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Post by BadCompany on Jun 23, 2009 11:58:26 GMT -5
...with Bettman getting involved, you can pretty much shut down any idea of a plan that has a marquee player moving from of his darling US expansion franchise to a Canadian one. Yeah, I think this too... Bettman doesn't care whether or not they're losing money, he's all about the optics. And trading Lecavalier (and St. Louis??) would pretty much destroy that franchise... |
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Post by Boston_Habs on Jun 23, 2009 11:58:39 GMT -5
...with Bettman getting involved, you can pretty much shut down any idea of a plan that has a marquee player moving from of his darling US expansion franchise to a Canadian one. I can't disagree with that. I'm sure Bettman will side with the owner who wants to spend more money and keep Vinny, rather than the one who wants to cut payroll and trade Vinny. Never mind if the team loses money. |
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Post by jkr on Jun 23, 2009 12:05:04 GMT -5
...with Bettman getting involved, you can pretty much shut down any idea of a plan that has a marquee player moving from of his darling US expansion franchise to a Canadian one. I can't disagree with that. I'm sure Bettman will side with the owner who wants to spend more money and keep Vinny, rather than the one who wants to cut payroll and trade Vinny. Never mind if the team loses money. They both own the team. How can he side with one or the other? Their positions don't seem to lean toward any kind of reconciliation. All he can do is tell them to work out their differences. But I agree that he would probably lean towards Barrie's way of thinking - keep VL & spend to the cap. Maybe this is all a brilliant misdirection by BG & he is really talking to someone else.  |
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Post by Doc Holliday on Jun 23, 2009 12:27:38 GMT -5
I can't disagree with that. I'm sure Bettman will side with the owner who wants to spend more money and keep Vinny, rather than the one who wants to cut payroll and trade Vinny. Never mind if the team loses money. They both own the team. How can he side with one or the other? Their positions don't seem to lean toward any kind of reconciliation. All he can do is tell them to work out their differences. But I agree that he would probably lean towards Barrie's way of thinking - keep VL & spend to the cap. Maybe this is all a brilliant misdirection by BG & he is really talking to someone else. ...I'm thinking that if they need Buttman involved it's because this would lead to some type of shotgun clause that would have one owner buying the other OR the NHL itself temporarily buying one and partnering with the other. Rumor is that Koules is the one with the real money but obviously not to the point of being happy with bleeding money right and left. Barrie may very well be interested in spending like a feverish poker player in Vegas but if Koules closes the purse's strings what will he do ? As for Bob, maybe he's working on something else but looking at past summer plans (Shanahan, Brière, Sundin) Bob tends to bet on his chosen horse until that option is completely dead before moving to something else and the timing of that urgent meeting in Tampa appears driven by a deadline. |
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Post by jkr on Jun 23, 2009 13:14:27 GMT -5
They both own the team. How can he side with one or the other? Their positions don't seem to lean toward any kind of reconciliation. All he can do is tell them to work out their differences. But I agree that he would probably lean towards Barrie's way of thinking - keep VL & spend to the cap. Maybe this is all a brilliant misdirection by BG & he is really talking to someone else. ...I'm thinking that if they need Buttman involved it's because this would lead to some type of shotgun clause that would have one owner buying the other OR the NHL itself temporarily buying one and partnering with the other. Rumor is that Koules is the one with the real money but obviously not to the point of being happy with bleeding money right and left. Barrie may very well be interested in spending like a feverish poker player in Vegas but if Koules closes the purse's strings what will he do ? As for Bob, maybe he's working on something else but looking at past summer plans (Shanahan, Brière, Sundin) Bob tends to bet on his chosen horse until that option is completely dead before moving to something else and the timing of that urgent meeting in Tampa appears driven by a deadline. I would believe Koules is the one with the money. He's probably made a lot with The Saw series and Two and a Half Men. Barrie, I think, is trying to sell his real estate holdings in B.C. Lecavalier's NTC kicks in July 1st doesn't it? Can't see this ownership mess being resolved before then. |
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Post by HabSolute on Jun 23, 2009 14:50:25 GMT -5
That's a pretty funny trade proposal. TB must want to dump salary pretty bad to not even ask for any of our top prospects (Pacioretty, Lats, McDonagh, Subban, SKost, etc.). Maybe we can throw in Audette and Czerkawski too! One guy wants to dump One guy wants to spend to the cap With the feud exploding out in the open, it's now pretty clear what was holding up the Vinny trade. ...with Bettman getting involved, you can pretty much shut down any idea of a plan that has a marquee player moving from of his darling US expansion franchise to a Canadian one. Did Koules win the debate ? www2.tbo.com/content/2009/jun/23/bettman-koules-has-lightnings-final-say/sports-lightning/ |
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Post by duster on Jun 23, 2009 16:23:03 GMT -5
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Post by cigarviper on Jun 23, 2009 16:31:35 GMT -5
Will be taking Friday afternoon off work to watch the draft. Might have to do a stick. You interested? Let me know. Cheers. You know I don't need much arm twisting, but Friday afternoon may not work, rather, I'll have to work. |
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Post by Habs_fan_in_LA on Jun 23, 2009 16:48:48 GMT -5
Imagine being a hockey fan in Tampa Bay with the Enola Gay dropping leaflets saying Megatrade is imminant?
