Trade deadline

[seventeen]

Dec 21, 2021 1:19:40 GMT -5 Cranky said:

Trade Chiarot, Price and Toffoli...but if we don't sign replacements, it's bottom feeding time again next year.

Finishing low again next year would be really hard to take......but, Michkov and Bedard are exceptional prizes for sucking it up and praying desperately that the bingo balls fall our way. Getting one of those guys would subtract 2 years from the rebuild.

[folatre]

Without knowing how Gorton-Hughes plan to alleviate the severe cap crunch and if age 30+ vets (Price, Gallagher, Petry, Hoffman) even want to remain with the club, it is hard to get much of a read on what the 2022-23 roster will look like.

Montreal could go back to being 18th through 24th style bad rather than bottom five catastrophically bad. Since being a good team does not seem plausible, being really bad is probably the next best outcome for 2022-23 because Bedard and Michkov seem to profile as sure-fire franchise players if not generational talents. And although it is early, some scouts anticipate that Fantilli and Dvorsky are better prospects than anyone in 2022 draft.

[NWTHabsFan]

Hughes and Gorton have been busy with the pro scouting team over the last few days. I expect the calls must be coming in hot and heavy to Hughes, with no doubt a lot of GMs trying to lowball the Habs while they are down. Wonder when the first shoe will drop.

[folatre]

The good news is that seven weeks remain before the deadline, so there is no pressure if offers are not meeting expectations now. The other fact is that aside from Chiarot, there are really no UFAs with value to focus on. Kulak is tradeable but it will be a minor transaction. And it is not as though Paquette or Perreault have positioned themselves to be traded.

Potential targets who are not UFAs do not have to be moved at the deadline. So the pressures management will be under with respect to getting under the cap ceiling for 2022-23 do not require making rash decisions in March.

[PTH]

Jan 30, 2022 19:55:31 GMT -5 folatre said:

The good news is that seven weeks remain before the deadline, so there is no pressure if offers are not meeting expectations now. The other fact is that aside from Chiarot, there are really no UFAs with value to focus on. Kulak is tradeable but it will be a minor transaction. And it is not as though Paquette or Perreault have positioned themselves to be traded.

Potential targets who are not UFAs do not have to be moved at the deadline. So the pressures management will be under with respect to getting under the cap ceiling for 2022-23 do not require making rash decisions in March.

I was hoping Paquette might play well enough to be worth a mid-round pick or a reclamation project of some kind, but I don't see anyone really wanting him for added depth. Might as well get a waiver wire pickup or use that pick on a guy like Dauphin (plenty of these available)

[seventeen]

I'd hope that any trades happen sooner rather than later. If anyone is playing as if they're disinterested, better to move them out ASAP. There's always the risk of injury and that reduces a players value. If we get prospects in return, it's good to have some inkling of what strengths and weakness they have so we can have an idea of what to concentrate on working with them over the summer.

But that timeline depends in large part on what is offered in return. We're not giving away assets.

[Andrew]

I saw some rumors on Twitter about Petry's availability. I.E. Hughes is willing to move him if there's a fit, and that Petry and his family may want a change.

A trade seems unlikely unless Petry can establish that he's still the defenseman that inked the contract extension he earned last season. If he's able to do so, and the Habs are willing to retain salary then there could be a market come offseason.

[drkcloud]

Jan 31, 2022 14:05:47 GMT -5 Andrew said:

I saw some rumors on Twitter about Petry's availability. I.E. Hughes is willing to move him if there's a fit, and that Petry and his family may want a change.

A trade seems unlikely unless Petry can establish that he's still the defenseman that inked the contract extension he earned last season. If he's able to do so, and the Habs are willing to retain salary then there could be a market come offseason.

Canadiens GM Kent Hughes open to trading Jeff Petry
www.thescore.com/nhl/news/2235311

The story says the mgmt group met with Petry and told him that they are aware of what's going on in his life. They told him if a trade comes up that works for both parties, they'd trade him but until then, he is a member of the Canadiens and they expect maximum effort.

