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Post by Boston_Habs on May 15, 2012 16:33:10 GMT -5
Boston_HABS, personally I don’t particularly trust Timmins. Sure there’s the Esposito/Pacioretty thingy, but there are also the Kostitsyn/Getzlef, Uruqart/Bergeron, and Fisher/Giroux gaffs… You could be right. Bergevin isn't coming in cold, however. As assistant GM in Chicago you figure he has a pretty good dossier on the talent in the draft and detailed scouting reports from the Hawks staff. I doubt he will just take Timmins' word for it when it comes to the #3 pick. He should have his own opinions as well. |
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Post by Lord Bebop on May 25, 2012 14:31:31 GMT -5
Boston_HABS, personally I don’t particularly trust Timmins. Sure there’s the Esposito/Pacioretty thingy, but there are also the Kostitsyn/Getzlef, Uruqart/Bergeron, and Fisher/Giroux gaffs… I'm really not sure you can critique a head scouts record by breaking it down "pick by pick..... You really have to look at, how many NHL players he turns out overall..... You can make every single scout sucks in the nhl or scouted for a nhl team if you use your evaluation imo.... I don't think you can argue that Trevor Timmins has turned out one of the best crop of nhlers the last couple of years.....therefore he is one of the best if not the best in the NHL today IMO Grigorenko weaknesses may have been overstated..... He's got really good talent and should not be as easily dismissed as many have him. Not my top pick but if Timmons has him as our target, I can't argue with his judgment. I did take your comment out of context so perhaps I'm not seeing your point clearly enough.....  |
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Post by blny on May 25, 2012 15:11:49 GMT -5
Considering how Timmins rarely had final say on first round picks, I'm not going to be harsh or critical of him. If I had access to his pre-draft analysis and saw glaring oversights, then I would have grounds to question him.
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Post by Boston_Habs on May 25, 2012 15:25:33 GMT -5
This is one of those "I know someone who knows someone" kind of things, so take it FWIW:
The buzz is that Edmonton will take Ryan Murray and there are serious doubts about the Russians. Yakupov looked awful in the CHL playoffs and it's not a slam dunk that Columbus takes him. Too risky and the talent level of a guy like Yakupov at 18 years old is light years away from guys like Ovie, Malkin, and Kovalchuk at the same age.
It's just not a very strong draft and there is a very low degree of confidence in the top picks, which is somewhat unusual. Even in bad drafts, the top 3 picks are usually pretty solid and it drops off from there, but among the forwards in particular, nobody inspires much confidence. And Grigorenko will drop. Huge questions about his compete level. He plays a no-contact game.
I wouldn't be shocked to see Edmonton take Murray and Columbus take Galchenyuk with the #2 pick. Everybody seems to like his game and, just as important, his competitiveness. You would think you could trade down, but this is the kind of draft with so much uncertainty that you won't find teams willing to trade up.
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Post by Lord Bebop on May 25, 2012 15:34:36 GMT -5
This is one of those "I know someone who knows someone" kind of things, so take it FWIW: The buzz is that Edmonton will take Ryan Murray and there are serious doubts about the Russians. Yakupov looked awful in the CHL playoffs and it's not a slam dunk that Columbus takes him. Too risky and the talent level of a guy like Yakupov at 18 years old is light years away from guys like Ovie, Malkin, and Kovalchuk at the same age. It's just not a very strong draft and there is a very low degree of confidence in the top picks, which is somewhat unusual. Even in bad drafts, the top 3 picks are usually pretty solid and it drops off from there, but among the forwards in particular, nobody inspires much confidence. And Grigorenko will drop. Huge questions about his compete level. He plays a no-contact game. I wouldn't be shocked to see Edmonton take Murray and Columbus take Galchenyuk with the #2 pick. Everybody seems to like his game and, just as important, his competitiveness. You would think you could trade down, but this is the kind of draft with so much uncertainty that you won't find teams willing to trade up. Thanks!!! This draft seems wide open.... I would be shocked to see Yakupov available at three but your post makes lots of sense.... My fingers are cross we end up getting him..... According to most he is the one and only sure stud in the draft. |
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Post by Patty Roy on May 25, 2012 17:48:45 GMT -5
Thanks!!! This draft seems wide open.... I would be shocked to see Yakupov available at three but your post makes lots of sense.... My fingers are cross we end up getting him..... According to most he is the one and only sure stud in the draft. At the end of the day i don't think its going to happen, but i wouldn't be shocked to see Yakupov drop to us at 3. Even at the top end this draft seems pretty wide open. If a team identifies a player that they really want, i think they will just take him and not risk trading down. Its easy to suggest that if the Oilers want Murray they should just trade down a few spots, but who's to say that Columbus wouldn't gobble him up? Or somebody who really wants him puts in a big offer to trade up? Lots of rumors out there that the Oilers are high on Murray. If that's the case i think they just take him at #1 and call it a day. Columbus could very well go with Yakupov at #2, but given how Filatov and Zherdev worked out for them you've got to assume that they may not be all that interested in drafting another Russian with a very high pick. With Johansen and Brassard in the mix, they might actually prefer a winger to a C so i could see them being more into Forsberg than Galchenyuk. My guess is that they go with Forsberg. So in that scenario you've got Yakupov at #3. Now my qustion...is it a slam dunk that if Yakupov is there at #3 that we take him? Or might we be tempted to stick with the gameplan which i believe to be Galchenyuk. Interesting times...can't wait for the draft! |
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Post by blny on May 25, 2012 20:27:44 GMT -5
Nail missed time at the end of the season due to a concussion. I wouldn't be concerned about his iffy playoffs. I'd be more concerned that he came back before he should have. Up to the time of the injury, he had 69 points in 42 games. FWIW, he had 5 in 6 playoff games.