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Post by roke on Jun 23, 2009 17:25:09 GMT -5
Interesting rumour, and the Tampa ownership meeting result makes it even more interesting, but even then I think I'll keep my expectations low (If I can  ). Lecavalier's contract still scares me. Also, like Skilly I don't think the numbers add up well enough for the rumour Doc posted to go through. It would be a tight squeeze in any case, and I love salary cap flexibility. I guess if you do get Vinny you're willing to throw that away though. Finally, why tender a contract to Kovalev but not Koivu? If you're shipping Plekanec in a deal for Lecavalier, and you don't re-sign Koivu, you're going into next season with Lapierre/Chipchura/Metropolit/Maxwell as your #2 centre. Sure, Lecavalier fixes the size-up-the-middle problem, but what about having a tiny bit of depth? I'd take Koivu's faceoff ability, two-way play, and play when it matters (one of our few forwards who went after Chara this past season) over Kovalev's brilliance on the powerplay and heavy minutes, but that's just me. If you could sign Koivu to an extension before executing the trade (with him having an understanding that the trade is going through), Lecavalier publicly squashes any captain's controversy upon arriving, we get our depth (with a great 1-2 punch down the middle) |
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jun 23, 2009 22:13:36 GMT -5
I was thinking along the same lines, CV. We've seen it before; the come-and-goes WRT a changing of the guard. One year Gainey added 10 new faces to the lineup and it was Carbonneau who had to sort it all out. IMO, he did well in that. Still, with 10 UFAs on our club and no one signed thus far, I'm thinking Gainey might have some sort of plan up his sleeve. And you may very well be right ... a wholesale changing of the guard may just happen ... again. Will be taking Friday afternoon off work to watch the draft. Might have to do a stick. You interested? Let me know. Cheers. Draft doesn't start until 7PM Dis. You don't need the whole afternoon off.  Actually I noticed the draft start time when I got home from work this evening. (clears throat) May still have to take the afternoon off though. A cigar is on the books for Friday afternoon. Cheers. |
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Post by HFTO on Jun 23, 2009 22:17:05 GMT -5
Well this news might possibly change things unless Vinny somehow is involved and he brokers a deal by submitting a list of teams buying the Lightning more time.
However if a deal is imminent and falls through from our end as always seeems to be reported after the fact I'm worried once again the Habs will come up rolling a big snake eyes again with our usual plan B-Z's.
HFTO
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Post by seventeen on Jun 23, 2009 23:44:24 GMT -5
Gainey has sometimes fooled everyone with a move or deal. (the Ribeiro one comes to mind....sorry, couldn't resist). Hiring Jacques Martin is the best example and most recent one. I wonder if.......if possibly....a Mr Kovalchuk is in the sights?
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jun 23, 2009 23:59:39 GMT -5
Gainey has sometimes fooled everyone with a move or deal. (the Ribeiro one comes to mind....sorry, couldn't resist). Hiring Jacques Martin is the best example and most recent one. I wonder if.......if possibly....a Mr Kovalchuk is in the sights? That's the guy I actually want more than Vinny. Of course, we would still need a big centre. |
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Post by CrocRob on Jun 24, 2009 1:13:00 GMT -5
Kovalchuk sure would beat my "Kovalchuk nobody talks about" in Gaborik. However, I highly doubt he's available. The Asst GM in Atlanta (formerly of Chicago he just switched and will be taking over some of Waddell's responsibilities**) was on FAN590 today and very much sounded like they were adding to that team, not subtracting. Trading Kovalchuk doesn't make sense. It's not like their payroll can actually go lower. They have to meet the floor. Trading Kovalchuk doesn't help that.