Seems Jeff may have been showing his unhappiness a little too much for Gorton's satisfaction

[folatre]

Petry is plenty tradeable because GMs know the point totals he has put up in Montreal and the fact that he is an effortless skater without a history of injuries.

However, a confluence of factors my depress his trade value a little bit. Petry has a list of 15 teams that he cannot be traded to, so that makes things tighter. Second, Petry is obviously not playing well offensively or defensively this season, which means the recency effect probably will have at least a marginal negative impact on the return. And last, league revenues are still in crisis mode so that basically means the cap ceiling will almost surely be $82.5 million in 2022-23, $83.5 in 2023-24, and $84.5 in 2024-25. Thus, many teams are going to be rather hard up against the cap during the entire life cycle of Petry's contract so there will be clubs who would love to have him but probably cannot make the numbers work.

Therefore, I am somewhat less bullish on the likely return. A couple months ago, I thought he could net a first rounder and a solid prospect. Now I would say one or the other. However, I continue to believe that the market for Petry will be strong enough that Montreal will not have to retain any money. I know everyone wants to connect Petry to Detroit and that could be. But I actually see some clubs in the Central Division-- Dallas, Nashville, St. Louis-- being likely landing spots. I see a Petry trade (likewise with Gallagher) being easier for management to navigate in the summer.

[jkr]

Jan 31, 2022 17:28:18 GMT -5 drkcloud said:

Jan 31, 2022 14:05:47 GMT -5 Andrew said:

I saw some rumors on Twitter about Petry's availability. I.E. Hughes is willing to move him if there's a fit, and that Petry and his family may want a change.

A trade seems unlikely unless Petry can establish that he's still the defenseman that inked the contract extension he earned last season. If he's able to do so, and the Habs are willing to retain salary then there could be a market come offseason.

Canadiens GM Kent Hughes open to trading Jeff Petry
www.thescore.com/nhl/news/2235311

The story says the mgmt group met with Petry and told him that they are aware of what's going on in his life. They told him if a trade comes up that works for both parties, they'd trade him but until then, he is a member of the Canadiens and they expect maximum effort.

Seems Jeff may have been showing his unhappiness a little too much for Gorton's satisfaction

Hmm - what is going on in his life. I have not heard this before.

[The Habitual Fan]

Petry is a much better player then he is showing this year, so I don't think that would shy away another GM from making a pitch for him. A team that could really use him is Edmonton, which would be full circle, but they could use his puck moving ability and experience. I still think his downturn has a direct connection to the hiring of Ducharme and his lack of a system. I also feel that it must be tough on his family because he has been a scapegoat for a lot of this season and his wife being harassed on social media.

[seventeen]

Feb 1, 2022 8:49:47 GMT -5 jkr said:

Hmm - what is going on in his life. I have not heard this before.

Probably the same thing affecting the older vets on the team (Price, Weber), namely depression over not winning last year and knowing it was their last kick at the can - 99%). They should be looking at it as a positive, namely taking advantage of several breaks and making the most of them and getting as far as they did.

[Polarice]

I know the Habs are hosting the draft this year, but, if they are getting some 1st rounders at the trade deadline, perhaps it would be smart to get as many for 2023 as possible where it's supposed to be one of the strongest drafts in years.

[folatre]

I thought that I heard Petry's family stayed in Michigan after the holidays, maybe something about tiring of the Covid restrictions in Quebec.

He still has a job to do, but there is no denying this would be tough on a guy.

However, to be honest, Petry was playing really poorly in October and November, so I think it is a combination of problems (short off-season, Ducharme's ill-suited system, Edmundson being out, his pals Price and Weber being gone, family stuff).

Hughes is not going to give Petry away, so it falls on the player to be a professional while things get sorted out. And most likely, a deal involving Petry will happen in the summer.

[NWTHabsFan]

Lots of twitter chatter that Toffoli to Calgary is close to being done. I actually was hoping they would keep him. He is one of the few really good contracts they have.

