Dubois

[habsorbed]

Jun 25, 2023 20:50:30 GMT -5 Willie Dog said:

Jun 25, 2023 20:46:12 GMT -5 seventeen said:

If Dubois had put up 90 points in his 73 games last year, he might command a higher contract than Suzuki and I think Nick would understand. Suzuki had 3 more points, in 11 more games, but playing for a decimated team. It doesn't equate, paying PLD more than $8MM.

Add to that Cole played 46 games before being on IR for the rest of the season... how many more points would Suze have gotten if Cole played the full season?

And wasn't Suze way up there in ppg until Cole got hurt?

[Andrew]

The latest from Twitter:

[jkr]

Isn't it up to Winnipeg to decide where he goes or is he screwing around with the Jets by shrinking his list?

They are making it sound like he is a UFA.

[folatre]

For sure, Winnipeg can trade him wherever they want. But I suppose, with more than a little justification, Chevaldayoff feels that the return from a team Dubois refuses to negotiate a contract with will be worse than the return from the Kings, Montreal or whoever else may have been on the list Brisson gave Blake.

Some teams on his list (Colorado, Tampa and Boston, this is my speculation that they were included) are in win now mode and have nothing remotely decent to give the Jets in terms of 'A' tier prospects and valuable picks.

[jkr]

And Colorado will be off any list now after picking up Johansen for next to nothing.

Could be a coincidence but the Bruins have dumped Hall's 6 million cap hit to Chicago.

[jkr]

I was browsing HF boards and their Dubois thread is 352 pages. C'mon guys.

[Disgruntled70sHab]

Jun 26, 2023 11:47:54 GMT -5 Andrew said:

The latest from Twitter:

Good find, Andrew ... not sure what Pierre-Luc Dubois is expecting salary wise, but he won't be making more than the captain, Nick Suzuki ... Kent Hughes is on record as saying, that players coming to Montreal have to understand that forwards won't be making more than Suzuki ... honestly, acquiring PLD would make the team instantly better, I got that, but I'd prefer if the organization were to just bypass kissing his ring, and keep on course ...

Cheers.

[PTH]

Jun 26, 2023 16:52:14 GMT -5 Disgruntled70sHab said:

Jun 26, 2023 11:47:54 GMT -5 Andrew said:

The latest from Twitter:

Good find, Andrew ... not sure what Pierre-Luc Dubois is expecting salary wise, but he won't be making more than the captain, Nick Suzuki ... Kent Hughes is on record as saying, that players coming to Montreal have to understand that forwards won't be making more than Suzuki ... honestly, acquiring PLD would make the team instantly better, I got that, but I'd prefer if the organization were to just bypass kissing his ring, and keep on course ...

Cheers.

I understood that he said the exact opposite... that the Suzuki contract wasn't a hard cap.

[Skilly]

Hughes said that no one on a ELC would get more than Suzuki on their second contract. He actually clarified that a UFA could get more than Suzuki ‘s contract.

The fact Montreal has re-engaged indicates to me that the money is settled, it’s what Montreal has to give up that is the sticking point

Dovetailing two points into one post. I’m against giving up Dach for Dubois. But I think there is deal to be made where we don’t give up Dach

[Willie Dog]

Jun 26, 2023 17:18:48 GMT -5 PTH said:

Jun 26, 2023 16:52:14 GMT -5 Disgruntled70sHab said:

Good find, Andrew ... not sure what Pierre-Luc Dubois is expecting salary wise, but he won't be making more than the captain, Nick Suzuki ... Kent Hughes is on record as saying, that players coming to Montreal have to understand that forwards won't be making more than Suzuki ... honestly, acquiring PLD would make the team instantly better, I got that, but I'd prefer if the organization were to just bypass kissing his ring, and keep on course ...

Cheers.

I understood that he said the exact opposite... that the Suzuki contract wasn't a hard cap.

There might be some double speak going on but in the article Dis posted... "Hughes said it was important that Suzuki remained the highest-paid forward in the organization."

I think the team would give a contract that has a bigger AAV than Suze but that player must be a stud... PLD isn't a stud... he may yet be but he may stay exactly as he is right now... a nice top 6 player with size

[seventeen]

Jun 26, 2023 15:40:28 GMT -5 jkr said:

And Colorado will be off any list now after picking up Johansen for next to nothing.