** This is inferred from the conversation, but seriously Waddell is stretched way, way too thin. He's the GM for the Thrashers, involved int he GM duties for the Hawks, an executive of both clubs, and is in charge of arena operations. Whose great idea was this?!
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Post by blny on Jun 24, 2009 5:01:13 GMT -5
Kovalchuk sure would beat my "Kovalchuk nobody talks about" in Gaborik. However, I highly doubt he's available. The Asst GM in Atlanta (formerly of Chicago he just switched and will be taking over some of Waddell's responsibilities**) was on FAN590 today and very much sounded like they were adding to that team, not subtracting. Trading Kovalchuk doesn't make sense. It's not like their payroll can actually go lower. They have to meet the floor. Trading Kovalchuk doesn't help that. ** This is inferred from the conversation, but seriously Waddell is stretched way, way too thin. He's the GM for the Thrashers, involved int he GM duties for the Hawks, an executive of both clubs, and is in charge of arena operations. Whose great idea was this?! They may not have a choice. Kovalchuk is entering the last year of his contract. If he waivers at all on the notion of a new contract I think they have to seriously consider moving him. |
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Post by Boston_Habs on Jun 24, 2009 8:43:00 GMT -5
Kovalchuk sure would beat my "Kovalchuk nobody talks about" in Gaborik. However, I highly doubt he's available. The Asst GM in Atlanta (formerly of Chicago he just switched and will be taking over some of Waddell's responsibilities**) was on FAN590 today and very much sounded like they were adding to that team, not subtracting. Trading Kovalchuk doesn't make sense. It's not like their payroll can actually go lower. They have to meet the floor. Trading Kovalchuk doesn't help that. ** This is inferred from the conversation, but seriously Waddell is stretched way, way too thin. He's the GM for the Thrashers, involved int he GM duties for the Hawks, an executive of both clubs, and is in charge of arena operations. Whose great idea was this?! They may not have a choice. Kovalchuk is entering the last year of his contract. If he waivers at all on the notion of a new contract I think they have to seriously consider moving him. **Drool** Kovalchuk is a huge prize. I don't think he'll sign with Atlanta but if people are right and the cap goes down next year he won't exactly be hitting the UFA market at the best time. I would back up the truck for this guy. A pure sniper. Makes me think we should keep Kovalev just to add a selling point to attracting a guy like Kovalchuk, as I think the Russian kids really look up to Alex. |
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Post by blny on Jun 24, 2009 10:17:29 GMT -5
I think Ilya is dying for a hockey market and a better supporting cast. He's a man alone for the most part. I see little reason for him to stay at this point.
I'd certainly be laying the ground work. If Waddell would consider a deal that had a strong list of players, but didn't completely raid the cupboards, and then futures if Montreal could re-sign Ilya I'd be all over it.
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Post by Anardil1 on Jun 24, 2009 10:46:38 GMT -5
AAAAhhhhhhhh yes.......the required French Media/Fans wet dream. Not only do the Habs get Vinnie, the Bolts throw in Mini-Marty AND arguably their best d-man on their current roster. The Habs give up little. Doc said that the "rumour" came from a forum, didn't Jean Perron mention that this was imminent? I see that Johnny is off his meds again. I can't believe that there are fans that actually fall for these fantasies.  |
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jun 24, 2009 11:38:02 GMT -5
Even if Gainey pulls of a major deal, I'm wondering how many of those UFAs will feel slighted that they were left on the back burner for so long.
Mega-trade or no, it's getting very late in the process now and I think we're looking at a vast makeover to the lineup.
Anyone else getting a bit discouraged with the uncertainties?
Cheers.
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Post by CrocRob on Jun 24, 2009 12:49:24 GMT -5
If Gainey PULLS OFF his mega-trade, I think I wouldn't be so slighted. Besides, any of the UFAs who feels like they ought to take precedence over Lecavalier probably won't jive well in the locker room. Koivu included. As much as he's the long-time captain of the team, he's the long-time captain of the team during it's 2nd worst -- it could be argued worst -- era in the history of the club.
The more I think about this, the more I think Tanguay is the guy who's actually being ignored. I think he's the guy who doesn't get and offer if Vinny ends up here, and does get the offer if he doesn't.
As for the uncertanties, it's not like Gainey has never been unprepared without a plan but he's sure cutting it close this time.
