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Post by HABsurd on Nov 28, 2022 22:37:13 GMT -5
One journalist (what do you call people like Brian Wilde for example, who tweet a lot and are balanced and capable enough, but aren't on MSM?) Brian Wilde is the hockey analyst and commentator for Global News Montreal. He has a regular spot on their morning show. |
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Post by seventeen on Nov 29, 2022 0:38:57 GMT -5
One journalist (what do you call people like Brian Wilde for example, who tweet a lot and are balanced and capable enough, but aren't on MSM?) Brian Wilde is the hockey analyst and commentator for Global News Montreal. He has a regular spot on their morning show. I knew he worked for Global but I didn’t equate that to guys like Engels who follow the team around. I may be underrating him. |
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Post by PTH on Nov 29, 2022 1:16:44 GMT -5
I'm not sure what is being accomplished by keeping him in Montreal. I'd send him to junior and tell him to have fun scoring goals. Apparently the goal is to have him improve conditioning/cardio while learning the game in the bigs. IE, he'd be good enough for a larger role (as seen by his occasional PP time) but isn't quite there yet, physically. |
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Post by habsorbed on Nov 29, 2022 2:45:50 GMT -5
It won't surprise anyone to hear me say this is a no brainer. I don't see any benefits in continuing this experiment of playing the guy 10 minutes a game with slugs and hoping that suddenly he's going to get it, and everything is going to fall into place. It is more likely he doesn't get it, gets frustrated and low on his confidence, assuming he doesn't get injured. He clearly is not ready for the NHl. He is constantly falling, and getting hit and rarely is an offensive threat.
By the way, NONE OF THE TOP 10 PICKS FROM THE 2022 DRAFT ARE PLAYING IN THE NHL except for Slafs. Is Slafs that special? It's not like he is some generational player that was clearly HEAD AND SHOULDERS above his class. There was great debate whether he should be picked first. Just because Habs picked him first doesn't anoint him as a great player that is ready for the NHL!
Any rookie playing like Slafs at this point would be sent down. But somehow because he was #1 overall, everyone thinks he should be in the NHL. We've given him a try, albeit with inadequate line mates and he can't do it. I'd be prepared to give him. little longer if he was with better players. but as that isn't going to happen, let him play with his age group in juniors so he can develop his play and his confidence. The fact he can play with his fellow countryman and friend is an added factor. Who knows, maybe they comfort each other and become a dynamic duo in junior and the future.
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Post by Willie Dog on Nov 29, 2022 7:11:52 GMT -5
It won't surprise anyone to hear me say this is a no brainer. I don't see any benefits in continuing this experiment of playing the guy 10 minutes a game with slugs and hoping that suddenly he's going to get it, and everything is going to fall into place. It is more likely he doesn't get it, gets frustrated and low on his confidence, assuming he doesn't get injured. He clearly is not ready for the NHl. He is constantly falling, and getting hit and rarely is an offensive threat. By the way, NONE OF THE TOP 10 PICKS FROM THE 2022 DRAFT ARE PLAYING IN THE NHL except for Slafs. Is Slafs that special? It's not like he is some generational player that was clearly HEAD AND SHOULDERS above his class. There was great debate whether he should be picked first. Just because Habs picked him first doesn't anoint him as a great player that is ready for the NHL! Any rookie playing like Slafs at this point would be sent down. But somehow because he was #1 overall, everyone thinks he should be in the NHL. We've given him a try, albeit with inadequate line mates and he can't do it. I'd be prepared to give him. little longer if he was with better players. but as that isn't going to happen, let him play with his age group in juniors so he can develop his play and his confidence. The fact he can play with his fellow countryman and friend is an added factor. Who knows, maybe they comfort each other and become a dynamic duo in junior and the future. Imo the only reason he is still with the club and not in Laval is maybe they don't trust Houle to develop him or worried about some AHL lifer try to make a name for himself... After the WJCs, send him to Kitchener to play with Mesar... |
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Post by seventeen on Nov 29, 2022 14:13:30 GMT -5