Could be a coincidence but the Bruins have dumped Hall's 6 million cap hit to Chicago.

I saw a couple of tweets complimenting Trotz for gaining $4MM in cap space without having to give up any draft picks. That puts a different spin on Johansen if those tweeters have any hockey analysis abilities. Not common.

Chicago is being run by their owner, I think. Being the son of the guy who built the fortune (Bill Wirtz), Rocky Wirtz may fit the profile of the guy who runs it into the ground. Hall is a declining asset and Wirtz seems to think he's still the 27 year old who put up 93 points instead of the full season 48 point, 31 year old of yester year. Morons. They did Boston a huge favour. Didn't even ask for draft picks. A$$holes. C'mon Kent. Take the Hawks to the cleaners again. Trade Anderson or Dvorak for Lukas Reichel and Kevin Korchinski. Hell, we'll even throw in pick #31

[Skilly]

Jun 26, 2023 17:35:26 GMT -5 Willie Dog said:

Jun 26, 2023 17:18:48 GMT -5 PTH said:

I understood that he said the exact opposite... that the Suzuki contract wasn't a hard cap.

There might be some double speak going on but in the article Dis posted... "Hughes said it was important that Suzuki remained the highest-paid forward in the organization."

I think the team would give a contract that has a bigger AAV than Suze but that player must be a stud... PLD isn't a stud... he may yet be but he may stay exactly as he is right now... a nice top 6 player with size

Remained the highest paid after the Caufield signing … not be the highest paid forward on the team forever, or even starting next season (that’s how I took it)

[PTH]

Jun 26, 2023 17:30:45 GMT -5 Skilly said:

Hughes said that no one on a ELC would get more than Suzuki on their second contract. He actually clarified that a UFA could get more than Suzuki ‘s contract.

The fact Montreal has re-engaged indicates to me that the money is settled, it’s what Montreal has to give up that is the sticking point

Dovetailing two points into one post. I’m against giving up Dach for Dubois. But I think there is deal to be made where we don’t give up Dach

Apparently money hasn't been discussed with anyone...
I'd think the issue for LA is moving out enough cap to make this work. I'm guessing Winnipeg ends up looking at a return that includes bad deals from LA or a lesser deal without truly bad contracts, from Montreal.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Boston or Nashville swoop in and grab him.

[habsorbed]

Jun 27, 2023 0:07:40 GMT -5 PTH said:

Jun 26, 2023 17:30:45 GMT -5 Skilly said:

Hughes said that no one on a ELC would get more than Suzuki on their second contract. He actually clarified that a UFA could get more than Suzuki ‘s contract.

The fact Montreal has re-engaged indicates to me that the money is settled, it’s what Montreal has to give up that is the sticking point

Dovetailing two points into one post. I’m against giving up Dach for Dubois. But I think there is deal to be made where we don’t give up Dach

Apparently money hasn't been discussed with anyone...
I'd think the issue for LA is moving out enough cap to make this work. I'm guessing Winnipeg ends up looking at a return that includes bad deals from LA or a lesser deal without truly bad contracts, from Montreal.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Boston or Nashville swoop in and grab him.

I find it hard to belive money hasn't been discussed. To me that is the first domino that must fall if Chevy has any gm acumen. Chevy ain't getting a decent return unless the PLD suitor knows they have PLD locked up to a tidy contract. Otherwise PLD is no more than a 1 year rental and Chevy ain't getting much for that.

Having said all that, if you're correct (where are you getting that from?), that may be good for us. As then PLD can be traded, play out the year and sign with his hometown and we give up nothing.

[PTH]

Jun 27, 2023 1:03:20 GMT -5 habsorbed said:

Jun 27, 2023 0:07:40 GMT -5 PTH said:

Apparently money hasn't been discussed with anyone...
I'd think the issue for LA is moving out enough cap to make this work. I'm guessing Winnipeg ends up looking at a return that includes bad deals from LA or a lesser deal without truly bad contracts, from Montreal.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Boston or Nashville swoop in and grab him.