If he's available at 3, I wouldn't hesitate too much.
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Post by GNick99 on May 26, 2012 14:54:44 GMT -5
It's a Long Con!!! Montreal covets Grigorenko. Always have. But they always thought that they would be drafting around 5th to 7th and never expected such an epic team collapse. Since they figured they were going to be drafting 5th to 7th, and they want Grigorenko, they had to figure out a way to get Grigorenko to drop. What better way than to completely dismiss his play? Never directly of course, but why not get a former scout, currently a writer for TSN, to bad-mouth him on the internet? Heck they even got future coach Patrick Roy to “grudgingly” admit that “maybe Grigorenko isn’t ready for the NHL and isn’t mature enough.” Get some mono-ridden groupie to smooch with him before the playoffs start just to bring down his stats. "If Timmins doesn’t like him, there must be something wrong with him… maybe we had better pass!" say the other teams. Other teams being Columbus, who are deathly afraid of drafting another enigmatic Russian, the Islanders, who probably weren’t going to draft a forward anyways, and Toronto, an organization that prides itself on being all heart and soul, even though they are neither heart nor soul. Brian Burke would probably gag on his own ego should he have to draft Grigorenko, what with all the bad press floated by Timmins. So Toronto convinces themselves that they want Galchenyuk but are certain Montreal is going to take him. Float some “but you know Montreal might be interested in Teravainen” rumours and Burke will see an “opening” (deftly created by Trevor “don’t call me Sammy” Timmins), and think “hey, I can get that 3rd overall, take Galchenyuk, and Montreal will take Teravainen with the 5th, a much more sellable spot to take him in”. To Toronto: 3rd overall, 3rd round pick 2012. To Montreal: 5th overall, 2nd round pick 2013, 6th round pick 2013. Montreal picks up another 2nd round pick next year, which is supposed to be a much better draft (Toronto’s first would be nice, but unlikely), and they give up a 3rd this year, which is probably a garbage pick anyways, given the lack of depth in this draft. Toronto doesn’t have a 3rd or 4th rounder this year, and they have an extra 6th rounder next year, so they think they win all around. Stupid Toronto. Of course Montreal could just take Grigorenko at 3, but where is the fun in that?  long con: A "long con" is an extended setup in an attempt to rob or cheat someone else. it usually involved an elaborate story that is executed over many weeks to months, aimed at convincing the target that the con artist (or thief) is legitimately a friend and trustworthy resource. at the end of the long con, the con artist gets the victim to voluntarily put themselves in precisely the position the con artist wants them in.I like the idea of trading down, even more if Galchenyuk is gone at 3. To me it would be Teravainen over Grigorenko. |
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Post by GNick99 on Jun 1, 2012 14:45:51 GMT -5
Galchenyuk on the bike today...knee seemed alright
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Post by Patty Roy on Jun 1, 2012 22:25:32 GMT -5
I like the idea of trading down, even more if Galchenyuk is gone at 3. To me it would be Teravainen over Grigorenko. Personally i'm not all that interested in trading down (assuming we are talking about trading down a few spots to pick up a 2nd pick). We've already got 5 picks in the 2nd rounds the next two seasons. I'm more interested in seeing the team add the highest end prospect possible. I'd keep pick #3 and just take Forsberg if Galchenyuk/Yakupov are already gone. |
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Post by seventeen on Jun 2, 2012 0:41:55 GMT -5
NHL.com, on the Habs page, has interviews of players after the Scouting combine, as well as a clip of Trevor Timmins talking in general about the scouting and a few of the players. canadiens.nhl.com/index.htmlAfter watching the interviews, the guy that impressed me the most from a vocabulary and thinking process about the questions was Forsberg. After him, Galchenyuk. The Canadian kids, Dumba and Murray, might be great hockey players, but they're not much in the way of readers or speakers. Grigorenko has a definite language hurdle. |
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Post by GNick99 on Jun 2, 2012 8:24:47 GMT -5
I like the idea of trading down, even more if Galchenyuk is gone at 3. To me it would be Teravainen over Grigorenko. Personally i'm not all that interested in trading down (assuming we are talking about trading down a few spots to pick up a 2nd pick). We've already got 5 picks in the 2nd rounds the next two seasons. I'm more interested in seeing the team add the highest end prospect possible. I'd keep pick #3 and just take Forsberg if Galchenyuk/Yakupov are already gone. If the return was right I would be interested in trading down. Only if Galchenyuk is gone at 3 though. I think he will be franchise player. I have feeling Teravainen be as good as Forsberg, both are good first line material. Center I like more as usually more value. |
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Post by blny on Jun 2, 2012 15:50:34 GMT -5
I like Galchenyuk's interview. He's very well spoken. His English is fantastic. You can barely hear the accent. Seems like he's got some personality too.