It won't surprise anyone to hear me say this is a no brainer. I don't see any benefits in continuing this experiment of playing the guy 10 minutes a game with slugs and hoping that suddenly he's going to get it, and everything is going to fall into place. It is more likely he doesn't get it, gets frustrated and low on his confidence, assuming he doesn't get injured. He clearly is not ready for the NHl. He is constantly falling, and getting hit and rarely is an offensive threat. By the way, NONE OF THE TOP 10 PICKS FROM THE 2022 DRAFT ARE PLAYING IN THE NHL except for Slafs. Is Slafs that special? It's not like he is some generational player that was clearly HEAD AND SHOULDERS above his class. There was great debate whether he should be picked first. Just because Habs picked him first doesn't anoint him as a great player that is ready for the NHL! Any rookie playing like Slafs at this point would be sent down. But somehow because he was #1 overall, everyone thinks he should be in the NHL. We've given him a try, albeit with inadequate line mates and he can't do it. I'd be prepared to give him. little longer if he was with better players. but as that isn't going to happen, let him play with his age group in juniors so he can develop his play and his confidence. The fact he can play with his fellow countryman and friend is an added factor. Who knows, maybe they comfort each other and become a dynamic duo in junior and the future. Imo the only reason he is still with the club and not in Laval is maybe they don't trust Houle to develop him or worried about some AHL lifer try to make a name for himself... After the WJCs, send him to Kitchener to play with Mesar... That may well be their biggest worry. It's all about controlling his development and unless they have complete trust to whom they are handing him over, they'd rather keep him close. For example, a great league to send him to would be the SHL in Sweden. Except they are notorious for using 18 year olds on their 4th lines, so no different there. To me, it's either a choice of Montreal or Kitchener, but a lot depends on how he does at the WJC (if he goes there). If he kills it, he stays in Montreal. |
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Post by folatre on Nov 29, 2022 14:27:19 GMT -5
Sending Slafkovsky to the WJC seems like a no-brainer, but I would be surprised if he plays in the OHL. Is Laval a good option? Well, it is not as good an option as I would have imagined before the season started. Unfortunately, the Rocket looks borderline dysfunctional on the ice. But management still has a lot of runway before the kid approaches the 40 game mark.
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Post by habsorbed on Nov 29, 2022 15:36:05 GMT -5
I don't see why Kitchener is such a big issue. The vast, vast majority of picks go back to their junior team after being selected and the NHL team loses control of their development for the year. That's normal the process. While Slafs hasn't played in Kitchener before, he has a close buddy there who seems to be doing quite well. Let the kid play, have some fun, get his confidence and develop.
Is anyone aware of a first round draft choice that played 4th line in the NHL the year they were drafted and developed well? Either they can make an impact playing 15 minutes TOI with good players or they should not be in the league at that young age.
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Post by jkr on Nov 29, 2022 16:02:09 GMT -5
I don't see why Kitchener is such a big issue. The vast, vast majority of picks go back to their junior team after being selected and the NHL team loses control of their development for the year. That's normal the process. While Slafs hasn't played in Kitchener before, he has a close buddy there who seems to be doing quite well. Let the kid play, have some fun, get his confidence and develop. Is anyone aware of a first round draft choice that played 4th line in the NHL the year they were drafted and developed well? Either they can make an impact playing 15 minutes TOI with good players or they should not be in the league at that young age. What about Lafreniere? I dont know his minutes but whenever I saw the Rangers play (which was not a lot) he wasn't on a top line. He showed progression over the 1st two seasons but only has 3 goals right now. |
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Post by Skilly on Nov 29, 2022 16:09:29 GMT -5
*cough*Kirby Dach *cough*
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Post by habsorbed on Nov 29, 2022 18:33:36 GMT -5
*cough*Kirby Dach *cough* Dach was not playing 4th line with limited minutes. in fact he started the season at centre on the first line with Kane on his wing. |
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Post by Skilly on Nov 29, 2022 18:45:39 GMT -5
*cough*Kirby Dach *cough* Dach was not playing 4th line with limited minutes. in fact he started the season at centre on the first line with Kane on his wing. Toews was Kane’s Center , and the other winger was Debrincat Dach was playing like 13 mins a game and on lines with Andrew Shaw, Dylan Strome, Alexander Nylander and Dominik Kubalik www.hockey-reference.com/players/d/dachki01/scoring/2020Of Dach’s 23 points his first year, Kane was in on 4. And look at the ice time numbers to start off his career. These aren’t first or second line minutes www.hockey-reference.com/players/d/dachki01/gamelog/2020 |
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Post by habsorbed on Nov 29, 2022 23:57:34 GMT -5
Dach was not playing 4th line with limited minutes. in fact he started the season at centre on the first line with Kane on his wing. Toews was Kane’s Center , and the other winger was Debrincat Dach was playing like 13 mins a game and on lines with Andrew Shaw, Dylan Strome, Alexander Nylander and Dominik Kubalik www.hockey-reference.com/players/d/dachki01/scoring/2020Of Dach’s 23 points his first year, Kane was in on 4. And look at the ice time numbers to start off his career. These aren’t first or second line minutes www.hockey-reference.com/players/d/dachki01/gamelog/2020The stats show Dach was certainly playing with better line mates than Evans and Pizza and getting more ice time. |