I find it hard to belive money hasn't been discussed. To me that is the first domino that must fall if Chevy has any gm acumen. Chevy ain't getting a decent return unless the PLD suitor knows they have PLD locked up to a tidy contract. Otherwise PLD is no more than a 1 year rental and Chevy ain't getting much for that.

Having said all that, if you're correct (where are you getting that from?), that may be good for us. As then PLD can be traded, play out the year and sign with his hometown and we give up nothing.

Info is here : www.danslescoulisses.com/pierre-luc-dubois-na-pas-la-permission-de-parler-aux-kings/

[Skilly]

Darren Dreger reporting that PLD has indicated he’d prefer to play in LA over Montreal

[jkr]

So how did all the Dubois to Montreal stuff start. Wishful thinking?

If that's how he feels, then drop it now.

[Willie Dog]

Jun 27, 2023 10:19:20 GMT -5 Skilly said:

Darren Dreger reporting that PLD has indicated he’d prefer to play in LA over Montreal

I posted this in another thread

If that happens, then PLD is what he is, a douche who leveraged montreal for a better deal... just like smarmy Shanny and all the other guys who did this.

[jkr]

And I'm old enough to remember Brett Hull pulling this crap on Andre Savard.

[jkr]

Jun 27, 2023 10:19:20 GMT -5 Skilly said:

Darren Dreger reporting that PLD has indicated he’d prefer to play in LA over Montreal

There goes the bidding war. LA is competing against itself.

[habsorbed]

Jun 27, 2023 2:47:08 GMT -5 PTH said:

Jun 27, 2023 1:03:20 GMT -5 habsorbed said:

I find it hard to belive money hasn't been discussed. To me that is the first domino that must fall if Chevy has any gm acumen. Chevy ain't getting a decent return unless the PLD suitor knows they have PLD locked up to a tidy contract. Otherwise PLD is no more than a 1 year rental and Chevy ain't getting much for that.

Having said all that, if you're correct (where are you getting that from?), that may be good for us. As then PLD can be traded, play out the year and sign with his hometown and we give up nothing.

Info is here : www.danslescoulisses.com/pierre-luc-dubois-na-pas-la-permission-de-parler-aux-kings/

Seems more like speculation than any definitive information if they don't provide any sources. And why does Brisson's name keep coming up if there are no contract talks with other teams?

If the speculation is correct then Chevy is a fool. He would recieve so much more in return from the Kings (or Habs) if that team knows they have PLD locked up. I can't see any advantage to Chevy by not allowing teams to speak to PLD.

If LA is all over this because Burgerhead likes PLD then that might be a good indication PLD ain't that good and we should walk away.

[habsorbed]

HuGo should ask themselves one question. If PLD had not said he wanted to go to MTl, would PLD be on their radar screen. If the answer is "no", then move on.

[PTH]

Jun 27, 2023 11:43:07 GMT -5 habsorbed said:

Jun 27, 2023 11:17:18 GMT -5 habsorbed said:

Seems more like speculation than any definitive information if they're not providing a source. And why does Brisson's name keep coming up if there are no contract talks with other teams?

But if it is correct then Chevy is a fool. He would recieve so much more in return from the Kings (or Habs) if that team knows they have PLD locked up. I can't see any advantage to Chevy by not allowing teams to speak to PLD.

If LA is all over this because Burgerhead likes PLD then that might be a good indication PLD ain't that good and we should walk away.

The point is that Winnipeg won't let the contract talks begin until they are sure there is an agreement on the trade. No, the trade doesn't move forward without the contract, but you don't give him permission to talk to another team until the trade is ready to go.

[habsorbed]

Jun 27, 2023 11:46:50 GMT -5 PTH said:

Jun 27, 2023 11:43:07 GMT -5 habsorbed said:

The point is that Winnipeg won't let the contract talks begin until they are sure there is an agreement on the trade. No, the trade doesn't move forward without the contract, but you don't give him permission to talk to another team until the trade is ready to go.

I guess it is a chicken and egg debate, but how does a team know what to give up if they don't know how long they have PLD or at what price. And you can say the negoatiations are built on the assumption that the team will get PLD long term and at a doable salary. But that makes little sense becaue then Chevy goes through all these negotiations with LA, Habs and whoever else, only to have PLD say he's not happy with the contract offer from that team. That makes a waste of all the gms' efforts, and that other gm has put themself in an untenable position having given up a ransom on the belief of a long term deal and only getting a rental.

