Ukraine

[Disgruntled70sHab]

If you want to know what's going on over there, from a military standpoint, check out Kyiv Independent reporter, Illia Ponomarenko ... he's the defence and security reporter for the paper, and he's providing a play-by-play ...

Cheers.

[seventeen]

Anyone know exactly what 'items' Russia lacks that it needs from the West. An example I can think of involves China and their food supply. They import a lot of pork from the west. What is there that Russia badly needs from the West, besides brains?

Thanks Dis.

[Cranky]

Go back in my history and you will see one statement i said that remains absolutely true....weak countries need nukes to protect themselves. Period. End of story.

Israel had it right from day one.

We in the west are sooo arrogant about our borders, but ask Ukraine, Taiwan and possibly Greece.

[Cranky]

Feb 24, 2022 12:26:30 GMT -5 seventeen said:

Anyone know exactly what 'items' Russia lacks that it needs from the West. An example I can think of involves China and their food supply. They import a lot of pork from the west. What is there that Russia badly needs from the West, besides brains?

Thanks Dis.

Shut them off their pipelines....won't happen.

Shut them off from ALL banking....won't happen.

Shut their European and Asian air space....won't happen.

The west does not have the balls to match Putin so lots of mouth movement from politicians and nothing more. NOTHING more.

I wish I had a few nukes to lend the Ukrainians and Putin calculus will be Moscow or Ukraine...THAT will snuff out Putins big plans.

[Disgruntled70sHab]

[Disgruntled70sHab]

... The Russian order of battle ...

[Disgruntled70sHab]

Ukraine attack: Hundreds arrested in anti-war protests in Russia

Russian police arrest nearly 1,400 protesters
at rallies against invasion of Ukraine. 

24 Feb 2022


Police in Russia arrested nearly 1,400 people at anti-war protests staged in cities across the country after President Vladimir Putin launched an invasion of Ukraine, an independent monitor said.



“More than 1,391 people have already been detained in 51 cities,” said OVD-Info on Thursday, which tracks arrests at opposition rallies.

More from Al Jazeera

[Disgruntled70sHab]

[Disgruntled70sHab]

[Cranky]

Feb 25, 2022 12:32:04 GMT -5 Disgruntled70sHab said:

... The Russian order of battle ...

ONE nuke and you make them all irrelevant.

The metric becomes...Moscow for Ukraine...and that is not a metric even Puta makes.

[Cranky]

Feb 25, 2022 13:12:03 GMT -5 Disgruntled70sHab said:

THESE ARE LEADERS. BRAVO!!

Son of a...had a bit of a tear watching real leaders, real heros say nothing more then..."present".

[Cranky]

Germany once again has blood on it's hands indirectly.

To meet their self imposed "green agenda" they are shutting down their coal and nuclear plants thus becoming reliant for 34% of their energy from Putin. Hundreds of billions of dollars already in Putins coffers and their back door filibustering of any REAL hurt on Putin.

Right now, the Germans and EU are in full "look over there" to avoid fingers at the real enablers of Putins aggression. Garbage like "but they are one people" is rumbling from the German left otherwise the spotlight on their enabling harms their greenwash agenda.

Ohh but wait...they "suspended" the second massive gas line...that has not delivered a cubic foot of gas..yet. Not canceled but suspended the second line that would pour hundreds of billions more into Putins coffers. That really showed Putin...that there are no real consequences and might as well finish off Ukraine.

But hey, it's ONLY Ukraine and besides, a greenwashing agenda is far more important then then 45,000,000 petty little Ukrainian lives.

[Willie Dog]

Feb 25, 2022 13:37:43 GMT -5 Cranky said:

Feb 25, 2022 13:12:03 GMT -5 Disgruntled70sHab said:

THESE ARE LEADERS. BRAVO!!

Son of a...had a bit of a tear watching real leaders, real heros say nothing more then..."present".

Yep, these guys will die for their country, how many leaders throughout the world would stay and fight?

[Willie Dog]

Zelensky reaches out to the Russian people directly. There are protests in several Russian cities... many arrests...

[seventeen]

Feb 24, 2022 17:29:47 GMT -5 Cranky said:

Feb 24, 2022 12:26:30 GMT -5 seventeen said:

Anyone know exactly what 'items' Russia lacks that it needs from the West. An example I can think of involves China and their food supply. They import a lot of pork from the west. What is there that Russia badly needs from the West, besides brains?

Thanks Dis.

Shut them off their pipelines....won't happen.