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Post by Skilly on Nov 30, 2022 9:43:58 GMT -5
The stats show Dach was certainly playing with better line mates than Evans and Pizza and getting more ice time. You didn’t ask that though . 🤐🤣😂 |
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Post by frozone on Nov 30, 2022 10:21:36 GMT -5
The stats show Dach was certainly playing with better line mates than Evans and Pizza and getting more ice time. Dach's usage bounced around a lot. Here were his most common linemates per year: 2019-20 Dach/Debrincat/Strom (17.5%) Dach/Carpenter/Smith (9.9%) Dach/Debrincat/Kampf (9.2%) 2020-21 Dach/Kane/Debrincat (22%) Dach/Strome/Debrincat (10.5%) Dach/Debrincat/Hagel (9.7%) 2021-22Dach/Kane/Debrincat (15.3%) Dach/Kurashev/Kubalik (9.9%) Dach/Kurashev/Entwistle (4.8%) linkhttps://frozenpool.dobbersports.com/players/kirby-dachIn Chicago, he certainly had good linemates and pretty decent ice time as well. What he didn't get was stability. His role changed a lot and he often switched between center and wing. That is no way to develop. Slafkovsky's role has been pretty unwavering since day 1. And I know the production isn't there, but some of his numbers are really encouraging considering he's playing a 4th line role. For instance, in his last 13 games, he has 22 shots for an avg of 1.69 shots per game. But when you consider that he's been on the 4th line and playing 11 min/game, that isn't bad at all. Its actually very good even if you ignore the fact that he's playing with scrubs. Hypothecically, if he played 18 minutes per game with those same 4th line scrubs, he would produce 227 shots over 82 games. That would be good enough to rank in the top 50 for shots last season, right in line with Aho and Huberdeau despite playing with the likes of Pezzeta. Once he has top line minutes AND linemates, that pace will only improve I have no doubt. My only worry with Slaf is what we saw last night - where he passed up good shooting opportunities. He hasn't really been doing that, and if it starts to become a habit then I would consider sending him down to the OHL. Hopefully he gets back to firing pucks on NHL goalies. Whether it's from the 1st line or 4th line doesn't matter so much imo. Further developing his shooting mentality is going to be the key for his development. |
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Post by Willie Dog on Nov 30, 2022 11:28:16 GMT -5
The stats show Dach was certainly playing with better line mates than Evans and Pizza and getting more ice time. Dach's usage bounced around a lot. Here were his most common linemates per year: 2019-20 Dach/Debrincat/Strom (17.5%) Dach/Carpenter/Smith (9.9%) Dach/Debrincat/Kampf (9.2%) 2020-21 Dach/Kane/Debrincat (22%) Dach/Strome/Debrincat (10.5%) Dach/Debrincat/Hagel (9.7%) 2021-22Dach/Kane/Debrincat (15.3%) Dach/Kurashev/Kubalik (9.9%) Dach/Kurashev/Entwistle (4.8%) linkhttps://frozenpool.dobbersports.com/players/kirby-dachIn Chicago, he certainly had good linemates and pretty decent ice time as well. What he didn't get was stability. His role changed a lot and he often switched between center and wing. That is no way to develop. Slafkovsky's role has been pretty unwavering since day 1. And I know the production isn't there, but some of his numbers are really encouraging considering he's playing a 4th line role. For instance, in his last 13 games, he has 22 shots for an avg of 1.69 shots per game. But when you consider that he's been on the 4th line and playing 11 min/game, that isn't bad at all. Its actually very good even if you ignore the fact that he's playing with scrubs. Hypothecically, if he played 18 minutes per game with those same 4th line scrubs, he would produce 227 shots over 82 games. That would be good enough to rank in the top 50 for shots last season, right in line with Aho and Huberdeau despite playing with the likes of Pezzeta. Once he has top line minutes AND linemates, that pace will only improve I have no doubt. My only worry with Slaf is what we saw last night - where he passed up good shooting opportunities. He hasn't really been doing that, and if it starts to become a habit then I would consider sending him down to the OHL. Hopefully he gets back to firing pucks on NHL goalies. Whether it's from the 1st line or 4th line doesn't matter so much imo. Further developing his shooting mentality is going to be the key for his development. Over passing is a disease, it kills power plays and opportunities... and it can spread through a team... if the top guys over pass then the lesser ones will over pass... Fix the 1st PP unit first then work on the others |
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Post by folatre on Dec 4, 2022 20:58:59 GMT -5
I have not heard anything, but one would have to imagine that if Slafkovsky is going to the WJC then his last game in December with the Habs will probably be against Tampa on the 17th. Montreal hits the road the following week and Team Slovakia must want to convene their kids in Moncton a few days before the tournament starts.