As i've said, the only process that makes sense is for PLD to have a tentative deal with the other team and Chevy starts trade talks. This would help Chevy get the best return but also he places the other gm in a tough position as the other team would be all in knowing they got PLD long term and will likely not want to lose that and thus give up more to close the deal. It's not unlike putting an offer in on a house. Sure you don't want to get in on a bidding war, but any agent will tell you that once a client puts in an offer they become emotionally invested as they have started to dream about how wonderful life will be in their dream home, or dream first line centre.

[seventeen]

Jun 27, 2023 0:07:40 GMT -5 PTH said:

Jun 26, 2023 17:30:45 GMT -5 Skilly said:

Hughes said that no one on a ELC would get more than Suzuki on their second contract. He actually clarified that a UFA could get more than Suzuki ‘s contract.

The fact Montreal has re-engaged indicates to me that the money is settled, it’s what Montreal has to give up that is the sticking point

Dovetailing two points into one post. I’m against giving up Dach for Dubois. But I think there is deal to be made where we don’t give up Dach

Apparently money hasn't been discussed with anyone...
I'd think the issue for LA is moving out enough cap to make this work. I'm guessing Winnipeg ends up looking at a return that includes bad deals from LA or a lesser deal without truly bad contracts, from Montreal.

I wouldn't be surprised to see Boston or Nashville swoop in and grab him.

Boston doesn't have any young, impact type players to give Winnipeg. Nor any draft picks, which Chevy isn't primarily interested in. Cheveldayoff is not Kyle Davidson (or Rocky Wirtz lurking in the background). Nashville might, with Askarov in the background and Kemell and Tomasino. But they're not ready to compete by any stretch.

[seventeen]

Jun 27, 2023 11:46:50 GMT -5 PTH said:

Jun 27, 2023 11:43:07 GMT -5 habsorbed said:

The point is that Winnipeg won't let the contract talks begin until they are sure there is an agreement on the trade. No, the trade doesn't move forward without the contract, but you don't give him permission to talk to another team until the trade is ready to go.

My impression is that the Jets could squeeze more out of a team if a contract had already been agreed upon. If a team is 80% on the way to it's goal, (and the contract is likely that much a part of the overall deal), then they would be more reluctant to pull out and more likely to improve an offer. There's an axiom in business about doing the hardest or most distasteful thing first. Once it's out of the way, everything else feels easier.

[Cranky]

It looks like Dubois is dead to me...

LA gave up a ton to get him and 8.5x8. The 8.5 doesn't bother me but the asset cost is obscene.

I don't EVER want to hear another word about lack of Quebecois players. They don't care to go home so why would the Habs have to overpay through the nose to get them.

[drkcloud]

Report: Kings acquire Dubois on 8-year, $68M pact in trade with Jets
www.thescore.com/nhl/news/2669846

Time to move on. Another quebecois without the heart to try to measure up with past greats. Enjoy anonymity in LA and don't come looking for the nostalgia contract in 8 years

[jkr]

Jun 27, 2023 15:49:38 GMT -5 drkcloud said:

Report: Kings acquire Dubois on 8-year, $68M pact in trade with Jets
www.thescore.com/nhl/news/2669846

Time to move on. Another quebecois without the heart to try to measure up with past greats. Enjoy anonymity in LA and don't come looking for the nostalgia contract in 8 years

Should be interesting to watch. Kopitar will be 36 soon & is on the last year of his deal. Its early but Byfield is developing slowly so that makes Dubois the # 1 guy, doesn't it?

Also, Doughty will be 34 in December and has 4 years left at 11 per. How do the Kings make the numbers work? How do they sign a goalie?

[Willie Dog]

Jun 27, 2023 15:43:23 GMT -5 Cranky said:

It looks like Dubois is dead to me...

LA gave up a ton to get him and 8.5x8. The 8.5 doesn't bother me but the asset cost is obscene.

I don't EVER want to hear another word about lack of Quebecois players. They don't care to go home so why would the Habs have to overpay through the nose to get them.

I agree and the Habs should be vocal when a player or his agent say they want to come to montreal.. Screw Douchbois and the only benefit is we only have to see his ugly mug a couple of times a year