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Post by CrocRob on Jun 24, 2009 13:22:30 GMT -5
Another possible kink in the works -- Kari Ramo has signed in the KHL. They might have interest in Halak now.
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Post by blny on Jun 24, 2009 13:52:24 GMT -5
I'd put Halak in the deal if it meant retaining the first or Gorges. We can find a veteran back up for pretty cheap. Hell, if Cujo wants to hold the bench down for what Halak got, sign him.
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Post by Habs_fan_in_LA on Jun 24, 2009 16:44:14 GMT -5
If Gainey PULLS OFF his mega-trade, I think I wouldn't be so slighted. Besides, any of the UFAs who feels like they ought to take precedence over Lecavalier probably won't jive well in the locker room. Koivu included. As much as he's the long-time captain of the team, he's the long-time captain of the team during it's 2nd worst -- it could be argued worst -- era in the history of the club. The more I think about this, the more I think Tanguay is the guy who's actually being ignored. I think he's the guy who doesn't get and offer if Vinny ends up here, and does get the offer if he doesn't. As for the uncertanties, it's not like Gainey has never been unprepared without a plan but he's sure cutting it close this time. Lecavalier rumors come and go and unfortunately keep coming. Everyone from Eklund to Nostradamus has started one. Yep, it would be nice, but for the 1,000th time, I'm not holding my breath. Still it would be nice. Anybody want to start a rumor that Brittney Spears wants to have my child? Not likely either. |
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Post by CrocRob on Jun 24, 2009 17:02:48 GMT -5
If Gainey PULLS OFF his mega-trade, I think I wouldn't be so slighted. Besides, any of the UFAs who feels like they ought to take precedence over Lecavalier probably won't jive well in the locker room. Koivu included. As much as he's the long-time captain of the team, he's the long-time captain of the team during it's 2nd worst -- it could be argued worst -- era in the history of the club. The more I think about this, the more I think Tanguay is the guy who's actually being ignored. I think he's the guy who doesn't get and offer if Vinny ends up here, and does get the offer if he doesn't. As for the uncertanties, it's not like Gainey has never been unprepared without a plan but he's sure cutting it close this time. Lecavalier rumors come and go and unfortunately keep coming. Everyone from Eklund to Nostradamus has started one. Yep, it would be nice, but for the 1,000th time, I'm not holding my breath. Still it would be nice. Anybody want to start a rumor that Brittney Spears wants to have my child? Not likely either. I think we're all aware that Lecavalier is a moonshot away, but I'm just trying to put everything together so it makes sense. Gainey holding out until the draft for a Lecavalier deal fits how things are going down. It's going to be a busy week next week, regardless of how the draft turns out. |
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Post by jkr on Jun 24, 2009 17:11:35 GMT -5
Even if Gainey pulls of a major deal, I'm wondering how many of those UFAs will feel slighted that they were left on the back burner for so long. Cheers. I think they would feel energized by the deal & may be more inclined to sign. |
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jun 24, 2009 17:21:10 GMT -5
Even if Gainey pulls of a major deal, I'm wondering how many of those UFAs will feel slighted that they were left on the back burner for so long. Cheers. I think they would feel energized by the deal & may be more inclined to sign. Actually I was asking how many would feel inclined to sign. You're saying all of them would be energized? Cheers. |
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Post by jkr on Jun 24, 2009 18:52:35 GMT -5
I think they would feel energized by the deal & may be more inclined to sign. Actually I was asking how many would feel inclined to sign. You're saying all of them would be energized? Cheers. Just a feeling Dis, nothing more. |
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Post by jkr on Jun 24, 2009 18:55:28 GMT -5
Saw TSN's draft coverage tonight.
They talked about the big names that might be traded - Heatley, Marleau, Gomez etc. The panel, McGuire, Dreger, McKenzie all had possible destinations for them. When the host asked about VL & if he would be moved this weekend, their answers were all the same - an emphatic no. Take it FWIW.
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Post by Andrew on Jun 24, 2009 21:25:24 GMT -5
Saw TSN's draft coverage tonight. They talked about the big names that might be traded - Heatley, Marleau, Gomez etc. The panel, McGuire, Dreger, McKenzie all had possible destinations for them. When the host asked about VL & if he would be moved this weekend, their answers were all the same - an emphatic no. Take it FWIW. McKenzie and Dreger are among the most connected reporters as far as player movement is concerned. If that's their reaction then you'd have to think that they have inside information from the Bolts organization. |
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). Lecavalier's contract still scares me.