If they are doing it, it better be for a real big haul. Flames have some good young forwards that you would hope would be part of the package coming back (Coronato, Pelletier or Zary) in addition to a juicy draft pick.

[folatre]

Regarding Toffoli, I do not blame Gorton and Hughes for setting and price and trading a guy if the price is met. There could be a lot of forwards on the market close to deadline (Hertl, Rackell, Giroux, Laine, Domi, Voracek, Miller) and there are only so many buyers out there.

I am not worried about the Chiarot situation because there will a handful of teams focused exclusively on upgrading their blueline in terms of size and experience. I believe when certain clubs judge they cannot meet the steeper price for Chychrun or Klingberg, then the action will quickly heat up for Chiarot.

[Willie Dog]

After what Weber/Chiarot did to Matthews, I can see Dubas pushing hard for Chiarot... Chiarot is not a top pairing guy on a contender but is a 4,5,6 that is hard to play against... last thing the leafs want is Chiarot being on a playoff team they might face.

[folatre]

If Florida cannot make Chychrun happen, Chiarot is probably going to be the guy.

[seventeen]

I'd settle for Lundell.

[folatre]

Man, Lundell would be a dream. I am relatively sure that Florida will also draw the line and resist giving up Denisenko, Samoskevich, or Heponiemi.

I think it would come down to taking a prospect like Evan Nause or Tippett or the Panther's 2023 first. Honestly, I do not want Tippett. I could live with Nause or their first round pick.

[NWTHabsFan]

The minute Gorton was signed I wondered if this would ramp up Habs interest in Kravtsov. I had seen previously that the Habs had some interest in him when he went back to Russia. Of course, there could be others in the Rangers pipeline too. As a related note, Gorton has a strong connection with NYR scout Daniel Dore, so the speculation has been rampant that he is one of the prime contenders to replace Timmins in the off-season.

Hughes has mentioned that all things being equal, if they can get a young prospect a few years out of their draft year, that is even better than a draft pick as you can already see the development trend of a player and likely against tougher competition than the kid was playing against when drafted. Thus, Emil Heineman versus a second round pick in the last trade. And if they do get another first or two, we can hope one is in 2023, even if that means you delay the impact of that asset another full year.

[seventeen]

NWT, What do you think of Kravtsov? Have you seen him play lately at all. His stats in the KHL this year aren't overhwelming and he's 22, so is he good enough to trade for? I'm seeing small red flags over him.

Also, Rangers scouting, as I've mentioned before, hasn't been great. They chose Kakko, who is still only 21, but man, he's not progressing well and I don't think he was a consensus #2 after Jack Hughes. They passed up Dach, Byram, Seider, Zegras and a slew of other guys around that tier in a fairly deep draft. There's been some turnover in the Ranger's scouting department. Drafting wasn't bad at one point, then there were 4 years in a row without a first round pick and no hits on players (in 2013, strangely enough, they picked Buchnevich and Duclair in Round 3 and Ryan Graves in Round 4). The next 3 years after that, only Shesterkin (in Round 4 made it, though they didn't have many high picks). Another good goalie picked way down the line ). I have no idea where Dore' fit into the pecking order on the Rangers scouting staff, but I sure hope he wasn't the guy in charge in 2018 and 19.

[NWTHabsFan]

Feb 16, 2022 14:40:24 GMT -5 seventeen said:

NWT, What do you think of Kravtsov? Have you seen him play lately at all. His stats in the KHL this year aren't overhwelming and he's 22, so is he good enough to trade for? I'm seeing small red flags over him.

Also, Rangers scouting, as I've mentioned before, hasn't been great. They chose Kakko, who is still only 21, but man, he's not progressing well and I don't think he was a consensus #2 after Jack Hughes. They passed up Dach, Byram, Seider, Zegras and a slew of other guys around that tier in a fairly deep draft. There's been some turnover in the Ranger's scouting department. Drafting wasn't bad at one point, then there were 4 years in a row without a first round pick and no hits on players (in 2013, strangely enough, they picked Buchnevich and Duclair in Round 3 and Ryan Graves in Round 4). The next 3 years after that, only Shesterkin (in Round 4 made it, though they didn't have many high picks). Another good goalie picked way down the line ). I have no idea where Dore' fit into the pecking order on the Rangers scouting staff, but I sure hope he wasn't the guy in charge in 2018 and 19.