Shut them off from ALL banking....won't happen.

Shut their European and Asian air space....won't happen.

The west does not have the balls to match Putin so lots of mouth movement from politicians and nothing more. NOTHING more.

I wish I had a few nukes to lend the Ukrainians and Putin calculus will be Moscow or Ukraine...THAT will snuff out Putins big plans.

Completely agree. It would be interesting to see Putin's reaction if Ukraine suddenly was gifted a few of those with all the technology to use them. Tail between legs.

[seventeen]

Is Finland not a member of NATO? If not, one slap across Putin's face would be to immediately add them. In fact, any country bordering Russia in Europe. We have to stop letting ourselves be pushed around every time he opens his mouth. Don't discuss anything with him...just take some actions that will surely tick him off, but show him that we're done with talking.

Easy for me to say, of course, retired, too old to fight...but I'll work computers or anything else that's needed to Put-'in' down.

My thinking is that we either do this now or we're going to have to do it later, when he is much more prepared for a larger engagement. He ain't stopping at Ukraine. The Baltic countries are next. Or Finland, which used to be a part of "Mother Russia" once.

[Cranky]

I can't watch the news without losing it.

We have a two bit piece of crap putting the entire planet on a collision course.

This is going to enable someone like iran to play big boyz and Israel has no choice but to preemptively strike them. Ohh yeah, i forgot, iran is not really, really have nukes. Nope. And i believe in the easter bunny.

Taiwan, we all know that China really cares about tweets.

Greece with Turkey..put momey on it.

Covid, now this. I can't help thinking that we retired....to get a front row seat of the world burning....

[Cranky]

Feb 25, 2022 18:25:49 GMT -5 seventeen said:

Is Finland not a member of NATO? If not, one slap across Putin's face would be to immediately add them. In fact, any country bordering Russia in Europe. We have to stop letting ourselves be pushed around every time he opens his mouth. Don't discuss anything with him...just take some actions that will surely tick him off, but show him that we're done with talking.

Easy for me to say, of course, retired, too old to fight...but I'll work computers or anything else that's needed to Put-'in' down.

My thinking is that we either do this now or we're going to have to do it later, when he is much more prepared for a larger engagement. He ain't stopping at Ukraine. The Baltic countries are next. Or Finland, which used to be a part of "Mother Russia" once.

NOT GOING TO HAPPEN

You are NOT talking about my father, grandfather, father-in-law, my wife, you, me, Dis and any number of the "older" generation that sees thing in black and white. Evil exists and needs to be dealt with. Harshly. Permanantly. Deadly.

The west has gotten soft, fat, lazy and stupid. Now, well, tweeting really furiously is going to stop Putin. Maybe cancel him. Why invest in military killing machines when we know that furious scoldings and gum flapping stops evil in it's tracks. Maybe the CBC can run a feature of how calling Putin really bad but gender neutral names will change his mind.

Good luck to us....

[Disgruntled70sHab]

If you want to know about Canada's boots-on-the-ground commitment, Google "Operation REASSURANCE" ... the Liberals just beefed up the battlegroup to 1,000 Canadians ... read elsewhere that elements of the Royal Canadian Artillery have been given their marching orders and will be augmenting existing Canadian troops in Latvia shortly ... confirmed from Canada.ca ...

Update:

An additional 460 CAF personnel, along with further CAF military assets will deploy on Operation REASSURANCE in support of North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO).

The CAF will provide:

• A battery of M777 artillery guns with forward observers and an electronic warfare troop of CAF personnel to bolster the Canadian led NATO enhanced Forward Presence Battle Group in Latvia;

• HMCS Halifax, will deploy with an embarked maritime helicopter, to join NATO’s Standing Naval Forces; and

• Re-tasking of a CP-140 Aurora long range patrol aircraft already in the region, will operate in the Euro-Atlantic Area under NATO command and control.

These contributions, which fall under Operation REASSURANCE, will strengthen NATO’s deterrence and defence efforts by increasing Canada’s land, maritime, and air capabilities in Europe.

[Cranky]

Feb 25, 2022 20:35:31 GMT -5 Disgruntled70sHab said:

If you want to know about Canada's boots-on-the-groun :'(d commitment, Google "Operation REASSURANCE" ... the Liberals just beefed up the battlegroup to 1,000 Canadian soldiers ... read elsewhere that elements of the Royal Canadian Artillery have been given their marching orders and will be augmenting existing Canadian troops in Latvia shortly ... confirmed from Canada.ca ...