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Post by GNick99 on Jun 3, 2012 12:17:28 GMT -5
I like Galchenyuk's interview. He's very well spoken. His English is fantastic. You can barely hear the accent. Seems like he's got some personality too. Gal is by far most rumoured to us at 3. Timmins is known for going off the board if he believes in the player ie. Carey Price 5th overall in 2005. I don't think he will do it for Teravainen but if team like Leafs willing to overpay for Galchenyuk chance Montreal does trade down. I don't see Timmins taking him over Gally or Forsberg. Ter wouldn't be my pick at 3. But if he ends up being our pick, I can tell you that I will be really excited 'cause for Timmins to make him, it surely means we will getting something way better than the majority thinks. |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jun 12, 2012 11:08:36 GMT -5
Okay, a little bit of my draft research to share with folks here. I have listed three players (plus an honourable mention) for each of the Habs current picks. Please note that the draft selection may move up one spot for all of the picks after the first round, as New Jersey has to default a first round pick and this seems the most likely year in which to do so (eg, 29th pick, stronger draft in 2013). I have left our original drafting spots for now.
I have tried to align with the type of players that the Habs seem to like, and of course insert my own personal bias and wishes!! In hindsight, I seem to have chosen more WHL players than QMJHL players, but that has a lot to do with who I think could be a BPA at the time the Habs are picking. Would I be opposed to more Hab selections from the WHL this year? Heck no, more kids that I can see live next season!!
I have not said too much about the first rounders, as they have been well documented in another thread. I have thrown some names in later rounds that you may have heard of, and hopefully some you have never heard mentioned before. My list is not in order of preference...so, onto the list:
Round 1 – 3rd:
Alex Galchenyuk, C, 6’1” 200, Sarnia (OHL) – A good-sized talented centre, but the obvious questions are how well has his knee recovered and how will a missed year of development impact him? A hard working, smart player, who has very strong work ethic. Has an international flare to him, as his dad was Belarusian, he was born in the US, and has lived all over Europe/North America due to his dad’s pro hockey career.
Filip Forsberg, C, 6’2” 180, Leksands (Swe 2) – The proverbial “safe” pick early on, as he seems to project to a good two-way forward. Hasn’t really produced enough offense in the Swedish second league that you would expect for such a high draft pick. The big question will be how will his offensive game translate into the NHL.
Ryan Murray, D, 6’0” 195, Everett (WHL) – Many consider him the best overall defender in a draft that is pretty decent on defense overall. He shockingly got the call in April at the World Championships – guess Kevin Lowe wanted a closer look at him against men.
Honourable Mention – Mikhail Grigorenko, C, 6’3” 200, Quebec (QMJHL) – The home run, high risk – high reward pick of the draft. You cannot teach size and skill. Consistency in his game is the big question, and whether he will stay a perimeter player.
Round 2 - 33rd:
Phil DiGuiseppe, LW, 5’11” 180, Univ of Michigan (NCAA) – Was invited to Canada’s selection camp for the WJC last December, which is impressive for a kid yet to be drafted. Good offensive skills, good vision, and strong cycle game. Needs to work on his defensive game. Has a great coach in Red Berenson. Had a good start to his freshman season, but tailed off a bit after Christmas. Not many kids his age jump straight to the NCAA.
Oscar Dansk, G, 6’2” 185, Brynas (Swe-Jr) – One of the top three goalies of this draft, so the Habs have to be thinking goalie at some point and he could very well be their BPA with this pick. He is a great puck handler, and has sound fundamentals and good mobility. Has played for Sweden at the World Junior A Challenge, the Ivan Hlinka and the U18s.
Dalton Thrower, D, 5’11” 190, Saskatoon (WHL) – He is Dietz’s teammate. Great PP skill set, plays very physical, and already has 22 WHL fights to his credit. Has good hands, but is only an average skater. A team may take him late first round, as his upside is pretty decent.
HM – Mark Jankowski, C, 6’2” 170, Stanstead College (Prep School) – One of the big unknowns in the draft: when will someone take this kid with all of his skill? His uncle, Ryan, is a scout for the Habs. Only two days away from being draft eligible in 2013, so very young and still not fully developed. Dominated his prep school league, has loads of finesse and skill. Still young and raw, so needs to get stronger physically and add strength to his skating. One of the big draft risers this past year.
Round 2 - 51st:
Lukas Sutter, C, 6’0” 215, Saskatoon (WHL) – Rich’s son who also plays alongside Dietz in Saskatoon. He is an ultimate pest, has a really solid two way game, plays physical and drops the mitts. His skating could definitely improve if he wants to keep up in the pros.
Tim Bozon, LW, 6’0” 175, Kamloops (WHL) – Son of French national and ex-NHLer Philippe. Incredible work ethic, fast and fearless, great vision, very quick feet. Has a good shot and was a point per game guy in Kamloops, while also showing some good toughness to his game.
Jordan Schmaltz, D, 6’2” 190, Green Bay (USHL) – Played for the US at the World Junior A Challenge. Led all first year USHL defenders in points. He is known for his offensive skill set, is a PP quarterback, and has great skating and passing. Will need to round out his defensive game at the next level.
