lack of recorded production is shocking. 5 goals in 31 games for TPS Turku in 2021-22, 7 goals in 7 games for Slovakia in the 2022 Olympics, and 3 goals in 16 games in the NHL. That's a total of 15 goals scored in official settings. In contrast, Cole Caufield scored 175 goals over 4 years between USHL and NCAA before arriving in Montreal. And it shows. He knows how to score goals because he's scored a ton of them. Slaf needs at least a year where he scores 50-60 goals, finding different ways get his shot off, different angles, experimenting, having fun, dominating. Like Caufield did. Scorers want to score and as much as Slaf wants to stay in Montreal, I'm afraid we risk sucking a bit of the life and confidence out of the kid. |
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Post by Willie Dog on Nov 28, 2022 11:37:44 GMT -5
Does Kitchener have Slafkovsky's junior rights? I never even really considered the OHL as a possibility. I figured if Montreal did not want him to go back to the top flight in Finland, then the pathway was basically all Habs or some mixture of Habs/World Juniors/Laval. I don't know if management made any promises to Slaf, but Kitchener owns his junior rights. I'd honestly prefer he spend a year tearing up junior than plugging away in the AHL. At a minimum, I don't think he loses much by foregoing 10 minutes a night in the NHL and not seeing the puck go in the net very often. I look at Slaf's hockeydb page and the lack of recorded production is shocking. 5 goals in 31 games for TPS Turku in 2021-22, 7 goals in 7 games for Slovakia in the 2022 Olympics, and 3 goals in 16 games in the NHL. That's a total of 15 goals scored in official settings. In contrast, Cole Caufield scored 175 goals over 4 years between USHL and NCAA before arriving in Montreal. And it shows. He knows how to score goals because he's scored a ton of them. Slaf needs at least a year where he scores 50-60 goals, finding different ways get his shot off, different angles, experimenting, having fun, dominating. Like Caufield did. Scorers want to score and as much as Slaf wants to stay in Montreal, I'm afraid we risk sucking a bit of the life and confidence out of the kid. Mesar looks like he's enjoying his time in Kitchener.. Does Slaf still get the same pay in the OHL? On capfriendly Slaf has $3.5M in perf bonuses... |
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Post by seventeen on Nov 28, 2022 15:30:36 GMT -5
The question persists. The issue I have with sending him to the AHL is that I don't know if I can trust J F Houle to bring him along as well as the coaches in Montreal. There were too many examples last year of Houle playing vets in favour of the kids.
Send him to juniour? Maybe. In the meantime, I can see the Habs lending him to the Slovak WJC team for the 3 or 4 weeks or so. I suspect Mesar will be there as well. A step back for almost a month would likely help him with the production part and getting used to seeing pucks go in the net.
Regarding that production that Boston Habs points out above, one point is that Slaf is always playing well ahead of his age group. That doesn't excuse him as other 17 year olds have put up numbers in the Finnish Liga, but he's such a big guy that the question of his muscles and tendons catching up to his size arises. That's what Hughes and Bobrov are counting on, that at 20 and 21 he's going to be a much different player than today's version. Does he just need time at the current level, or does he need to take a step back before taking 2 steps forward? The WJC may give us an answer.
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Post by Boston_Habs on Nov 28, 2022 16:05:27 GMT -5
Regarding that production that Boston Habs points out above, one point is that Slaf is always playing well ahead of his age group. I agree with your overall sentiment and it's probably not a fair comparison, but people said the same thing about Kotkaniemi when excusing his lack of production when he was drafted. "He was an underage kid playing with older guys". Put him with people his age and he would have dominated. Well, we know how that turned out. I bet if KK had spent a year in Canadian junior, he probably would have produced but I also think the holes in his offensive and skating game would have been exposed. It's a common problem with European players in general that the better ones are are often playing up with older more physically mature players but then the production isn't there so there is a lot more projecting or guessing where the player might be in 2-3 years. Slafkovsky is a different player from KK, but I'm getting a bit tired excusing lack of production because of playing with older kids. The best way to test that is to play him with his age group in a league he can/should dominate and watch him do it. Slaf will never light up the AHL - nobody does. It's just not that kind of league, too many pluggers, career AHLers, 3rd/4th line players, etc. I'm not sure what is being accomplished by keeping him in Montreal. I'd send him to junior and tell him to have fun scoring goals. |
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Post by Willie Dog on Nov 28, 2022 16:15:11 GMT -5
Regarding that production that Boston Habs points out above, one point is that Slaf is always playing well ahead of his age group. I agree with your overall sentiment and it's probably not a fair comparison, but people said the same thing about Kotkaniemi when excusing his lack of production when he was drafted. "He was an underage kid playing with older guys". Put him with people his age and he would have dominated. Well, we know how that turned out. I bet if KK had spent a year in Canadian junior, he probably would have produced but I also think the holes in his offensive and skating game would have been exposed. It's a common problem with European players in general that the better ones are are often playing up with older more physically mature players but then the production isn't there so there is a lot more projecting or guessing where the player might be in 2-3 years. Slafkovsky is a different player from KK, but I'm getting a bit tired excusing lack of production because of playing with older kids. The best way to test that is to play him with his age group in a league he can/should dominate and watch him do it. Slaf will never light up the AHL - nobody does. It's just not that kind of league, too many pluggers, career AHLers, 3rd/4th line players, etc. I'm not sure what is being accomplished by keeping him in Montreal. I'd send him to junior and tell him to have fun scoring goals. Him and Mesar would have fun |
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Post by Skilly on Nov 28, 2022 16:34:55 GMT -5
At least Slaf isn’t playing out of position like Kk was forced to, do let’s end that comparison right there. Because when KK did play Center , well I’ve posted those stats many times , why go there again?