Update:

An additional 460 CAF personnel, along with further CAF military assets will deploy on Operation REASSURANCE in support of North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO).

The CAF will provide:

• A battery of M777 artillery guns with forward observers and an electronic warfare troop of CAF personnel to bolster the Canadian led NATO enhanced Forward Presence Battle Group in Latvia;

• HMCS Halifax, will deploy with an embarked maritime helicopter, to join NATO’s Standing Naval Forces; and

• Re-tasking of a CP-140 Aurora long range patrol aircraft already in the region, will operate in the Euro-Atlantic Area under NATO command and control.

These contributions, which fall under Operation REASSURANCE, will strengthen NATO’s deterrence and defence efforts by increasing Canada’s land, maritime, and air capabilities in Europe.

Not taking a singe thing from our highly capable guys but this is more of a trigger then a deterrent against any real Russian offence. If the shooting starts what Latvia really, really needs is our F35s and F22s to establish air superiority over Latvia. Sure, it may take them away from our northern polar defense but it's worth the gamble.

We are a first world nation? Right? With a first world air force?

[Disgruntled70sHab]

Feb 25, 2022 13:33:33 GMT -5 Cranky said:

ONE nuke and you make them all irrelevant.

Just too reckless a tactic, HA ... Putin is the wrong guy to be playing Russian Roulette with nukes ... I remember the old Soviet doctrine of battle that stated (paraphrase), no country will surrender until it has used all the weapons in its arsenal ... from what I've seen of him, Putin has the recklessness to escalate a nuclear confrontation ...

The metric becomes...Moscow for Ukraine...and that is not a metric even Puta makes.

Putin is afraid of two things ... an opinion from James O'Brien ... I've been following O'Brien for a long time now ...

[Disgruntled70sHab]

Feb 25, 2022 21:10:36 GMT -5 Cranky said:

Feb 25, 2022 20:35:31 GMT -5 Disgruntled70sHab said:

If you want to know about Canada's boots-on-the-groun :'(d commitment, Google "Operation REASSURANCE" ... the Liberals just beefed up the battlegroup to 1,000 Canadian soldiers ... read elsewhere that elements of the Royal Canadian Artillery have been given their marching orders and will be augmenting existing Canadian troops in Latvia shortly ... confirmed from Canada.ca ...

Update:

An additional 460 CAF personnel, along with further CAF military assets will deploy on Operation REASSURANCE in support of North Atlantic Treaty Organization (NATO).

The CAF will provide:

• A battery of M777 artillery guns with forward observers and an electronic warfare troop of CAF personnel to bolster the Canadian led NATO enhanced Forward Presence Battle Group in Latvia;

• HMCS Halifax, will deploy with an embarked maritime helicopter, to join NATO’s Standing Naval Forces; and

• Re-tasking of a CP-140 Aurora long range patrol aircraft already in the region, will operate in the Euro-Atlantic Area under NATO command and control.

These contributions, which fall under Operation REASSURANCE, will strengthen NATO’s deterrence and defence efforts by increasing Canada’s land, maritime, and air capabilities in Europe.

Not taking a singe thing from our highly capable guys but this is more of a trigger then a deterrent against any real Russian offence. If the shooting starts what Latvia really, really needs is our F35s and F22s to establish air superiority over Latvia. Sure, it may take them away from our northern polar defense but it's worth the gamble.

We are a first world nation? Right? With a first world air force?

Each of the Baltic countries have their own battle group ... that's Lithuania, Estonia, and Latvia ... the BGs were formed right after Russia annexed Crimea ... Poland also has its own battle group, as well ... see "Enhanced Forward Presence" ... there's real concern from Estonians, Lithuanians, and Latvians, that the Baltics will be invaded, as well ... I see now that Belarus is a participant ... they allowed Russian troops to pass through Belarusian territory to take Chernobyl ... Putin also has Belarus's air defence systems, and fuelling stations to rely on, as well ... Putin's #1 stooge is now Belarusian President Aleksandr Lukashenko ...

Cheers.

[Disgruntled70sHab]

Feb 25, 2022 17:42:12 GMT -5 Willie Dog said:

Zelensky reaches out to the Russian people directly. There are protests in several Russian cities... many arrests...

Zelensky tells EU leaders on
video call, it 'might be the last time you see me alive'

Summer Meza, News editor
Fri, February 25, 2022, 12:08 p.m.·1 min read

Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky may believe Ukraine will defeat Russia, but he doesn't seem sure he'll be around to see it.