HM – Henrik Samuelsson, C, 6’2” 210, Edmonton (WHL) – I had to include one Oil King! He is a product of the US national development system, despite where he played this past season. He came over from Sweden in the second half of the season after playing in the Modo system (Dad Ulf is the coach), and really improved in a short period of time. He does not have a quick first step, but has a decent stride. Good hands for a big guy, and he battles hard on the boards and in front of the net. Solid in all zones of the ice.
Round 3 - 64th:
Mike Winther, C, 6’0” 170, Prince Albert (WHL) – Played for Canada at the U18s. A good skater, with a great shot and he tends to shoot first. Good at both ends of the ice, but will need to get stronger.
Devin Shore, C, 6’0” 185, Whitby (OJHL) – OJHL rookie of the year and top prospect. Was the MVP and co-scoring leader at the World Junior A Challenge. Very offensively skilled, but needs to work on a quicker first step. He has committed to Maine in the NCAA in 2013.
Anton Slepyshev, LW, 6’2” 185, Novokuznetsk (KHL) – The Russian factor is alive and well in this kid, as he did not even come over to the Combine. But, you cannot teach talent and this kid has it. He is a good skater, goes to the net, has a good shot, and already plays in the KHL. Another high risk-reward since he has not yet shown signs of interest in coming over. Does the new Habs regime take gambles on skilled Russian kids like this?
HM – Matt Murray, G, 6’4” 170, Sault Ste Marie (OHL) – One of the starting goalies at the U18s for Canada. He has good size, and a very high compete level. Needs to work on his skating and his consistency.
Round 4 - 94th:
Charles Hudon, LW, 5’10” 170, Chicoutimi (QMJHL) – QMJHL rookie of the year in 10-11. He is a great skater and is very skilled. He played in the Ivan Hlinka for Canada. Needs to get stronger and better without the puck and in his own zone. There is still room for small and skilled players, but that might be why he is still available later on. Will he be strong enough at the next level?
Francis Beauvillier, C, 6’1” 180, Rimouski (QMJHL) – A good skater who plays a very solid two way game. Needs to get more physical (and stronger) and improve his on ice vision. Did ramp his game up in the playoffs this year on a surprising Rimouski team.
MacKenzie MacEachern, RW, 6’3” 180, Brother Rice (Michigan HS) – Another big bodied kid who is dominating in his US high school league. He was Mr Hockey in Michigan this year. He has strong skating and has a hard shot. He is still very raw due to his level of competition. He will likely jump to the USHL next season as he has committed to Michigan State later on.
HM – Jon Gillies, G, 6’5” 215, Indiana (USHL) – Amongst the USHL stats leaders in net, and has good agility and athleticism for a big goalie. Does need to add some overall lower body strength.
Round 6 - 154th:
Travis Brown, D, 6’1.5” 180, Moose Jaw (WHL) – Got lots more PP time due to Morgan Rielly’s injury this season. He is a good skater with a good shot, and plays a very solid physical game. Still needs to add size and strength to move to the next level.
Matt Pohlkamp, RW, 6’1” 200, Brainerd (Minn HS) – A big bodied, good skating kid who is dominating his US high school league. Very solid offensive skills, and a typical north-south rugged winger. He will jump straight to Bowling Green in the NCAA next season.
Patrik Bartosak, G, 6’ 0.5”, Red Deer (WHL) – Put up good numbers in the Czech junior leagues before coming over to Red Deer this past season. His season was cut short with a season ending shoulder injury, but he was making a mark early on.
HM – Anton Zhlobin, LW, 6’0” 190, Shawinigan (QMJHL) – Passed over in the 2011 draft. Has good offensive skills and now has a Memorial Cup championship to boot. Played with both Bournival and Ellis this season. His defensive game improved this year, but he still needs to engage a more physical element to his game. He looked very good in the playoffs this year. The Russian factor has to be diluted a bit considering his past few seasons in the CHL.
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Post by BadCompany on Jun 12, 2012 13:07:20 GMT -5
Great job NWT!
Personally I would add Teravainen as a possible, with our #3 pick. If Galchenyuk and Yakupov are gone 1-2 then I could see him being a possibility, along with Forsberg, Murray and Grigorenko. Yeah, he's small, but we're projecting 3-5 years from now, right? Hopefully his size isn't an issue then, as we will have loaded up with the big boys elsewhere.
For the second round I would like to see one of Tom Wilson or Michael Matheson fall to us. Would even consider moving up if one or both are hanging around in the late 20s. Granted, both are slated to go mid-first so the odds of them being remotely available are slim, but somebody's got to fall, right? Jankowski though is a very intriguing pick. We're talking about a kid who grew something like four inches in the last couple of years. He may still be growing considering how young he is. Certainly still filling out. Level of competition is of course a concern, but he could be a real sleeper pick, if he makes it to us.
On the goalie front, I wouldn't make it a priority, personally. Especially not at the top of the 2nd round. Maybe at the back of the second round, but even then. I've never been a huge fan of drafting goalies in the first place, especially not all that high. People think we have an organizational hole there - and we do - but is it really that big a deal? We have Price (a high pick, I know, I know) and he's going to be around for another decade, hopefully. So really we're looking at drafting his backup. And I don't really see a need to spend a pick on that. I think a free agent signing should do the trick. Somebody like Aaron Dell (or Yann Danis, back in the day) should work. You can sell Dell on the theory that if he spends one year in the AHL he'll be Price's backup once Budaj moves on. Couple them with a veteran AHL goalie like Sanford, and a veteran Backup Bob like Budaj and you're depth is okay. Not great, but okay. I'd rather go that route then watch somebody like Dansk play in Sweden.