So if we send Slaf to Kitchener and he doesn’t “dominate”, doesn’t put up lots of goals, then what? We trade him? We consider him a bust and don’t give him another chance in Montreal? What exactly is the plan then?
In Kitchener, he won’t be on an NHL contract. Who looks after his needs? He is currently used to living on a $930,000 salary and all of a sudden he has to go back to a $500 stipend? Can’t make car payments on that.
He looks lost on the ice. He passes instead of shoots, he falls down a lot, and he coughs the puck up way too much. Will Kitchener develop better habits? Maybe. But before sending him anywhere, how about we actually put him with players that think like him … and not third and fourth liners. I’d even let him watch from the press box with a coach to show him what Caufield and Suzuki do yo get open and create space.
I dunno, I just have a hard time giving up on him this year when he really has not been given much to work with
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Post by seventeen on Nov 28, 2022 17:33:06 GMT -5
One journalist (what do you call people like Brian Wilde for example, who tweet a lot and are balanced and capable enough, but aren't on MSM?) tweeted a few plays where Slaf made a good move, set up a guy for a good chance and it was Evans or Pezzetta and they missed. What if it was Caufield or Monahan or Suzuki? (notice I omitted Gallagher and Anderson  ). So there have been flashes. Not scintillating flashes, but things like one play I saw where he was along the right defensive boards after he had corralled a clearing pass along the boards and another forward was coming at him. So he's got the dman on his back, a forward racing at him from the centre and the immediate play is to try and get it past the incoming forward because you can't go back along the boards. That's a situation where there's a turnover far too often. Instead, Slaf holds onto the puck a split second longer than the forward expects, opening up a passing lane. Slaf THEN gives the puck to his centre who is breaking up the ice on the zone exit. Things like that where he displays a high panic threshhold gives you hope. It is a defining feature (to me) of potential stardom. Average players panic too quickly and don't allow a play to change. Going back to Boston's reply above, I mentioned that other 17 year olds had produced. Heck, KK had more points as a 17 year old in the same league (.51 ppg) than Slafkovsky, playing on a weak team. Slaf's numbers were .32 ppg. He played in only about half as many games as KK, but he doesn't have the skating issues, and he scored on bigger stages that were smaller samples. I really like the idea of letting him go to the WJC, where he might play with Mesar, and hopefully put up big points. If Wright is there for Canada, consider the story lines! Then you may be more informed in order to make a decision for the rest of the year. |
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Post by Boston_Habs on Nov 28, 2022 21:57:25 GMT -5
So if we send Slaf to Kitchener and he doesn’t “dominate”, doesn’t put up lots of goals, then what? We trade him? We consider him a bust and don’t give him another chance in Montreal? What exactly is the plan then? It honestly didn’t occur to me that Slaf wouldn’t dominate in the OHL: I mean, he was the #1 pick in the draft and a physical specimen at 18. I’m not saying he would need to score 50 goals but I’m convinced he’d be a force in the league playing with his buddy. If he can’t then we made a huge mistake drafting him. That’s the only point. Scoring goals and working on subtle ways to become an even better goal scorer. Sometimes we over complicate things, giving him protected minutes, power play time, give him enough but not too much, working on some of the more technical or positional aspects of the pro game. Or you can let him score goals. I think he hasn’t done enough of that. I know it’s junior and you can’t extrapolate success there in the NHL but I believe scoring goals becomes a self reinforcing thing, you see the puck go in, it gives you confidence to try different things, the puck keeps going in, and you’re a sniper like Cole Caufield in a 6’3” 220 pound body. |
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). So there have been flashes. Not scintillating flashes, but things like one play I saw where he was along the right defensive boards after he had corralled a clearing pass along the boards and another forward was coming at him. So he's got the dman on his back, a forward racing at him from the centre and the immediate play is to try and get it past the incoming forward because you can't go back along the boards. That's a situation where there's a turnover far too often. Instead, Slaf holds onto the puck a split second longer than the forward expects, opening up a passing lane. Slaf THEN gives the puck to his centre who is breaking up the ice on the zone exit. Things like that where he displays a high panic threshhold gives you hope. It is a defining feature (to me) of potential stardom. Average players panic too quickly and don't allow a play to change.