The nation's leader told his EU counterparts "this might be the last time you see me alive" during a video conference on Thursday night, Axios reports. He said Russian "sabotage forces" are hunting for him and his family in Kyiv, which aligns with U.S. intelligence that says a priority of Russia's invasion in Ukraine is to "decapitate" its government.

The attack on Ukraine has killed at least 137 and wounded 316 others, Zelensky said publicly in an address Friday morning. He also declared he is Russia's "number one" target for capture or assassination.

More.

[Cranky]

Feb 25, 2022 22:38:18 GMT -5 Disgruntled70sHab said:

Each of the Baltic countries have their own battle group ... that's Lithuania, Estonia, and Latvia ... they were formed right after Russia annexed Crimea ... Poland also has its own battle group, as well ... see "Enhanced Forward Presence" ... many of my former students have passed through Latvia over the past few years ... we were looking at Latvia as an anniversary destination later this year, but there's real concern from Estonians, Lithuanians, and Latvians, that the Baltics will be invaded, as well ... I see now that Belarus is a participant ... they allowed Russian troops to pass through Belarusian territory to take Chernobyl ... Putin also has Belarus's air defence systems, and fuelling stations to rely on, as well ... Putin's #1 stooge is now Belarusian President Aleksandr Lukashenko ...

Cheers.

Dis, without air power, those troops are just going to be in a WW1 style slug fest. That's why my sarcasm about F35 and F22.

The countries in the EU that have air power and war ready is France, Britain and Greece. None of them are bordering Russia and able to shut down air space. And of course, the master of the air, the US.

Germany is a worthless partner because they are buried in self interest which slaves them to Russia. It took them two weeks of debate, TWO effen weeks and enormous pressure to "suspend" NordStream 2. Which hasn't brought a once of gas, yet so vital to German interests. They are also the backdoor self interest bullies to stopping the world from kicking out Russia from Swift. Turkey is Turkey. They play the EU and Russia on a hourly basis. What EU really has are two military power groups, France with Greece, British with Poles. The rest may be willing, very capable, but hardly 3D war ready RIGHT NOW. If anything, the two prong defense would be French-Italian-Spanish-Greek southern prong and Brits-All-North. Neither can threaten Russia without US support.

Rigjt now....other then Greece which is armed to the teeth and 3D ready because of Turkey, Brits and France, the EU is nowhere near the level of preparedness they should of been. Always depending on the US, which is war weary and always depending on worthless righteous rhetoric and "peace dividens".

How is that working out for them now?

[Cranky]

Feb 25, 2022 21:31:49 GMT -5 Disgruntled70sHab said:

Feb 25, 2022 13:33:33 GMT -5 Cranky said:

ONE nuke and you make them all irrelevant.

Just too reckless a tactic, HA ... Putin is the wrong guy to be playing Russian Roulette with nukes ... I remember the old Soviet doctrine of battle that stated (paraphrase), no country will surrender until it has used all the weapons in its arsenal ... from what I've seen of him, Putin has the recklessness to escalate a nuclear confrontation ...

The metric becomes...Moscow for Ukraine...and that is not a metric even Puta makes.

Putin is afraid of two things ... an opinion from James O'Brien ... I've been following O'Brien for a long time now ...

I don't disagree that Puta fears democracy.. and hanging from a lamp post. All dictatorship fear that.

I disagree about nukes. Nukes are the great equalizer where dictators can't control the outcome. Where big countries need to think twice about the consequences of sacrificing a city or three to a smaller but nuke equipped country. See Iran and NK.

A few nukes in Ukrainian hands would change the metrics of this invasion.

[Cranky]

Obviously 45,000,000 Ukrainian lives take a back seat to three countries self interest....particularly the German statement of "for a situation where it may be necessary". Get that one? The effen self ab$orbed inhumanity of that $tatement is epically sad....

------

Anger explodes at Germany, Italy, and Hungary over Europe’s failure to cut Russia off from SWIFT payment network.


As Russian troops enter Kyiv and the European Union prepares to sign off on fresh sanctions against Russia for its invasion of Ukraine, there is widespread fury against the countries that are blocking the heaviest potential sanctions.

German Chancellor Olaf Scholz said Thursday that Russia should not yet be cut off from the SWIFT global payments system, because it is “very important” to keep such drastic measures “for a situation where it may be necessary.” Italy is also reported to have opposed the measure in order to maintain some leverage over Russia’s dictatorial president, Vladimir Putin.