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Post by habsorbed on Dec 5, 2022 1:01:02 GMT -5
I have not heard anything, but one would have to imagine that if Slafkovsky is going to the WJC then his last game in December with the Habs will probably be against Tampa on the 17th. Montreal hits the road the following week and Team Slovakia must want to convene their kids in Moncton a few days before the tournament starts. I don't know if WJC would do Slafs much good. Sure he might excel but not likely given his team mates. And getting beat, perhaps badly, by the world powers won't be that much fun. Although it would be interesting to see what he could do with Mesar if they were on the same line. But if he continues to play with Monahan, I'd just assume he stays with Le Club. And last thing I want is Wright exacting some revenge for that humiliating day in July.  |
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Post by seventeen on Dec 5, 2022 2:19:00 GMT -5
The Slovak team would be a powerful one. Nemec could be there and Dalibor Dvorsky is a top 10 pick this year. Definitely not a pushover.
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Post by habsorbed on Dec 6, 2022 2:13:04 GMT -5
I know I'm the only one who thought Slafs should be sent down. But after he took the big hit yesterday in the Hawks game and went to the locker room, I started wondering if maybe he ain't ready for the quick pace and/or the smaller ice. That's 2 shots to Slafs' head and he hasn't played 20 games yet. Are we risking serious injury, concussions, by playing him in The Show too soon? BTW, I see Wright was sent down and is lighting it up  Another high hit on Slafs. That's 3 significant hits in less than 19 games. I don't see this ending well if he continues to play in the NHL this year. He's not ready. |
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Post by Willie Dog on Dec 6, 2022 8:47:37 GMT -5
I know I'm the only one who thought Slafs should be sent down. But after he took the big hit yesterday in the Hawks game and went to the locker room, I started wondering if maybe he ain't ready for the quick pace and/or the smaller ice. That's 2 shots to Slafs' head and he hasn't played 20 games yet. Are we risking serious injury, concussions, by playing him in The Show too soon? BTW, I see Wright was sent down and is lighting it up Another high hit on Slafs. That's 3 significant hits in less than 19 games. I don't see this ending well if he continues to play in the NHL this year. He's not ready. He needs MSL and HuGo to sit him down, tell him they want him at the WJCs and then finish the year in the OHL... He needs to learn to keep his head on a swivel... The NHL is not the place to learn... the OHL is |
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Post by folatre on Dec 6, 2022 10:57:25 GMT -5
Slovakia will be competitive. New Jersey certainly seems like the type of progressive organization that will welcome Nemec representing his country and growing step by step.
Yeah, Slafkovsky does not have very good awareness of where opponents are on the ice. Just because Schenn should not have hit him (hence the interference penalty) does not mean a kid should not expect to get hit there.
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Post by Willie Dog on Dec 8, 2022 8:47:19 GMT -5
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Post by Scotty D on Dec 8, 2022 17:10:09 GMT -5
given the limited sample size in the example its a tough call but i've always been of the belief that character matters immensely when dealing with these types of decisions, Some guys need to be thrown to the fire because they only make it that much hotter other guys end up like the water you don't want on it. As a fan looking on from the outside obviously it's harder to see this but given the track record thus far it seems like he's a throw to the fire type guy to me. |
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Post by Willie Dog on Dec 8, 2022 17:26:04 GMT -5
given the limited sample size in the example its a tough call but i've always been of the belief that character matters immensely when dealing with these types of decisions, Some guys need to be thrown to the fire because they only make it that much hotter other guys end up like the water you don't want on it. As a fan looking on from the outside obviously it's harder to see this but given the track record thus far it seems like he's a throw to the fire type guy to me. True it is a smaller sample size but the key is he proved himself which means he is ready... I would still seriously consider sending him to the WJCs not just for him but to also help the tank... |
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Dec 8, 2022 17:39:03 GMT -5
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Post by folatre on Dec 8, 2022 18:02:37 GMT -5
I would send Slafkovsky to Moncton, but I get it. NHL experience is like no other. So if that is the decision, then management and coaches have to concede they will just have to hurt whatever vet feelings need to be hurt with fourth line duty. Because it would be mystifying to keep Slafkovsky in Montreal while the WJC is going on in order to send the kid over the boards with guys like Pitlick, Evans, Pezzetta, and Belzile.
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Post by seventeen on Dec 9, 2022 1:24:28 GMT -5
He does indeed need to play top 9 at worst and top 6 preferably. It's a shame Monahan got hurt (let's hope it's short term) because he's the ideal centre IMO for Slaf. Too, I don;t think we can understate the benefit of being coached by MSL rather than a juniour coach.
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Post by Skilly on Feb 24, 2023 8:03:29 GMT -5
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Post by habsorbed on Feb 24, 2023 13:36:21 GMT -5
Sadly, I think last year will prove to be a weak draft year. Just our luck we got the first overall. Missed Bedard by one year. Sandwiched between Bedard and Power  |
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