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Post by duster on Jun 12, 2012 13:24:47 GMT -5
Wilson would be my pick at 33. He projects to be another Milan Lucic type and the team really needs a player like that. At worse, he's another Chris Nilan which is not a bad thing.
I would consider Subban if the team gets an extra second rounder should they trade down or he is still available at 51. He's most likely Team Canada's starting goalie at next year's WJC and it's hard to pass up a goalie of that caliber. So far, the team has heavily relied on Price to win games and that makes him a target. I dread the day when someone like Lucic thunders into him and gives him a concussion. To paraphrase someone, the future is uncertain and the end is always near. We need a solid NHL backup who can one day become a starter.
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jun 12, 2012 14:22:52 GMT -5
Exciting times, getting to talk draft picks!!
BC - Teravainen definitely will go somewhere in the top 7 or 8, depending on the team. He has elite skills in this draft, and you cannot teach those. He will be on the Habs radar for sure. Every draft seems to have at least one player who flies up the first round rankings during the season. I am guessing that TT watched a fair bit of TT this season.
As for Matheson, I like him as well, and him being from Lac St Louis in bonus. I tried to fit him into my list, but I kept having him falling between our two second round picks. I always had a few better players at 33, and I expect he will be gone at 51. I would gladly welcome him into the fold though.
On the goalie front, I did list Dansk as a possibility, but I really hope they don't pick a goalie until the third round at the earliest. We have three picks in the top 50 this year, so that is the opportunity to pick one elite and two very good skaters and restock that talent level. We have another first rounder and three seconds next year, in what is pegged as a deeper draft. Ditto, restock the forwards and defense. I still think they will draft a goalie later on this year. I also think they will sign either Dell or Maxwell later this summer after the Development Camp is over. I think they will be addressing the goalie depth through various means this summer.
BC and duster - In regards to Wilson, I have him going in the first round in my mock draft (I will post on the weekend, as I may tweak the last few picks a bit between now and then). Teams tend to overpay for big forwards in the draft, and he fits that perfect bill of a kid who will have a draft premium attached to him.
Wilson is the type of player that makes that 33rd (or even 32nd!!) pick really interesting. There are bound to be a few picks in the first round that are a bit off the charts or at least a bit unexpected. That means that some guys with what scouts see as first round talent should drop to our pick. Once I see what teams do a week from Friday, I will likely adjust my list for the 33rd pick for sure. I think we will be getting a very good prospect with that pick.
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jun 13, 2012 6:07:46 GMT -5
Wilson would be my pick at 33. He projects to be another Milan Lucic type and the team really needs a player like that. At worse, he's another Chris Nilan which is not a bad thing. I would consider Subban if the team gets an extra second rounder should they trade down or he is still available at 51. He's most likely Team Canada's starting goalie at next year's WJC and it's hard to pass up a goalie of that caliber. So far, the team has heavily relied on Price to win games and that makes him a target. I dread the day when someone like Lucic thunders into him and gives him a concussion. To paraphrase someone, the future is uncertain and the end is always near. We need a solid NHL backup who can one day become a starter. After Carey Price, the goaltending picture gets bleak. We need centres, sure, but if Price goes down the workload shifts to Budaj and I'm not convinced he can carry the team. Malcolm Subban also sounds like a mature kid too. I'd like to pick him up but there are some other needs that require addressing as well. Cheers. |
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Post by franko on Jun 13, 2012 8:23:36 GMT -5
that's actually my biggest worry, dis -- that Price will go down/be run/tweak a knee/etc. the we're up "that creek" without a paddle. we need a little insurance for the future -- and someone in Hamilton that can be counted on "just in case" a coupla years down the road. gotta take a G with that 4th pick then at the very latest.
oh, and unless we trade up to get another 1st rounder, Malcolm will be long gone -- but drafting him will be a PR man's wet dream.