Both Germany and Italy are highly dependent on Russian natural gas, which would be difficult to pay for if Russia really were to be cut off from SWIFT; Austria has the same dilemma, and is taking a similar approach. All three of these countries have other extensive business ties with Russia, with Italian and Austrian banks being highly exposed right now. French banks do a lot of business in Russia as well, and France has declared a SWIFT cutoff to be “the very last resort.”

And then there’s Hungary, whose hard-right leader Viktor Orbán has long had a friendly relationship with fellow culture warrior Putin. As with President Miloš Zeman of the neighboring Czech Republic, Orbán appears to have changed tack in the past couple days, condemning Russia’s invasion and professing to stand with Ukraine. However, he has yet to follow Zeman in calling for the SWIFT option, which the Czech leader says is “needed to isolate a madman.”

Again, energy likely plays a part—Hungary signed a deal with Moscow just a few weeks ago that will allow it to buy Russian gas far below market price.

European sign-off would be essential for cutting Russia off from SWIFT, because the payment network is based in Brussels. Now, ahead of a midafternoon meeting at which the measures will be finalized, the pressure is on to change minds.

“In this war everything is real: Putin’s madness and cruelty, Ukrainian victims, bombs falling on Kyiv. Only your sanctions are pretended,” tweeted former Polish Prime Minister and European Council President Donald Tusk on Friday morning. “Those EU governments, which blocked tough decisions ([among them] Germany, Hungary, Italy) have disgraced themselves.”

Ukrainian Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said Thursday that “everyone who now doubts whether Russia should be banned from SWIFT has to understand that the blood of innocent Ukrainian men, women, and children will be on their hands, too.” And on Friday morning, Defense Minister Oleksii Reznikov urged people to share the realities of the invasion “in the Italian, German, and Hungarian media space” and among European officials.

“Everyone who knows the appropriate languages—you are our weapon,” Reznikov said in a Facebook post.

There is general agreement that cutting Russia off from SWIFT would make life much harder for the country, but some argue that it wouldn’t have as stark an effect as it might have in the past, because Russia could partially fall back on alternatives developed domestically and in China.

Whatever the strength of its impact, though, it remains unclear what sort of action Russia would have to take to convince SWIFT skeptics that the time has come to shut it out. After all, Putin’s actions so far have given no indication that sanctions of any sort will change his mind, and his assault on Ukraine has been anything but partial.

“Russia has gone for total war, and there is no follow on,” said Dutch lawmaker Ruben Brekelmans, describing the last-resort argument as “nonsense.”

fortune.com/2022/02/25/ukraine-anger-sanctions-germany-italy-hungary-europe-eu-failure-cut-russia-swift-payment-network/

[Willie Dog]

Ronald Reagan must be rolling in his grave... Time for Biden to man up... They should send a carrier strike group to the north Atlantic but the closest one is in the Mediterranean... the rest are in the pacific... The US needs to set up a no fly zone over Ukraine or provide advanced weapons to ukraine... one or the other

[Disgruntled70sHab]

[Disgruntled70sHab]

Feb 24, 2022 12:26:30 GMT -5 seventeen said:

Anyone know exactly what 'items' Russia lacks that it needs from the West. An example I can think of involves China and their food supply. They import a lot of pork from the west. What is there that Russia badly needs from the West, besides brains?

Thanks Dis.

Hi Mur, I wanted to get back to you earlier, but I'm just too caught up in the whole scenario ... HA is right when he points out just how dependent some EU countries are on Russia ... here are Canada's import/export numbers with Russia ... cancelling export permits is one of the right moves, but when I look at it, I'm trying to see where it actually hurts Russia ... Canada sends planes and helicopters to Russia, but they're both civilian pattern aircraft ... as for the EU, here's their economic hit ... the numbers are in the article ...

Cheers.

[folatre]

I will preface this by saying that I know little or nothing about military affairs, but something about Putin's strategy seems faulty and myopic. How can a country the size or France or Germany with a hostile anti-Russian population of 40+ million be pacified and occupied by fewer than 200,000 troops? And this does not even take into consideration that Ukraine is one of the most heavily armed countries in the world with paramilitaries and ordinary households being in possession of millions of automatic assault rifles. Plus, it is hard to pin down an enemy with 1000+ stingers and javelins. I would be crapping my pants if I was some poor Russian sap driving a tank or piloting a helicopter.

While I was sitting around the rink this morning watching some news, I think I heard a US senator who is on the Intelligence Committee say that certain signs (based video/audio analysis type stuff, etc.) point to Putin's mental faculties being altered and diminished.