If it was me, I would be trying to poach scouts from several other clubs ahead of the Rangers. I think their drafting record has been okay, nothing more. They do have some decent prospects, but who knows who they would even include in a trade.

You know they would move Kravtsov. I have not seen him play this year so cannot comment on how his game looks. I have read some positive reports, but his production does not scream “must have” to me. The size, speed and offensive talent was there. It is now a question of has it stagnated or can it still be resurrected at the NHL level.

[NWTHabsFan]

Twitter chatter suggesting Habs are in conversations with the Blues, Vegas and NYR. Vegas is very light on high picks over the next two years (Eichel trade, etc.) and the Blues are light on prospects. Any deals there likely would have to be a bit more creative. Vegas would also have to shed cap space (now that they have Kucheroved Stone onto the LTIR), so either retention by the Habs (for more assets) or a dump back (again hopefully with a sweetener asset) would further complicate a deal there. They are definitely a team that won’t shy away from making moves to go for it though. Fun times. Hughes must be loving this.

[seventeen]

Florida, Tampa, Carolina, Blues, Vegas, Calgary, Leafs, Pens and maybe one or two others (if they get lucky) have a legitimate chance at Stanley. It's a lot of teams looking for that Butch Goring (youngsters may not get that analogy. Hockeydb him and check out the timing of his trade).

That sets up an auction scenario, which Hughes has to love. *avoids commenting on the possible players involved*

[NWTHabsFan]

Feb 17, 2022 14:02:38 GMT -5 seventeen said:

Florida, Tampa, Carolina, Blues, Vegas, Calgary, Leafs, Pens and maybe one or two others (if they get lucky) have a legitimate chance at Stanley. It's a lot of teams looking for that Butch Goring (youngsters may not get that analogy. Hockeydb him and check out the timing of his trade).

That sets up an auction scenario, which Hughes has to love. *avoids commenting on the possible players involved*

That snaps helmet. Classic.

[Willie Dog]

Feb 17, 2022 14:20:23 GMT -5 NWTHabsFan said:

Feb 17, 2022 14:02:38 GMT -5 seventeen said:

Florida, Tampa, Carolina, Blues, Vegas, Calgary, Leafs, Pens and maybe one or two others (if they get lucky) have a legitimate chance at Stanley. It's a lot of teams looking for that Butch Goring (youngsters may not get that analogy. Hockeydb him and check out the timing of his trade).

That sets up an auction scenario, which Hughes has to love. *avoids commenting on the possible players involved*

That snaps helmet. Classic.

larry-fisher.com/2014/03/04/blast-from-the-past-revisiting-the-1980-trade-deadline/

[NWTHabsFan]

Others here have mentioned the Leafs as a possible suitor for Chiarot. They make a lot of sense. They have draft picks (just their 1st and 2nd this year, and loads next year). They have good prospects that I like. They draft skilled guys that would likely tick the boxes for Horton. And Dubas has to be desperate to win a playoff series for once.

It is just the thought of helping the Leafs get tougher and improve for even one playoff run makes me cringe a bit.

Oh, they would have to create cap space or dump somebody on the Habs with a sweetener asset.

[seventeen]

I rag on Chiarot but most of the problem lies in him being used in top situations when he isn't that guy. Put him on the 3rd pair, with the slim possibility of helping out the 2nd pair if injuries take place and he could be a key piece. He can handle 3rd pair and PK stuff. If Muzzin gets hurt, Chiarot is not the worst replacement.

[Willie Dog]

Come on Hughes... Fleece the Leafs... Fleece the Leafs...

Tell Dubas the Bruins want Chiarot...