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jun 13, 2012 14:52:18 GMT -5
that's actually my biggest worry, dis -- that Price will go down/be run/tweak a knee/etc. the we're up "that creek" without a paddle. we need a little insurance for the future -- and someone in Hamilton that can be counted on "just in case" a coupla years down the road. gotta take a G with that 4th pick then at the very latest. oh, and unless we trade up to get another 1st rounder, Malcolm will be long gone -- but drafting him will be a PR man's wet dream. I actually expect them to address this by October in up to three ways: 1. Draft a kid next weekend; 2. Ink a good, young, unsigned free agent this summer (Dell or Maxwell seem to the most likely at this point); and 3. Ugrade the starting goalie position in Hamilton with a solid UFA signing who can also be called up if necessary. There are now lots of fresh eyes and bright hockey minds on payroll that likely have the very same concerns about the lack of goalie depth. |
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Post by GNick99 on Jun 17, 2012 8:09:28 GMT -5
This is one of those "I know someone who knows someone" kind of things, so take it FWIW: The buzz is that Edmonton will take Ryan Murray and there are serious doubts about the Russians. Yakupov looked awful in the CHL playoffs and it's not a slam dunk that Columbus takes him. Too risky and the talent level of a guy like Yakupov at 18 years old is light years away from guys like Ovie, Malkin, and Kovalchuk at the same age. It's just not a very strong draft and there is a very low degree of confidence in the top picks, which is somewhat unusual. Even in bad drafts, the top 3 picks are usually pretty solid and it drops off from there, but among the forwards in particular, nobody inspires much confidence. And Grigorenko will drop. Huge questions about his compete level. He plays a no-contact game. I wouldn't be shocked to see Edmonton take Murray and Columbus take Galchenyuk with the #2 pick. Everybody seems to like his game and, just as important, his competitiveness. You would think you could trade down, but this is the kind of draft with so much uncertainty that you won't find teams willing to trade up. To me this is an excellent draft synopsis...about the best I've read. Rumors Oilers draft Murray and Columbus grab the #1 center in Galchenyuk and call it a day. Due to Yakupov being Russian and their bad luck with similiar players in past. If this happens Habs most likely grab Teravainen at 3. |
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jun 18, 2012 14:54:43 GMT -5
Have to make a little modification to my mock draft list above, as I forgot a pick. Actually, until late last week, almost every web-based Habs source missed this particular pick. Nobody seemd to know we had a fifth round pick. It appears that the 122nd pick comes to the Habs from Columbus (a conditional pick as part of the Wiz deal). Until the NHL officially released their draft list late last week, I had not seen anyone flagging this as a Habs pick. Quite funny stuff, but those conditional picks can be quite tricky unless you know all the specific conditions that have to be met or not...and most casual hockey fans never see the details of course.
So, who the heck could we possibly pick at the top of the 5th round you say?
Round 5 - 122nd:
Kevin Roy, C, 5'9" 170, Lincoln (USHL) - Kevin is from QC and played US high school last season, in his first draft eligible year. That and his size added up to him being passed over. He will be picked this season. He was the USHL player of the year, and the first in league history to score 50 goals (he ended up with 54) and get over 100 points. Small in stature, but big in offensive skill set and speed.
Seth Griffith, C, 5'11" 180, London (OHL) - Another one passed over in 2011 who has really blossomed this past season. He is not overly big, but he really cranked up his offensive game this year with 45 goals. Great release and soft hands, but he will need to work on his defensive game and his overall sustained skating ability (his short term bursts are good).
Robert Baillargeon, C, 6'0" 180, Indiana (USHL) - Other than the kids in the US National Development Program, this is not a huge banner year for top end talent from the USHL. Robert is one of the best offensive kids heading into this draft, as he has loads of offensive skills. He does play a timid game, and that is likely why his draft stock is where it is. He is off to Boston University in the fall.
HM - Connor Carrick, D, 5'11", 185, USNDP (USHL) - A very mobile, slick skating, offense first defender with the US national development program. He will need to get stronger to battle in the defensive zone much better than he does, but he is all about offense right now. He is committed to Red Berenson's great program at Michigan, where he will play alongside Mac Bennet - another kid who was drafted as an undersized, offense first defender.
I do also want to add another name as a possibility with the Habs 6th round pick. 6'2" 205 lb defender from Kitchener, Evan McEneny is one of those big draft mysteries this year. He only played 2 games before ending his season with an ACL injury. He is big and physical, and possesses a very good two way game...but most scouts will not have seen anything recently. I read an article that he would make a great late round pick for a team with good defensive prospect depth, as he could very well have gone by the second round if he was healthy.
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Post by Patty Roy on Jun 18, 2012 21:21:33 GMT -5
Nice write up NWT! I really like either Thrower or Jankowski with that 33rd pick, but i wouldn't be opposed to maybe moving both 2nds to get into the 20-25 range if there's somewhere there that the Habs really like. I've read that they really like Koekkoek but its probably unlikely that he slips that far.
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jun 18, 2012 22:18:28 GMT -5
My annual mock draft....this year is quite the crapshoot from about 25 onwards, so there should be some really decent players available when we select in 33rd spot. I have gone strictly with my interpretation of BPA in all the spots, not based on team needs. I may have tweaked a few spots depending on past drafting tendencies or at least my take on them.
Anyway, here we go with the first half...
1. EDM - Nail Yakupov, RW, Sarnia (OHL): Yeah, they need defensemen, but they lucked out with that silly lottery ball and really need to pick the consensus number one player. He has a magical shot and good speed. That is a lot of top end young forwards in Edmonton now. Maybe they should get a defender or two this summer.
2. CBJ - Filip Forsberg, RW, Leksand (SWE): He is quite young and will only fill into his tall frame. The knock is his lack of offense at times, but he has a good shot and was great at the Ivan Hlinka. A "safe" pick, but there still may be more upside there than he has shown.
3. MTL - Alex Galchenyuk, C, Sarnia (OHL): Murray or Gally? I will go with the talented centreman as he has a lot of skill, the concerns about his knee seem to be disappearing after the combine, and I think his upside is better. TT likes to talk about projecting a prospect, and I think he projects nicely as a top centre for years to come. Get the bleu-blanc-rouge with his stitched name out Bergy.
4. NYI - Ryan Murray, D, Everett (WHL): It is really nice when BPA and team need collide. Ryan is projected to be very close to NHL ready (he played in the Worlds before he was drafted!!) and is a very solid all round defender. Another "safe" pick, but that is worth a premium in a draft like this with so many question marks.
5. TOR - Matt Dumba, D, Red Deer (WHL): A tough choice for Burke, do you take a chance on an enigmatic Russian forward or take a kid that seems to play the very style that you so dearly put a premium on? I think they go with the energetic Dumba who will have to tone his going for the big hit and jumping into the play game down a bit once he reaches pro, but you cannot teach enthusiasm, and he has it. Remind you of another young defender?
6. ANA - Morgan Rielly, D Moose Jaw (WHL): Not sure if the ANA scouts were at the Moose Jaw-Edmonton WHL semis like I was, but I am sure they were and they saw a kid who did not look like he was just coming back from injury. He has the best offensive upside of this class of 2013 defenders, and he gets the call here.
7. MIN - Teuvo Teravainen, LW, Jokerit (FIN): No joking around, he is a big draft mover and is likely one of the top skilled players in this year's draft. He has some slick moves, but the knock is his smaller size. Given his late birthday, he is quite a bit younger than most of the other prospects, so he still has some growing to do. Granlund, welcome your equally talented countryman. Mikko, another young lad to mentor.
8. CAR - Griffin Reinhart, D, Edmonton (WHL): A big kid whose stock has been rising all season. He is a decent two way guy in juniors, but I expect that offense will dry up a bit when he turns pro. He already has NHL size, and plays a more positional game than a big physical game. He was a big part of the great run that the Oil Kings had this year.
9. WPG - Mikhail Grigorenko, C, Quebec (QMJHL): Every draft seems to have a kid that drops like a stone on draft day. He has been doing it leading up to draft day. The talent is world class, when it is on show. Not sure how much his injury and his mono affected his play, but the scouts have their doubts. If he can ever get it together, he could be a home run. Winnipeg has a good young forward core and can be patient with him.
10. TB - Jacob Trouba, D, USNDP (USHL): A hard competitor who packs a very good physical game into his mobile body. He looked very good as a young partner alongside Tinordi at the WJC. He has a good point shot, but will be a valuable physical defender for a team with two picks in the top 19.
11. WSH - Cody Ceci - D, Ottawa (OHL): One of the 67s good young prospects, he is a big bodied defenseman who just keeps putting up points. Once he can round out his defensive game, look out. Until then, just check out the scoresheet.
12. BUF - Hampus Lindholm, D, Rogle (SWE): He has been getting better as the season progresses, and finished up helping his team get moved up into the SEL next season. A good size, and he seems to be finding his offensive game as well.
13. DAL - Radek Faksa, C, Kitchener (OHL): The Czech talented centre has size, skill and can really skate. He has made a mark in the OHL and was good at the World Juniors as well. The kid has an NHL size body, so he should be able to easily adapt to the physical rigours of the next level.
14. CGY - Derrick Pouliot, D, Portland (WHL): He is a very talented blueliner on one of the CHL's premier prospect factories. They just keep getting top end players in Portland, and he will carry on that tradition nicely this draft. He has great offensive instincts and should add a nice dimension to a team that does not have a lot of top end prospects.
15. OTT - Zemgus Grigensons, C, Dubuque (USHL): The big Latvian is probably one of the best two way forwards in this draft. His offense should still translate nicely in the pros, and he will be a solid, safe pick who is a big body already and should be able to nicely transition to the pros once he spends some time in Vermont in the NCAA.
Will post this now while I get typing up my second half. It shall be up in a wee while.
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jun 18, 2012 23:10:27 GMT -5
16. WSH - Olli Maatta, D, London (OHL): After an injury early in the WJC, the big Finn did come back and catch the eyes of the scouts with his point a game output to end the season. He stepped his game up as the Knights came within one game of winning the Memorial Cup. He is a big body who should be an excellent two way defender in the pros.
17. SJ - Matthew Finn, D, Guelph (OHL): He is a steady two way defender who was a key part of Guelph this past year. He does not seem to get the press of many of the other projected first rounders, but his leadership and balanced talent should go a long way for many teams.
18. CHI - Sebastian Collberg, RW, Frolunda (SWE): The slightly undersized forward makes up for his size with his great shot and offensive talents. He was a big factor on the gold medal WJC team, even as one of the youngest players on the team. He managed to get 41 games in the SEL as well, so he has been adjusting to the mens game already. Chicago has a lot of good talent up front, so they can be a little patient with him as he gets stronger and ready to come on over.
19. TB - Andrei Vasilevski, G, Ufa Topar (MHL - RUS): Andrei was the starting goalie for Russia at the WJC, although he did get yanked in the semis when Canada had that great comeback that fell a tad short. He is a big goalie and top ranked European goalie, and should be the first or second goalie to go overall. Tampa shored up its present goalie situation by way of a trade, but no harm in drafting an heir apparent who can spend time maturing and developing his game. Goalies do take longer for the most part.
20. PHI - Brendan Gaunce, C, Belleville (OHL): A big, strong power forward who is physically dominating in juniors right now. He seems cut out of the mould of many a Philly forward from the past, so should fit nicely in with a team that has a good core of young players thanks to its major overhaul this past season.
21. BUF - Thomas Wilson, RW, Plymouth (OHL): How do you lessen the sting of giving up their big future power forward Kassian in a trade with Vancouver? Well, you start by drafting a pretty similar player in Tom Wilson. He skates well for a big man and many feel he still has some offensive upside that he has not fully shown in juniors. He will benefit from the premium that big power forwards get in the draft these days.
22. PIT - Slater Koekkok, D, Peterborough (OHL): He was another top end draft eligible kid who spent time on the IR. However, he was very good on a team that was not very good, so he left a great impression when he played his 26 games. He is a very good two way defender with great upside, and will be very tempting by this point in the draft.
23. FLA - Tomas Hertl, C, Slavia (CZE): He is big and skilled, and has shown that he can be a top forward for his team at the World Juniors and also put up very good numbers playing against men back home. I was impressed with this kid at the WJC.
24. BOS - Pontus Aberg, LW, Djurgarden (SWE): He put up decent numbers for an 18 year old playing in the SEL, and was a point a game player in the handful of games he played in juniors. He is a decent skilled forward who should grow to average NHL size.
25. STL - Brady Skjei, D, USNDP (USHL): He is one of the best skating defensemen in this draft, and he already has a good size to boot. He ended up with a point every two games in the USHL, but many expect that it will only get better with time. He is off to play with the U of Minnesota Gophers next season.
26. VAN - Malcolm Subban, G, Belleville (OHL): No need to explain the bloodlines of the top ranked NA goalie. He impressed all with his athletic abilities at the combine and his cool demeanor in interviews. Many think he could project to be the best goalie this draft. As with most goalies, only a fair bit of time will tell.
27. PHX - Scott Laughton, C, Oshawa (OHL): He has shown his great shutdown abilities at both the U17s and U18s against top notch competition, and he is a valuable commodity as teams need responsible two way guys to win hockey games. He put up pretty decent numbers this past year, so he should be very tempting near the end of the first round.
28. NYR - Ludvig Bystrom, D, Modo (SWE): He is a decent sized two way defenseman who got 20 games in the SEL this season, and held his own defensively. He played at the World Junior A Challenge and really made his mark at the Ivan Hlinka tournament. He is a good skater and has a decent first pass.
29. NJ - Nicolas Kerdiles, LW, USNDP (USHL): One of the top forwards on the U18 team, he has good size and skating skills, although some would like to see him use that size more. He was a key contributor at the U18s the last two years, so he has shown the ability to play in the big games. Although he was born in the US, both his parents are from France.
30. LA - Colton Sissons, C, Kelowna (WHL): He is an all round good forward, with great work ethic and character. He has decent size, skill and awareness, but will be a very defensively sound player in the pros.
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Post by blny on Jun 19, 2012 6:10:12 GMT -5
watch.tsn.ca/nhl/clip702740#clip702740Bob McKenzie's ranking. Not necessarily where people will go, but you'll notice players moving up and down - Grigorenko all the way down to 12th. His top 3 are: Yakupov Murray Forsberg
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Post by BadCompany on Jun 19, 2012 6:47:20 GMT -5
Nicely done NWT! I especially like how you have Matheson, Jankowski and Matteau all falling to the second round.  While I would love to get Galchenyuk, to be honest with you I don't see him slipping past Columbus. Yeah, apparently they love Forsberg, but who doesn't love everybody at this time of year? Galchenyuk has the personality and flair to really revive a flagging franchise, not just on the ice, but off of it too. But of course a lot of that depends on what kinds of offers they are getting for Rick Nash. If they think they can load up on offensive talent (based on what has already been offered to them) then they might go for a guy like Murray. But if they're asking for or being offered a lot of defensive prospects, then a forward might be the way to go for them. I think Forsberg is our guy, unless we move up. But what is the cost? I'd offer both our 2nd rounders to move up, but I suspect that would be nowhere near enough. |
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Post by Disgruntled70sHab on Jun 19, 2012 7:00:22 GMT -5
I'd be very happy with Forsberg.
TSN pointed out that, while the Habs need a centre, they may also be looking for top-4 d-man to round out Markov, Subban and Gorges.
Cheers.
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Post by NWTHabsFan on Jun 19, 2012 7:24:31 GMT -5
Nicely done NWT! I especially like how you have Matheson, Jankowski and Matteau all falling to the second round. While I would love to get Galchenyuk, to be honest with you I don't see him slipping past Columbus. Yeah, apparently they love Forsberg, but who doesn't love everybody at this time of year? Galchenyuk has the personality and flair to really revive a flagging franchise, not just on the ice, but off of it too. But of course a lot of that depends on what kinds of offers they are getting for Rick Nash. If they think they can load up on offensive talent (based on what has already been offered to them) then they might go for a guy like Murray. But if they're asking for or being offered a lot of defensive prospects, then a forward might be the way to go for them. I think Forsberg is our guy, unless we move up. But what is the cost? I'd offer both our 2nd rounders to move up, but I suspect that would be nowhere near enough. Yeah, I would not be upset with Jankowski in the second! I agree on Columbus, they are the wild card right now. They need to get some studs in the farm, even if they don't move Nash by Friday night. If both Yakupov and Gally are both gone, I do see Timmins being very happy with Forsberg at that point. The kid has a very solid head on his shoulders and should only get bigger and better. |
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